1 minute ago, Biophysical said:

Is Vader + 3 Strikers the best Empire Hyperspace list?

It seems like it should be strong.

I'm not sure if tie swarm can be completely discounted in hyperspace either?

A chunky mix of reapers and strikers seems decent as well?

33 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

Is Vader + 3 Strikers the best Empire Hyperspace list?

It seems pretty good, yes.

Darth Vader (70)
Supernatural Reflexes (12)
Afterburners (8)

“Duchess” (42)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Total: 200

5 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Darth Vader (70)
Supernatural Reflexes (12)
Afterburners (8)

“Duchess” (42)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Total: 200

I would have been more hyped for the Wave 1 tournaments if I could have run that.

7 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Darth Vader (70)
Supernatural Reflexes (12)
Afterburners (8)

“Duchess” (42)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Total: 200

Vader's Flappybirds

Duchess is the easy mode Striker.

The fun in Strikers is having to do the Aileron moves when you really really dont want to. 😂

And finding the solution!

Also, Sabacc has been my fav ever since he came out in Wave 10? The extra red dice... 😍

58 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Darth Vader (70)
Supernatural Reflexes (12)
Afterburners (8)

“Duchess” (42)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Total: 200

Hyperspace when!!!!

1 hour ago, Biophysical said:

Is Vader + 3 Strikers the best Empire Hyperspace list?

WAMPA would like a word with you

31 minutes ago, catachanninja said:

WAMPA would like a word with you

I mean, Wampa gives you some nice point flexibility, butch he's not as good as a striker.

19 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

I mean, Wampa gives you some nice point flexibility, butch he's not as good as a striker.

is a striker better than wampa and FCS on vader?

2 hours ago, Brunas said:

Darth Vader (70)
Supernatural Reflexes (12)
Afterburners (8)

“Duchess” (42)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Planetary Sentinel (34)

Total: 200

If you drop Duchess to a 3rd Sentinel, you can get a couple Seismic Charges.

Any PAX peeps looking for dinner?

9 hours ago, Darth Seridur said:

Duchess is the easy mode Striker.

The fun in Strikers is having to do the Aileron moves when you really really dont want to. 😂

And finding the solution!

Also, Sabacc has been my fav ever since he came out in Wave 10? The extra red dice... 😍

Sabaacc is good, but I prefer *mini drum solo* THE FINAL COUNTDOWN! *dunh nah nuh

Extended: Broken format that only 3-4 ships in each faction are viable.

Hyperspace: Much more balanced with point changes on the way where there’s only 4-5 ships in each faction.

Why do people not like Hyperspace?

16 minutes ago, Quack Shot said:

Extended: Broken format that only 3-4 ships in each faction are viable.

Hyperspace: Much more balanced with point changes on the way where there’s only 4-5 ships in each faction.

Why do people not like Hyperspace?

medicine is bitter when you swallow it and the animal brain has a hard time understanding that it's better in the long run.

alternatively, people like broken stuff and learning to be better is hard.

11 hours ago, Darth Seridur said:

Duchess is the easy mode Striker.

The fun in Strikers is having to do the Aileron moves when you really really dont want to. 😂

And finding the solution!

Also, Sabacc has been my fav ever since he came out in Wave 10? The extra red dice... 😍

Duchess has two parts of the ability though, and sometimes I like the second more than the first. Most of the time I find myself aileroning anyway (at init 5, which is hilariously good) and doing it while stressed is real good.

also 5 crack shot strikers is a legit list, and you should probably look at it.

5 hours ago, Quack Shot said:

Extended: Broken format that only 3-4 ships in each faction are viable.

Hyperspace: Much more balanced with point changes on the way where there’s only 4-5 ships in each faction.

Why do people not like Hyperspace?

Because it didn't actually fix the problems with Extended. It just locked us in a room with boba and said "have fun".

The bannings for Hyperspace was done purely as an ease of purchase methodology, not balance derived.

Furthermore, people are saying that the point changes will fix Hyperspace: Those point changes have not happened, and the point costs in their new content (a month before they change points on the rest) are not indicative of them moving in a directionthatwill fix that: Force is cheaper drastically, as are turrets and high initiative, as well. The generic pilots are all additionally overcosted.

