Finally got my copy of Genesys. Think I will try it out using a spy themed game. Lots of action and social encounters. Was and still am a big fan of Top Secret and Spycraft back in the day.

Cue the long drawn out intro action sequence then the familiar theme music.

Choose your next witticism carefully mouthymerc, it may be your last, the purpose of our two previous encounters is now very clear to me....

Do you expect me to roll?

No mouthmerc I expect you to lose

Nothing personal just couldn't resist the reference.

Or for a lighter spy/ crime investigation RPG, "go go gadget arms" Or "it was Alice Aquamarine in the conservatory with the Polyscias fruticosa".

Detective settings could also be fun - Columbo or Poirot for example, but they'd be hard to design.

Bond is cool but a loner. Thinking more IMF, Sneakers, A-Team or the Losers. And others I could probably bring up.

As for detective games, I just remember an article I read on designing adventures/modules. It was something along the lines of "The Rule of Three". Always have three ways (at least) for the group to move to the next clue/encounter, especially in an investigation scenario. Blatant clues are good when you are more action focused scenarios, but in detection ones you need to be more subtle. But don't forget the red herrings too.

Leverage would be good too.

7 hours ago, Daeglan said:

Leverage would be good too.

Yeah, I'd be leaning more toward heists than spy stories, but the two are neighbors anyway, and both are filled with doublecrosses and other dramatic reversals of fortune.

9 minutes ago, Dragonshadow said:

Yeah, I'd be leaning more toward heists than spy stories, but the two are neighbors anyway, and both are filled with doublecrosses and other dramatic reversals of fortune.

The best way to do this is to let players come up with plans after the fact, in the middle of the heist, and then roll ("I hacked the security cameras and looped a false image before we left"). GUMSHOE has a skill called Preparedness, which lets you come up with things you need on the spot; it would work fantastic with Genesys' mutlidimensional skill checks by adding complications with interesting rolls.

Then the players won't need to spend two hours planning for five minutes of game time.

I find its much better to listen to your players. If someone comes up with a brilliant reason why Lord Montague stole the diamond, why not make them right, rather than have them meet a brick wall.

Leverage and Hustle are good examples of a game set up around social encounters. Leverage used hacking much more than Hustle though. Heist movies like the Ocean's movies are great ensemble pieces that make good inspiration.

As to after the fact actions. That's where story points can come in. During the mission, triumphs and despair can be used to change things as well. The multi-axis results play well into encounters where the ebb and flow of luck can change for the characters.

Some groups enjoy planning big theists or operations. Plus the work that goes into those planning stages. Gathering information, resources, what have you. The planning and final execution could be a great single or multiple session, depending on the group's immersion and enjoyment.

4 hours ago, mouthymerc said:

Leverage and Hustle are good examples of a game set up around social encounters. Leverage used hacking much more than Hustle though. Heist movies like the Ocean's movies are great ensemble pieces that make good inspiration.

As to after the fact actions. That's where story points can come in. During the mission, triumphs and despair can be used to change things as well. The multi-axis results play well into encounters where the ebb and flow of luck can change for the characters.

exactly. You can use some sort of flashback mechanic. Ohhh you rolled a despair so the guards are alerted. Flips story point. yeah be we planned for that and filled the guard shacks locks with crazy glue. Rolls stealth with a success. the guards are fighting to get out of the guard booth...

I would love to see Spycraft being converted but would think to go by the way of Edge and not Genesys since there is alot of Specializations for the Core Classes and would stick with 1.0 and not 2.0. Would also port over Shadowforce Archer setting. I would do Spycraft more than Top Secret as it is the updated version of Top Secret and you would get more gamers wanting Spycraft over Top Secret as well.

I have always enjoyed spy games. Played Top Secret in its various editions. Also played Spycraft (as well as worked on a few books). I will draw much from both Edge and Age for what I will need talent-wise as they both have many that will fit. I will be adapting the original departments rather than the 2.0 talent/specialties for archetypes initially as it is simpler and less work. More interested in getting some basics and trying it out.

I would help but I myself am involved with a conversion myself and am not wanting to get side tracked to much as I have others helping me with my conversion right now. But would support by looking over what you come up with...

I will probably post things as I put them together. I am running three different D&D games right now so this will take a back seat until I am closer to running it. Mostly just making notes here and there. Thanks.

Full on Spycraft, including Shadowforce Archer!

4 hours ago, Jeffrywith1e said:

Full on Spycraft, including Shadowforce Archer!

More just Spycraft without the mysticism.

I think it was in Spycraft 2.0 where they introduced the "Common Item" check where you made a Wisdom check to see if you had actually brought some (mostly) inconsequential piece of gear with you even if it wasn't explicitly written on your sheet. I absolutely love those kinds of 'your characters are BA and would know to do that' kind of mechanical safeguards.

