<Spoilers for Investigator Info> Wanted to say thank you to FFG for pushing towards being more inclusive

By Soakman, in General Discussion

Was really excited to finally see an acknowledged lesbian and gay man in the roster. So, thank you FFG for Calvin Wright and Daniela Reyes. I'm not sure if this is a fact that we had already known about Calvin, but I don't believe so. I wasn't around when he was added as promo material for Arkham Horror.

Thanks for pushing your boundaries and considering the diversity of your players.

Edited by Soakman

I would really prefer to learn this from their personal stories and not from a summary in your post. Silly me, I need to thread the threads more carefully.
If you could include a [Spoiler for personal stories] in a similar situation in the future I would be grateful.

Will do. Sorry Tsuma. I didn't stop to think of it that way as it is only briefly mentioned and not a large chunk or summation of their story. I will add it to the topic title. Again, my apologies. :(

2 hours ago, Soakman said:

Will do. Sorry Tsuma. I didn't stop to think of it that way as it is only briefly mentioned and not a large chunk or summation of their story. I will add it to the topic title. Again, my apologies. :(

This happens sometimes. Don't worry to much. :)

I don't know anything about Calvin as I never had a chance to play him. I do want to point out that it is entirely possible that he's bisexual. Monogamous bisexuals are often mistaken for straight or gay depending on who they have committed to when it's not really an actual indicator of identity. Or maybe this is Calvin Wright Jr.

That being said, I don't see a problem, and just because there have been 7 expansions without a gay character doesn't mean there shouldn't be. That's a very bad argument. But I'm not going to get into a debate over this because the 'unnatural lifestyle' comment has told me all I need to know about how this conversation would go and end. Let's just agree to disagree.

Edited by Soakman
11 hours ago, Randymd said:

Calvin Wright is supposed to be a family man who’s married to a woman named Ella. He comes to Arkham searching for a way to find and save his wife.

To to add new gay characters is one thing, but did they have to change an existing character’s story to make him gay? Did he lose so much sanity that he forgot about his wife and child and ran away with another dude named Joao?

I agree that character's backstory should be consistent.

7 hours ago, Soakman said:

Monogamous bisexuals are often mistaken for straight or gay depending on who they have committed to when it's not really an actual indicator of identity.

EH calls Joao the love of Calvin's life. AH doesn't mention (at least not in the linked document) if he loved Ella but they had a child and he cared enough for them that he wanted to save them.
It's certainly possible that Ella is already saved and is fine with Calvin's relation with Joao. Or that Calvin has moved on after the loss of his family. There are several other possible scenarios but I think that EH's backstory should at least mention that he had/has a family. "Move on" is not the same as "forget".

7 hours ago, Soakman said:

Or maybe this is Calvin Wright Jr.

Of all the possible explanations this one seems farfetched. It would mean that one character from Arkham Horror wasn't revisited but in their place we got a different individual of the same name. Why would FFG do that?

For me all the characters can be gay, I don't mind. But I would be happy if Calvin's EH story would be more connected to his AH story.
Just came to my mind: I also think it could be better from the inclusiveness point of view. From what I see/hear homosexuals are getting much more exposure and acceptance than bisexuals. I've heard from several bi people that the bisexuals are pretty often shunned both by heterosexuals and homosexuals alike.

Edited by tsuma534

Very true Tsuma. I agree with you on nearly all points. The only reason I brought up the possibility that it is his son is because I don't have a good indicator of how old Calvin was or how old his son was other than a few investigator/ally pictures that have weird lighting.

My first thought when trying to figure out if it was Calvin before the name was leaked was "It can't be. They don't even look the same really." But I blew up the leaked photo I had seen and, lo and behold, the name was right there.

I don't think we're going to get an answer to this outside of a Novella unless a designer chimes in. The material in the expansion does not make it clear at all short of Joao being the love of his life, which sort of conflicts with the Ella/son idea that was going on in AH. I'm all for bi awareness and I'm pretty sure EH takes place a couple years after AH even if they are not necessarily coexisting as stories (or I could be remembering). It's possible they were both important relationships to the character. Or, heck, we've had portal through time and space before, this could just be an alternate Calvin.

Do you know if Calvin's wife survives the Arkham League stuff if you win? I have never played through it.

Edited by Soakman

Examples of images, none of which look a lot alike; possibly the first two could be the same guy, but the last one is the one from EH:

Capture.JPG

download.jpg

images.jpg

Edited by Soakman
1 hour ago, Soakman said:

Do you know if Calvin's wife survives the Arkham League stuff if you win? I have never played through it.

Before Randymd's post I've only seen his gameplay materials and none of the fluff. On some cards he's a protagonist on some he's an antagonist. The idea of alternate reality Calvin isn't completely implausible. The "old" one could be dead. Or maybe he's reincarnated as a part of his damnation? I'm very disappointed that he wasn't featured in the investigators of Arkham Horror. I think FFG has troubles with deciding whether he is a part of "canon" or not.

50 minutes ago, tsuma534 said:

Before Randymd's post I've only seen his gameplay materials and none of the fluff. On some cards he's a protagonist on some he's an antagonist. The idea of alternate reality Calvin isn't completely implausible. The "old" one could be dead. Or maybe he's reincarnated as a part of his damnation? I'm very disappointed that he wasn't featured in the investigators of Arkham Horror. I think FFG has troubles with deciding whether he is a part of "canon" or not.

