29 minutes ago, Makaze said:

I'd agree they're not balancing for kitchen table players, they're obviously using tournament representation and results in what they target. I think the casual vs competitive question is more what are they trying to maximize the balance for Wednesday night at the store, round 1 of swiss, or the cut?

Can't wait to see what they'll do for Epic balance...

52 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

I actually totally agree!!

But I personally also get kinda annoyed when I see the "Soontir effect": a single competitive representative dominating an entire chassis.

...

Soontir, Kylo, Tavson, Jendon... it gets old.

Lulo retired from that title, and now he shows up on purpose instead of automatically.

DISCLAIMER:

I'm not an Empire player, I'm a Resistance guy.

I'm really curious to hear any other input about Lambda/Jendon pricing from anyone who knows the faction synergies better!

All Lambdas are competitive. In Euros, someone went undefeated in swiss with OGP Palpshuttle and double defenders, and another OGP went 5-1.

And, you cant have Kylo double Ups without a Starkiller, so I would say that is competitive as well.

Lulo was the star of the Awings, but every single one was competitive and saw success in tournaments. Definately not "Soontir effect". No other interceptor sees top play other than Soonts. Interceptors definately need an i5 Carnor Jax!!!

42 minutes ago, wurms said:

All Lambdas are competitive. In Euros, someone went undefeated in swiss with OGP Palpshuttle and double defenders, and another OGP went 5-1.

And, you cant have Kylo double Ups without a Starkiller, so I would say that is competitive as well.

Lulo was the star of the Awings, but every single one was competitive and saw success in tournaments. Definately not "Soontir effect". No other interceptor sees top play other than Soonts. Interceptors definately need an i5 Carnor Jax!!!

Don't sleep on Kagi either. What if you forced your opponent to spend 3 turns killing a shuttle instead of your two aces?

Agree. All Lambda pilots are viable and have different strengths.

Jendon is just the key to certain things atm. He's certainly the foundation of the Inqy list.

A different pilot, or even ship, and that list would be so radically changed. Having to work to get the Inquisitors their locks is what keeps them balanced. And fun.

2 hours ago, Bucknife said:

I actually totally agree!!

But I personally also get kinda annoyed when I see the "Soontir effect": a single competitive representative dominating an entire chassis.

...

Soontir, Kylo, Tavson, Jendon... it gets old.

Lulo retired from that title, and now he shows up on purpose instead of automatically.

DISCLAIMER:

I'm not an Empire player, I'm a Resistance guy.

I'm really curious to hear any other input about Lambda/Jendon pricing from anyone who knows the faction synergies better!

I know, that ace Trade Federation Drone, is everywhere! Sometimes 7 places at once!

2 hours ago, Bucknife said:

Soontir, Kylo, Tavson, Jendon... it gets old.

Lulo retired from that title, and now he shows up on purpose instead of automatically.

While I agree about the Soontir effect, but Starkiller Base Pilot makes appearances, and Lt. Sai and OGP are both solid and see game time. Lu'lo was also a curious choice as all of the A-wing pilots (generics included) are good and see game time. Greer is probably in contention for the best A-wing pilots.

1 hour ago, Crit Happens said:

Don't sleep on Kagi either. What if you forced your opponent to spend 3 turns killing a shuttle instead of your two aces?

Shhhh! Dont mention Kagi. Our little secret.

25 minutes ago, wurms said:

Shhhh! Dont mention Kagi. Our little secret.

Shhh! Everything is good.

Don't tell the people!

6 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

Shhh! Everything is good.

Don't tell the people!

HWK this...

(36) Kyle Katarn [HWK-290 Light Freighter]
(18) Moldy Crow
(8) Perceptive Copilot
(1) Composure
(2) Engine Upgrade
Points: 65

(43) Jan Ors [HWK-290 Light Freighter]
(4) Hera Syndulla
(4) Swarm Tactics
(3) Seismic Charges
(2) Engine Upgrade
Points: 56

(41) Roark Garnet [HWK-290 Light Freighter]
(3) Seismic Charges
(1) Crack Shot
Points: 45

(30) Rebel Scout [HWK-290 Light Freighter]
(3) Seismic Charges
(1) "Chopper"
Points: 34

Total points: 200

Six Rebel Scouts with Engine Upgrade, one with Leia Organa.

Seriously though, squadbuilder printouts are so bad. I'm angry about so many things after Euros that I just stopped bothering for now. We have a great little community where I play, with lots of apparently uncommon but positive habits. I just feel so disillusioned and frankly disgusted. The event was great, don't get me wrong, and several games were really fun. But there was also a lot of crap that I haven't seen before.

If all competitive X-wing was like Euros then I would not play the game.

14 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

If all competitive X-wing was like Euros then I would not play the game.

For those of us not in the know, what are some of the things you're railing against?

Ace of Aces, number 2 pilot on metawing right now, Trade Federation Drone!

13 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

Ace of Aces, number 2 pilot on metawing right now, Trade Federation Drone!

The prequels have ruined Star Wars

4 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

The prequels have ruined Star Wars

#droidsdidnothingwrong

3 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

Seriously though, squadbuilder printouts are so bad. I'm angry about so many things after Euros that I just stopped bothering for now. We have a great little community where I play, with lots of apparently uncommon but positive habits. I just feel so disillusioned and frankly disgusted. The event was great, don't get me wrong, and several games were really fun. But there was also a lot of crap that I haven't seen before.

