Hi guys! I've got 2 base box worth of daqan pieces, and i'll soon buy Lord Hawthorne and a pair of crossbowman boxes.

I was exploring what i can do with the Hawthorne ability (Lessons of Seragart), so i came up with this list:

Lord Hawthorne x1 [34]
--Unique: Might of Daqan [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 38

Oathsworn Cavalry x4 [34]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
--Heraldry: Bull Pennon [3]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 44

Heavy Crossbowmen x3 [27]
--Equipment: Fire Rune [7]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 38

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Lance Corporal [6]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
--Music: Marching Cornicen [2]
----------Total Unit Cost: 41

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Lance Corporal [6]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
----------Total Unit Cost: 39

Are those 2 spearmen units worth renuncing the 9 trays standard with front line rune golems?

And if it was this the case, is this slitghly different list better? (it changes the second unit of spearmen, the rest is the same).

Lord Hawthorne x1 [34]
--Unique: Might of Daqan [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 38

Oathsworn Cavalry x4 [34]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
--Heraldry: Bull Pennon [3]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 44

Heavy Crossbowmen x3 [27]
--Equipment: Fire Rune [7]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 38

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Lance Corporal [6]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
----------Total Unit Cost: 39

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Dispatch Runner [7]
--Music: Rallying Cornicen [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 41

I wish I had much to say about this. I *do* really like the 4x1 Cav and 3x1 Xbows. They're good units. I haven't tried running smaller spearmen units before, so I'm not sure how good that will be? The upgrades look solid though.

I am wondering if you want to run Tempered Steel on your crossbows instead of fire rune. You'll likely get more damage from it, and the attack - march 1 combo can be *really* nice (meaning you won't pick the skill modifier)

Agreed on Tempered Steel for Crossbows. The surge on the dial makes it a sure thing, and means they're OFTEN putting out 9 damage per volley. Scary stuff.

The 4x1 cav does terrifying damage, but I've had some bad experiences with it. A frontage 4 wide is very unwieldy, so make sure you deploy terrain with it in mind: your opponent will probably use their terrain deployment to block off a large portion of the board, so use yours to create some sensible lanes. It's all too easy to end up with only one place you could reasonably put your cav, then your opponent can really easily deploy counters. They don't want to take ANY damage, because they're fragile as ever and every tray costs them threat. They are of course a buzzsaw though, and probably worth including a Dispatch Runner. Also, spend some time playing with the movement templates: they can charge further with a 3-turn than with a 4-straight, if the layout is right.

I strongly advocate for a Shield of Margath on Hawthorne. It gives him INSANE attrition game, though wounds ignoring defense do of course shut him down. Still, it makes him a serious question that must be answered. Recommend cutting the Tempered Steel from the Spearmen: you don't have a GREAT chance of rolling a surge, and it's only an extra two damage.

I quite like the Dispatch Runner and Rallying Cornicen, but you might want to split the upgrades up? There's a very real chance you'll want to use both on the same turn. Note that with Hawthorne, you can take a 1x2 Spearmen with Rallying Cornicen - adding the extra rank makes the horn much harder to remove. It's a decent support unit/blocker - if it increases defense it takes 16 damage to wipe out which ain't bad.

I'm not quite sure where I'm at with Spearmen units. The 3x3 with golem is a bit expensive and fragile for my taste (and with Uthuk specializing in panic stuff it's even more so) so I was trying to make a 3x2 work, to mixed success. 2x2's really don't impress me from a damage standpoint, but maybe there's something there. By all means, let us know how it plays!

My only experience with 2x2 Spearmen was when I brought them with my Ankaur Maro to fight for Waiqar. They were awesome. The lower initiatives than Reanimates allowed them to close distance with an opposing 4x1 of Deepwood Archers and demolish them. They couldn't quite hack it against Lord Hawthorne, though. Not enough threat.

@Bhelliom thanks mate, REALLY good suggestion here!! With those suggestions i've modified to this:

Lord Hawthorne x1 [34]
--Artifact: Shield of Margath [6]
--Unique: Might of Daqan [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 44

Oathsworn Cavalry x4 [34]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
--Heraldry: Bull Pennon [3]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 44

Heavy Crossbowmen x3 [27]
--Equipment: Tempered Steel [3]
--Training: Rank Discipline [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 34

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Dispatch Runner [7]
----------Total Unit Cost: 37

Spearmen x4 [30]
--Champion: Lance Corporal [6]
--Music: Rallying Cornicen [4]
----------Total Unit Cost: 40

i've tried fitting 2 units of 1x2 spearmen like you said, but i had too few points :C so i choose to stay with the two 4x1 spearmen for now. I see the unwieldy problems, but haven't still try it i want to see how bad it is, so for now i'm gonna experiment with the 4x1 stuff. For the shield of margathing it seem a really good choice, but i often play against waiqar and i'm afraid of Death grasp and other meany things :C

I don't know when i will play this list, i hope soon, but i will report surely the results

(sorry for the bad english)

@porkobolo I know exactly how you feel! Nine times out of ten I have to change the unit configurations I like best to fit in that 200pts. It's a challenge!

Hawthorne absolutely has to avoid Death Knights and Carrion Lancers. Put him up against a block of Reanimates of pretty much any size (as long as it doesn't have Executioner or Mistlands Saboteur!) and he'll hold his own, but against anything that ignores his Defense he goes down just like any hero. So satisfying when an enemy unit attacks, causes no damage, and loses a tray for its trouble though. At a certain point they just stop trying and flee

Look forward to hearing about your games!

Had a fun one last night

2x3 oathsworn, embed hawthorne, visored helms, column tactics

2-3*1 crossbows with rank discipline

Kari w/Fortunas

A golem

Think that's right. Highlight of the game, lancer charged side of oaths engaged with ardus. Oaths swing, obliterate ardus (12), then obliterate the lancer (9 -1RKO) due to hawthornes ability. He's a solid upgrade, albeit expensive.

And those crossbows, do they ever rip.

14 hours ago, Bhelliom said:

@porkobolo I know exactly how you feel! Nine times out of ten I have to change the unit configurations I like best to fit in that 200pts. It's a challenge!

Hawthorne absolutely has to avoid Death Knights and Carrion Lancers. Put him up against a block of Reanimates of pretty much any size (as long as it doesn't have Executioner or Mistlands Saboteur!) and he'll hold his own, but against anything that ignores his Defense he goes down just like any hero. So satisfying when an enemy unit attacks, causes no damage, and loses a tray for its trouble though. At a certain point they just stop trying and flee

Look forward to hearing about your games!

my problem here is that you've just nominated like 90% of the army of my opponent

14 hours ago, Darthain said:

Had a fun one last night

2x3 oathsworn, embed hawthorne, visored helms, column tactics

2-3*1 crossbows with rank discipline

Kari w/Fortunas

A golem

Think that's right. Highlight of the game, lancer charged side of oaths engaged with ardus. Oaths swing, obliterate ardus (12), then obliterate the lancer (9 -1RKO) due to hawthornes ability. He's a solid upgrade, albeit expensive.

And those crossbows, do they ever rip.

that unit is interesting, thank you for sharing!!