To continue, i do not believe FFG will actually address the root of the problem of Fat Boba: Boba himself. If Marauder Gunner is nerfed into oblivion, slave 1 still exists, and offers less counterplay. The general consensus appeared to be that Kylo is overpowered, but this boba still exists in Hyperspace and is the same cost as Supernat+Kylo. It also has Proton bombs because "**** Swarms i guess".

https://raithos.github.io/?f=Scum and Villainy&d=v5!s!103:133,-1,-1,43,69,-1,-1,161:U.-1&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

(Also they didn't ban trajectory simulator for some reason?)

Then, to further build on this:

4 hours ago, Do I need a Username said:

Also 5 crack shot strikers is a legit list, and you should probably look at it.

I have flown a lot of Strikers, and they lack the offensive mods that they would need to consistently alpha targets. I tried this exact same list last night: FennBobaLando is capable of killing 2 strikers before they shoot. When your supposed 'jousting list' jousts less effectively than a card-game-combo list, we have a problem. This happened in 1.0 as well with FSR2: eventually, card combos were tested and the most-efficient-jouster squad was developed, and surprise! It's all unique pilots of different ship types.

To elaborate on 5 striker with crack vs Hask 4 Crack sabers, while strikers are more maneuverable than interceptors, they are not as fast: this decrease in speed makes it drastically more difficult for them to force unplanned/unwanted engages, which makes them less able to remove ships early, which is the path to victory for such a list.

Hyperspace was a format that people were hyping up because it did not exist yet, so people were invisioning it to be the solution. People are now trying to believe that. The Jan points adjustments have not yet happened, so people are saying "Of course they will fix (problem card)!" When there is a very real probability that (problem card) will not be stopped or (Irrelevant card that they found fun) will be nerfed instead.

Hyperspace was Overhyped.

2 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

Hyperspace was Overhyped.

No.

we Literally don’t know the points changes, but it is absolutely easier to focus on points changes for fewest shipa than more ships.

any lack of faith you have in FFG on this point is format agnostic.

I'd suggest waiting until people actually play Hyperspace in a larger tournament format before Boba is declared the default winner and the Empire is dead.

I mean, we're either going to play in those format events or we're not. /shrug

Also, I don't believe any of you soon-to-be Kylo players.

22 minutes ago, Tlfj200 said:

No.

we Literally don’t know the points changes, but it is absolutely easier to focus on points changes for fewest shipa than more ships.

any lack of faith you have in FFG on this point is format agnostic.

I am format neutral I suppose, but the point is that the smaller pool has not yet proven itself to be better, and people are saying we are wrong for not saying hyperspace is the best **** ever.

The issues are that

>hyperspace is potentially easier to balance going forward, but at the moment is no better than extended. It may even be worse due to BigFishSmallPond **** with Mr. Fett.

>some people are attached to specific ships. As an example, i have a local who likes Starvipers. Not 'I fly a lot of guri', i mean "Double Black Sun Assassins+(something) is his main list and he's successful with it, and refuses to not use his customized fully moving starvipers in games". He gets told to **** off in hyperspace. There are people online who love Interceptors or B-wings i know.

31 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

(Also they didn't ban trajectory simulator for some reason?)

They made it Resistance Bomber exclusive, which The Forums™ told me was what it should've been all along, and who am I to doubt The Forums™?

2 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

I am format neutral I suppose, but the point is that the smaller pool has not yet proven itself to be better, and people are saying we are wrong for not saying hyperspace is the best **** ever.

>some people are attached to specific ships. As an example, i have a local who likes Starvipers. Not 'I fly a lot of guri', i mean "Double Black Sun Assassins+(something) is his main list and he's successful with it, and refuses to not use his customized fully moving starvipers in games". He gets told to **** off in hyperspace. There are people online who love Interceptors or B-wings i know.

The "I dislike hyperspace, but rather than play extended instead, I'm just quitting X-Wing" people ******** up the front page don't particularly help

8 minutes ago, gennataos said:

I'd suggest waiting until people actually play Hyperspace in a larger tournament format before Boba is declared the default winner and the Empire is dead.

Are there going to be any large hyperspace tournaments until March, or whenever the spring season is meant to start?