There's no backstory on Calvin's AH sheet. There was text for each scenario is the league he was given out for that mentioned he was looking for his daughter Ella, but I don't think that it mentioned specifically that he had a wife (it mentions he had a 'family' which most would assume meant a wife, but it's not explicitly stated. Splitting hairs, I know, but still...).

Regardless, as you said, FFG never could seem to pin down whether he was an "official" character or part of the Arkham Files "canon". I think the changes made to him (both in appearance and potentially backstory and orientation) establishes pretty clearly that his earlier appearance and backstory in AH was non-canonical.

Edited by KBlumhardt
14 hours ago, Soakman said:

But I'm not going to get into a debate over this because the 'unnatural lifestyle' comment has told me all I need to know about how this conversation would go and end. Let's just agree to disagree.

You made it that far?

Typically as soon as someone starts raving about imaginary "agendas" I tune out. ;)

Edited by KBlumhardt
11 hours ago, KBlumhardt said:

There's no backstory on Calvin's AH sheet. There was text for each scenario is the league he was given out for that mentioned he was looking for his daughter Ella, but I don't think that it mentioned specifically that he had a wife (it mentions he had a 'family' which most would assume meant a wife, but it's not explicitly stated. Splitting hairs, I know, but still...).

Regardless, as you said, FFG never could seem to pin down whether he was an "official" character or part of the Arkham Files "canon". I think the changes made to him (both in appearance and potentially backstory and orientation) establishes pretty clearly that his earlier appearance and backstory in AH was non-canonical.

If you read the stories for the scenarios, one of them explicitly calls Ella his wife and also mentions he has a son.

You can read them here: http://www.arkhamhorrorwiki.com/Arkham_League_Session_2

Part 10 End Game for sure calls her his wife. There is no Joao anywhere in his story.

How could he not be canon if he was created by FFG? This is not some fan made character, he was created by the company. Why would all of the other characters’ stories match up across games except his? Face it, FFG straight up changed his story. And for what reason? So they could add a gay character? How do they expect us to invest in their characters if they don’t themselves.

Whoops... guess I remembered Calvin's story even less clearly than I remembered. Like I said... 9 years is a long time. ^_^

3 hours ago, Randymd said:

How could he not be canon if he was created by FFG? This is not some fan made character, he was created by the company. Why would all of the other characters’ stories match up across games except his?

He was created for a single limited event and used by a relatively small number of people, and then not mentioned again for almost 10 years, other than having an ally of the same name in Elder Sign. Pretty much no one ever expected to see him show up again as an investigator in any of the modern games. So, why would he necessarily have to officially be part of the canon? The older Arkham Horror novels were also published by FFG and featured characters such as Rita, Pete, and Mandy, and are almost certainly not in-canon (there are definite contradictions even between those books, the Investigators of Arkham stories, and the in-game text) and those were MUCH more "public" than Calvin's sheet ever was.

Edited by KBlumhardt

Don't agree with adding this.

Edited by crow-flash
9 hours ago, crow-flash said:

Don't agree with adding this.

That's fine (I assume you mean GLBT people in general). But to be fair, I could just as equally say that I don't agree with adding a Priest to the game. But being that I prefer diversity, that's not an issue for me. I'd rather see more options than less.

23 hours ago, Soakman said:

That's fine (I assume you mean GLBT people in general). But to be fair, I could just as equally say that I don't agree with adding a Priest to the game. But being that I prefer diversity, that's not an issue for me. I'd rather see more options than less.

Mateo is awesome at this game. He's one of the few ways to get rid of Corruption spells.

33 minutes ago, Matt620 said:

Mateo is awesome at this game. He's one of the few ways to get rid of Corruption spells.

I don't disagree. Each investigator has their strengths. And that's not the point.

Mateo does suffer from a lack of good starting items though to set him up to be able to get to gates. His ability only kicks in if he can close one, which is hard when they are guarded.

Edited by Soakman
2 hours ago, Soakman said:

I don't disagree. Each investigator has their strengths. And that's not the point.

Mateo does suffer from a lack of good starting items though to set him up to be able to get to gates. His ability only kicks in if he can close one, which is hard when they are guarded.

How many are truly good with only their starting equipment? You're being a little hard on him, I think.

3 hours ago, Matt620 said:

How many are truly good with only their starting equipment? You're being a little hard on him, I think.

Don't get me wrong, his abilities are great, and his statline is terrific for what he's good at doing. The challenge is to make him capable enough to get to and through the gates he needs to close. Akachi and Luke close gates better. Maybe if you pair him with Patrice or Agatha who might be able to clear the entrance of the gate, things could go more smoothly, or if he happens to get a nice asset from the reserve in turn 1.

Agatha is awesome because of her starting equips. Sefina's greatly improves her natural abilities. Even Preston's makes him more capable in his area of expertise despite his poor stat line. I'm not saying Mateo is bad, and boons are amazing. The Bible is thematically sound, but it enhances his sanity which is not even a weakness for him to begin with.

I think it was important to cripple him via his starting equipment for balance reasons. You have to get him off the ground; and if you don't, he could easily have been replaced with someone more useful.

Just my opinion; and I love having these kinds of discussions, but this thread isn't really about Mateo. :)

Edited by Soakman