30 minutes ago, Ablazoned said:

I'm just comparing among the hwks themselves. Kyle can get focus lock and *one* token per turn, but palob can get focus/focus/lock/evade and then *two* tokens per turn. Palob is laughably better than Kyle.

While agree that Palob is best hwk around I must point that his superior action economy can be easily countered by specific play (not taking focuses but TL instead). This is still his ability working tho - by making enemy to play suboptimaly.

I am afraid that FFG during January points adjustment will kill all the Hwks by rising Moldy Crow too much, instead addressing each pilot directly.

18 minutes ago, Oldpara said:

I am afraid that FFG during January points adjustment will kill all the Hwks by rising Moldy Crow too much, instead addressing each pilot directly. 

IMO, ideally they would slightly rise Moldy Crow, then decrease every hwk pilot by the same, THEN individually increase the costs of the best unique pilots by different amounts.

19 hours ago, RStan said:

I'm not sure if I'd call the current Scum meta pieces part of the "balance that makes a healthy meta."

Scum brings the most Ace control pieces to the table. If palob, quadjumpers, and 4LOM weren't around, Ace wing would likely get worse.

Not exactly healthy, getting slowly ****** by [insert Ace] because I brought low i stuff ain't exactly either.

1 hour ago, Ablazoned said:

IMO, ideally they would slightly rise Moldy Crow, then decrease every hwk pilot by the same, THEN individually increase the costs of the best unique pilots by different amounts.

I kinda think most HWKs are fairly priced without title. 32 is fair for the generic, with a 2-dice turret built in. If the title was banned in some local event, there's a pretty good chance that Palob would be worth squeezing into a list for 38 points.

Personally, I'd send the title up 2 points, send Palob Godalhi and maybe Roark Garnet up 2 points, and wait on the next iteration.

That depends on my preference of not adjusting almost any price by more than 2 points, except like Han Gunner and the E-Wing. Maybe Moldy Crow fits that exceptions list, but non-Crow HWK probably don't need a cut.

I still think Hwk's are more of a symptom of other abusive mechanics in their list than an actual problem themselves. Boba, Proton Kavil, Guri, a couple tug boats. Whatever. There's enough other threatening things on the board that the Hwk can successfully troll you.

3 hours ago, Oldpara said:

While agree that Palob is best hwk around I must point that his superior action economy can be easily countered by specific play (not taking focuses but TL instead). This is still his ability working tho - by making enemy to play suboptimaly.

I am afraid that FFG during January points adjustment will kill all the Hwks by rising Moldy Crow too much, instead addressing each pilot directly.

12 minutes ago, viedit said:

I still think Hwk's are more of a symptom of other abusive mechanics in their list than an actual problem themselves. Boba, Proton Kavil, Guri, a couple tug boats. Whatever. There's enough other threatening things on the board that the Hwk can successfully troll you.

HWKs are so comically above the power curve compared to almost anything else in the game. Even a spice runner with the title is 44 points - 3 more points than an X-Wing.

For that, you pick up: 2 die mobile arc, boost, jam, and 2 banked focus tokens for when the game actually starts, in exchange for trading a kturn for a stop and losing a hull.

Palob + title is currently 50 points. That's a (resistance) black sun ace, which is reasonably priced. These things are so comically out of line you could probably +10 palob and he'd still be roughly power-curve appropriate.

23 minutes ago, viedit said:

I still think Hwk's are more of a symptom of other abusive mechanics in their list than an actual problem themselves. Boba, Proton Kavil, Guri, a couple tug boats. Whatever. There's enough other threatening things on the board that the Hwk can successfully troll you.

Palob together with Asajj make for a nasty pair... Which one is the crutch? That HWK is solid.

13 minutes ago, Brunas said:

HWKs are so comically above the power curve compared to almost anything else in the game. Even a spice runner with the title is 44 points - 3 more points than an X-Wing.

For that, you pick up: 2 die mobile arc, boost, jam, and 2 banked focus tokens for when the game actually starts, in exchange for trading a kturn for a stop and losing a hull.

Palob + title is currently 50 points. That's a (resistance) black sun ace, which is reasonably priced. These things are so comically out of line you could probably +10 palob and he'd still be roughly power-curve appropriate.

Compared to what? The 2 dice primary is being overlooked here I think. Mobile or not it's 2 dice. I'm not talking about moldy crow. Just the base ship.

Non moldy hwks aren't good. Not compared to bombers or ties or really anything else around 28-34 pt range. I wish they were but I've tried a bare spice runner. It sucked. That's the problem.. hwks are only good with title or maaybe certain pilots bare.