Also, nice to see you from the Crafty forums! I'm excited to see what you come up with for GeneSpyCraftSys 2.5 (you can use that, I don't mind)

I would strongly recommend looking at the 1998 John Frankenheimer film Ronin when making a Genesys spy game. Despite some issues with tech obsolescene (thinking the character of Gregor having a tech role and being confined to the van with his computer; tablets and smartphones really change up that game) it's the best example of a modern RPG class/defined role party I can recall. Mission Impossible, as a vehicle for Tom Cruise's ongoing midlife crisis, is about 1 hero with support staff. Ronin, by contrast, has:

Wheelman - Larry

Fixer - Vincent

Tech - Gregor

Soldier - Spence

Face - Sam

I started working through a modern game which due to us having kids and limited time fell through, but we tried to go down the path of filling those "career" archetypes with the party.

CAREER TYPES:

Infiltrator

The infiltrator's job is to insinuate themselves into places and situations they don't belong. This means a combination of stealth and charm. They're the ones wearing black, or slightly darker black, tactical turtlenecks (tactlenecks) and infiltrating the villain's penthouse or the office of the shady swiss banker; or pretending to be an arms dealer from Ukraine.

Career skills: Stealth, Skulduggery, Streetwise, Athletics, Charm, Deception, Brawl, Coordination

Soldier

When you absolutely have to kill every last mother****er in the room, accept no substitues. From teeing up a shot at 1km out from the target to covering your teammates with an assault rifle as they pile into the car, the soldier's the combatant of the group.

Career skills: Ranged (Light), Ranged (Heavy), Brawl, Melee, Athletics, Coercion, Vigilance, Cool

Wheelman

Maybe a retired racer, or an aspiring racing/stunt driver who broods a lot in a scorpion jacket, who knows? Their origin is secondary to their insane ability behind the wheel (or similarly functional control apparatus) of a car, truck, Jeep, SUV, bike, plane, hovercraft, boat, jetski, and airboat.

Career skills: Piloting, Mechanics, Driving, Streetwise, Vigilance, Perception, Cool, Brawl

Fixer

"I know a guy who can get this for us. Won't be a problem." The Fixer knows people who know people, and those people? They know people. The Fixer is a quartermaster, scout, tour guide, cultural attache and walking Michelin guide to local restaurants.

Career skills: Charm, Persuasion, Negotiation, Streetwise, Deception, Coercion, Skulduggery, Knowledge

Greyhat

The team's hacker and computers whizkid, they utilise the latest in smart, mobile technology; all sorts of drones, and ubiquitous wi-fi to gain access to places and information that the rest of the team, with their knowledge of lockpicks, collarbone-shattering techniques, and guns simply can't.

Career skills: Computers, Skulduggery, Operating, Perception, Mechanics, Vigilance, Knowledge, Discipline

Analyst

The team's font of knowledge, and often backup medic because there's no clerics in modern. The analyst makes sense of the intel and mission, and provides the team with valuable insights to enable them to better achieve mission objectives.

Career skills: Knowledge, Vigilance, Skulduggery, Streetwise, Computers, Perception, Leadership, Discipline

Pointman

The team leader. A combination of a bit of everyone, they're there to help lead the team in the direction it should go. Their ability to lead is in part based on their personality; but it's also heavily dependent on their competence and experience. Someone who, if in the field, is as useful as anyone else. Think of the roles that Rhona Mitra and Robson Green played in Strike Back .

Career skills: Leadership, Negotiation, Brawl, Ranged (light), Driving, Stealth, Athletics, Discipline

1 hour ago, Foghorn said:

I think it was in Spycraft 2.0 where they introduced the "Common Item" check where you made a Wisdom check to see if you had actually brought some (mostly) inconsequential piece of gear with you even if it wasn't explicitly written on your sheet. I absolutely love those kinds of 'your characters are BA and would know to do that' kind of mechanical safeguards.

Also, nice to see you from the Crafty forums! I'm excited to see what you come up with for GeneSpyCraftSys 2.5 (you can use that, I don't mind)

I've pretty much given up on 3rd Edition.

14 minutes ago, Endersai said:

I would strongly recommend looking at the 1998 John Frankenheimer film Ronin when making a Genesys spy game...[OTHER WORDS]

You had me at Ronin . Love that movie.

Ditto!

Ronin is definitely one that I have seen. Been a while though. Will have to dig it out and watch it again. Been a long time since I frequented the Crafty boards Foghorn. Good to see someone who recognizes me.

I am looking to keep things pretty simple initially. Going with the original departments for archetypes and the original six classes for careers. Brought in some additional talents to flesh out the ones already in the basic book. Looking forward to the AoR Spy book as I imagine it will have some interesting talents.

The generalized nature of many of the talents makes things easy. I will also stick to the more generalized nature of weapons in Spycraft 1.0 rather than the the more specific of 2.0. I will, though, borrow more from 2.0 for the social encounters like Interrogation and Seduction. Chases will be big too. All of these will tend to be competitive checks.

Once I get these basics down I will see how it goes and will expand from there as needed. That's my plan anyways.

As much as I loved the granularity of Spycraft 2.0, Genesys definitely leans itself towards the "less is more" model, especially in the weapon department.

I have been salivating over that Spy book for AoR FOREVER. I definitely look forward to see what you can mine out of that for this.

As always, MOAR CHASES.

@mouthymerc

I stole shamelessly from the gunpowder weapons that @KingNova3000 put in his sci-fi armoury. Saves the wheel being re-invented.

I also did up some vehicles that you might be able to use.