Poland didn't do hyperspace for the qualifier (because it didn't exist). Will PAX/Pheonix?

4 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

I am format neutral I suppose, but the point is that the smaller pool has not yet proven itself to be better, and people are saying we are wrong for not saying hyperspace is the best **** ever..

Hyperbole aside, hyperspace hasn't been out for 24 hours.

>hyperspace is potentially easier to balance going forward, but at the moment is no better than extended. It may even be worse due to BigFishSmallPond **** with Mr. Fett.

No Palob, no tugboats, no IG crew, no debris gambit, no Redline, no Whisper. Boba is still really good, but not as good. And with so many apex predators out of the ecosystem, other ships are allowed to play. Vader is a real ship still, for example. Metas are complex things, lots of moving parts.

>some people are attached to specific ships. As an example, i have a local who likes Starvipers. Not 'I fly a lot of guri', i mean "Double Black Sun Assassins+(something) is his main list and he's successful with it, and refuses to not use his customized fully moving starvipers in games". He gets told to **** off in hyperspace. There are people online who love Interceptors or B-wings i know

Nobody cares what they do on the bottom tables. Casuals can just play casually.

2 minutes ago, svelok said:

Are there going to be any large hyperspace tournaments until March, or whenever the spring season is meant to start?

Poland didn't do hyperspace for the qualifier (because it didn't exist). Will PAX/Pheonix?

That's my point. There are no large Hyperspace events until starting next year, from what I understand. I don't see the point in calling a format bad until it's actually been played. There's been so much the community got wrong before 2.0 events started happening in general, I have complete faith we'd get this wrong.

I guess I just don't understand the consternation. I didn't like Extended and kind of stumped for Second Edition locally, but it wasn't like I was going to stop playing because I didn't like the format. I was either going to play or I wasn't.

People are focusing far too much on hyperspace's balance today. It's mostly irrelevant. I'm sure there will be an event or 2 that use it before January, but the vast majority of tournaments that use it should be after the points rebalance. So stop talking about how Boba will dominate, because presumably boba (or at least han gunner) will have gone up in price.

6 hours ago, Quack Shot said:

Extended: Broken format that only 3-4 ships in each faction are viable.

Hyperspace: Much more balanced with point changes on the way where there’s only 4-5 ships in each faction.

Why do people not like Hyperspace?

• First: because point changes are "on the way" and not here yet. Until then, there's only 1-2 ships for each faction which are viable. If Hyperspace dropped with a points update, and not just for the Hyperspace ships (it'd be a lot easier to swallow Hyperspace if it didn't seem like the only nerfed format...), there'd be a lot more trust that it'd be a good format.
• Second: Because there's a difference between viable and legal.
  • Want to run the same Supernatural Luke as everyone else? OK. Want to back him up with an A-Wing or Z-95 Mini-swarm? Nope.
  • Maybe someone just really likes Gunboats.
  • Generic Inquisitors are one of the coolest new toys, even if they're not great. While there are Jedi also on the way, they're not here yet.
  • There's a lot of fun stuff that's at once outside the top-tables-large-tourmanent viable stuff, and outside Hyperspace.
• Related: there are a lot of awkward gaps in the Hyperspace. Imperials can't bring anything with Torpedoes, and their only Missile ship already has a built-in missile. Rebels don't have a swarm or filler ship. Those are pretty big gaps. Scum is in a really solid place, in terms of ships; the only role they really lack is a 3-dice efficiency jouster, so they're far better placed in terms of ship styles than other factions. Resistance/First Order look... at least OK. Some decent variety there.
• Third: Because large tournaments might keep being Extended anyhow. Most folks don't go to those, but just play at their local stores. There are two competing issues at FLGS levels of play. At once, it's awkward to prevent long-time players from using their collections assembled over years and with a decent amount of money. On the other hand, it's hard to ask new players to shell out for a bunch of conversion kits and sorta out-of-print expansions. But it's a harder ask for local veterans to give up their collections, if folks who live in the right places to play large events don't have to do the same.

//

For myself, I'm happy enough with a events in different styles. Some Extended, some Hyperspace. Heck, some Quickbuild (4x E-Wings is legal in Quickbuild...). So I guess what I want most is more events.