Just throwing that in here: I'm currently adding the French nationals to listfortress, because the already entered tournament was beyond salvaging

I will do up to 32 today, and then fill in the rest when I have time. If anyone wants to help: I'm using firstearth's page as source

https://listfortress.com/tournaments/192

https://firstearth.github.io/france

4 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Just throwing that in here: I'm currently adding the French nationals to listfortress, because the already entered tournament was beyond salvaging

I will do up to 32 today, and then fill in the rest when I have time. If anyone wants to help: I'm using firstearth's page as source

https://listfortress.com/tournaments/192

https://firstearth.github.io/france

Btw, anyone knows how to report bug in List Fortress? There is no way to report anything.

I tired to add Polish SoS into List Fortress, but I get "error" after completing top16 and there's nothing I can do about it.

Alright, I finished the cut (top32)e: and up to 40. There are 128 120 left, so if everyone here could do just 2 or so I would be very grateful already

57 minutes ago, Oldpara said:

Btw, anyone knows how to report bug in List Fortress? There is no way to report anything.

I tired to add Polish SoS into List Fortress, but I get "error" after completing top16 and there's nothing I can do about it.

No, sorry. I only know that you could message /u/antigrapist as he is the mastermind behind it now. Message him on reddit, or open an issue on github. Messaging first is probably better.

3 hours ago, Brunas said:

HWKs are so comically above the power curve compared to almost anything else in the game. Even a spice runner with the title is 44 points - 3 more points than an X-Wing.

For that, you pick up: 2 die mobile arc, boost, jam, and 2 banked focus tokens for when the game actually starts, in exchange for trading a kturn for a stop and losing a hull.

Palob + title is currently 50 points. That's a (resistance) black sun ace, which is reasonably priced. These things are so comically out of line you could probably +10 palob and he'd still be roughly power-curve appropriate.

I don't disagree that it's a stupidity efficient platform. It's just that it's usually got another equally efficient and much more hurty platform along with it that you need to deal with too.

It's still 5 health behind 2 agility at initiative 3. Torpedoes paste it in no time if you want it dead.

3 hours ago, LagJanson said:

Palob together with Asajj make for a nasty pair... Which one is the crutch? That HWK is solid.

I've never seen a wild Asajj make an appearance in 2.0.

30 minutes ago, viedit said:

I've never seen a wild Asajj make an appearance in 2.0.

Still in controlled environmental testing here. I enjoyed it, but wouldn’t be comfortable judging if she’s any good yet.

Yeah the problem with her is that at her price, you probably are just better off with Boba. Better init and more room to work with the chassis. Her ability costing a force and then reduced damage of the mobile Arc. Plus no access to boost any more. She is in a weird spot.

1 hour ago, viedit said:

Yeah the problem with her is that at her price, you probably are just better off with Boba. Better init and more room to work with the chassis. Her ability costing a force and then reduced damage of the mobile Arc. Plus no access to boost any more. She is in a weird spot.

Is it worth taking both? Could she just be a hammer? She gets easy fully modded shots.

8 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

Is it worth taking both? Could she just be a hammer? She gets easy fully modded shots.

I'm not sure about 2 ship lists without some crazy shooty shenanigans or some hyper repositioning ability. You are only getting two shots out of the list per turn.

Edit: the title is nice, but you want to be shooting before Boba to maximize it.

She probably works better with some other stuff that can abuse the tractor mechanic. Could she have a place in a mining guild swarm as the queen bee?

Asajj... I just don't know.

I might get Ketsu on the table sometime. Now that's a hammer. Ketsu with Fearless, Maul, and Title is going to be some serious kick-down-the-front-door; 3.5 average hits against reduced agility without actions, and it'd work on a bump/ram. Might be squishy for 96 points. Almost surely won't be top-tables-large-tournaments, but seems like fun. Add Boba or Guri to taste, to capitalize on the tractor, since Ketsu has the initiative to make it work.

//

Also, go see Spider-Verse. Legit might be the best movie of the year. Not just animated, not just superhero. I gotta think on it, but I love it.

5 hours ago, Oldpara said:

Btw, anyone knows how to report bug in List Fortress? There is no way to report anything.

I tired to add Polish SoS into List Fortress, but I get "error" after completing top16 and there's nothing I can do about it.

I'd open an issue here: https://github.com/AlexRaubach/ListFortress/issues

Or PM @Antigrapist if you aren't comfortable with github!

5 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

Just throwing that in here: I'm currently adding the French nationals to listfortress, because the already entered tournament was beyond salvaging

I will do up to 32 today, and then fill in the rest when I have time. If anyone wants to help: I'm using firstearth's page as source

https://listfortress.com/tournaments/192

https://firstearth.github.io/france

I didn't realize we had ANY french lists! I'll try to help out when I can next week, if you need it.

6 hours ago, Carnor Rex said:

Compared to what? The 2 dice primary is being overlooked here I think. Mobile or not it's 2 dice. I'm not talking about moldy crow. Just the base ship.

Non moldy hwks aren't good. Not compared to bombers or ties or really anything else around 28-34 pt range. I wish they were but I've tried a bare spice runner. It sucked. That's the problem.. hwks are only good with title or maaybe certain pilots bare.

I agree that moldy crow is cheaper than it's price, but I'm not sure the naked hwk is too expensive either. A little cheaper than an Attack Shuttle, but more health and better actions with a (less damage) turret?

15 hours ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:

I am super tempted to run 5 with AO/Crack and Heroic or Trick Shot.

I approve of this message...

6 hours ago, RStan said:

I approve of this message...

Approve harder, just ordered 4 more. Will try it with one as Lulo since I only have four copies of AO.

I'm not sure exactly what it is, but the "squad shots" of 5 different colored A-wings just warms the cockles of my heart. Maybe even the sub-cockles.

On 12/13/2018 at 9:06 AM, Brunas said:

@Alyx'sDog I try to keep the descriptions a decent indicator of whether there's anything worth listening to in there. If you see driving or no content, don't bother downloading it. There might be something xwing related in there, but it's probably more noise than anything.

Later today we should be putting out actual content (sorry, everyone else) that's useful and interesting.

With that being said, other people's suggestions are good, frankly the average xwing player is terrible at the game and it's easy to become the king of trash mountain locally. We're also trying to put out some "How to actually practice and learn things" videos soon™, but as always soon™ is whenever we get around to actually doing it.

Thanks for the help, that episode was great!

I've been flying 3 TIEs, 2 Strikers/Interceptors, and a Lambda, and that's been going pretty well for me. I guess I could try switching to 6 TIEs, or 5 named ones, but I really like the ability to turn 135 degrees in one round.

On the other hand, correlation certainly isn't causation, and point changes to Boba will likely dictate what I should do with my list.

18 minutes ago, Alyx'sDog said:

Thanks for the help, that episode was great!

I've been flying 3 TIEs, 2 Strikers/Interceptors, and a Lambda, and that's been going pretty well for me. I guess I could try switching to 6 TIEs, or 5 named ones, but I really like the ability to turn 135 degrees in one round.

On the other hand, correlation certainly isn't causation, and point changes to Boba will likely dictate what I should do with my list.

Lower Initiative massed firepower lists aren't necessarily hard to run, but a lot players don't see the full potential on either side of the list. This translates to opponents who tend to wander into your collection of arcs and just get ripped to bits. A lot of players at the casual/kitchen table level like paying for more expensive ships with lots of fun rules, but don't really make the most out of the abilities they pay for. If you like the efficiency squad I'd stick with it. The ships involved aren't likely to get more expensive, and it's a great way to learn the game without all the tricks available to squads that rely more heavily on upgrades. I'm biased, though.

As you encounter players that take tournament preparation more seriously, you'll notice that you get a lot fewer good shots, and a lot more good shots coming bsck at you, as they're much more competetent in moving to focus fire on one target and can protect their ships from high quality uncontested shots.

You may also find your locals are much better than you initially thought, as most people won't bring out their hardest squads for the new player earning the ropes. They may also be playing in a relaxed and carefree manner for the same reason. Usually the players that care super-hard about winning on casual game nights are not very good.

17 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

As you encounter players that take tournament preparation more seriously, you'll notice that you get a lot fewer good shots, and a lot more good shots coming bsck at you, as they're much more competetent in moving to focus fire on one target and can protect their ships from high quality uncontested shots. 

The biggest difference I see when playing against “good” players is that they force my list into awkward decisions. They might still take serious damage from my swarm of strikers but they trade more than just points in exchange. Uncontested doesnt always just mean trading key pieces or hit points or destroyed ships. Against higher level players “trading” often involves positioning advantage that effects the rest of the game in less obvious ways. Either forcing split fire over the next few turns via recycled targets or making the only option a K-turn or disengagement for a turn or two. Most embarrassingly it often involves me ending up in a bad partial joust I didnt even know I was signing up for the turn prior.

The games I have played against top tournament players always feel like they have a critical decision or two that I am forced to make which I didnt set up for myself. They operate inbetween aggressive and patient. Where the majority of Swiss is typically in one mode “all out offense gotta go fast gotta pew pew pew” or “gotta go slow wait things out then commit”. Both extremes are easier to react to and take advantage of than something in between. Certain lists are better than others at inhabiting that middle ground of tactical space.