If all competitive X-wing was like Euros then I would not play the game.

3 hours ago, Jeff Wilder said:

For those of us not in the know, what are some of the things you're railing against?

<generic angry rant about what dee admitted too>

Was there other stuff too? That's incredibly disappointing to hear - why has all this popped up in like the past week or two?

11 minutes ago, Brunas said:

<generic angry rant about what dee admitted too>

Am I not allowed to leverage being mad about dice to get what I want?

2 hours ago, jagsba said:

Am I not allowed to leverage being mad about dice to get what I want?

To be fair, he only blamed 3 of his 4 losses over the European tour directly on dice. Or something like that.

That whole section put me on another Mynock listening hiatus. Gross. Ryan is great. Maybe Dee is in person.

19 minutes ago, gennataos said:

To be fair, he only blamed 3 of his 4 losses over the European tour directly on dice. Or something like that.

That whole section put me on another Mynock listening hiatus. Gross. Ryan is great. Maybe Dee is in person.

Dee is great in person, can confirm

X-Wing is a great game. The Devs are my favorite. And the Krayts actively make this community a better and more rational place. Thanks Max.

13 minutes ago, gennataos said:

Maybe Dee is in person.

Dee is in person. From my limited experience he still vents about dice, but apologizes when he goes over the top. Only met him a couple of times though

It doesn't always come across right but Dee's dice obsession is due to a desire for the game to be fair. My first impression of him was that he was just annoyed about his dice being bad but later in the same game he got upset about his dice being too good, which was interesting and let me see a little more where he was coming from.

I don't necessarily agree, I kinda like some amount of dice variance even if it can be frustrating in the heat of the moment. But I don't think he's the same guy that he comes across as on the cast.

8 hours ago, Jeff Wilder said:

For those of us not in the know, what are some of the things you're railing against?

5 hours ago, Brunas said:

<generic angry rant about what dee admitted too>

Was there other stuff too? That's incredibly disappointing to hear - why has all this popped up in like the past week or two?

Nothing with Dee on my part. It's the sum of many small and larger things. Some I did myself and am disappointed about, others I saw happening directly or later on. I'm a naturally competitive person, but I prefer to fly casual. I don't know how to phrase it without stepping on toes that I don't want to step on.

• My first game of the day, I had it won but didn't in the end. He was a really great guy and we had a ton of fun. But it was not ok in a way, plus I was stupid. Eventually he made top8.
  • he never gave me his list with the points, and it was the one game I didn't enter in launchbay. I glimpsed a handwritten list.
  • I was ahead but thought I was behind, k-turned and tallon rolled to take a lucky shot. I could have run away without being in range with boost or roll, but ended up without tokens and lost it.
  • We only played that last turn because:
    • the judge had to be called as I genuinely didn't know how many strains are removed after defending (just 1). The judge also didn't know and said he'd give us a time extension of 3min. I had stopped the break with my watch and it was just 1, so I said that would be fine.
    • Time was called and we got the extra minute. Which is when the above happened. Funnily enough my opponent said twice that we don't have to take the extra time and I insisted because I caused the break. That was when I had genuinely no idea who was ahead, and his aces generally benefit from extra time.
• Game 3 against Dion on stream was fun. It really was, great game all around: tight, tense, and interesting. But what was commented as "crisp play" was clearly him rushing, moving my ships before I even finished the previous movement. I didn't complain because I personally like to play fast, but that is not really ok to normalize. Also, handwritten list.
• Game 4 was the worst I've ever had. 2-1 at that point and imperial game nr4, Vader Soontir Inq. It was clear to me that it was a really bad matchup. He came to apologize the day after.
  • I put down our swiss shield tokens as gift. He takes them, says "oh you're swiss then?" and puts them away. You're welcome...
  • Another handwritten list. I intentionally hand him the official squadbuilder list at this point. He doesn't like it, gets up, walks around the row of tables and once he's in reach again I hand him the yasb list with the text. I didn't immediately get why he got up, as he didn't say anything either. But I did hand the minimal information list (that I got, too...)
  • And then he flies his Inquisitor off the board. That was to date the first time in my life where I didn't allow him to take it back - after really struggling with the decision.
    • He conceded there, we shook hands. Then he walks back and says no let's play it out. I agree because I feel bad for him.
  • He starts to complain about all kinds of things. Claims I nudged ships etc. He even pulls the "oh you touched my dial, you should be disqualified" on me. Now the gloves are completely off and I start to despise the guy.
  • Soontir moves, Vader moves. He declares a shot with Soontir. "Oh no, actually let me shoot with Vader first." Ok, Vader rolls. Soontir activates, "oh soontir would get the focus". I say no, you can't do that anymore, you missed it. He puts the focus down, attacks, spends a focus on attack. I repeat that he can't put the focus down. I attack, nattie hit-crit-crit. Soontir defends, rolls 3 eyes.
    • He concedes again, we shake hands again, he walks away.
  • That was such a bad game. You can probably guess how upset I was after this one.
• I drew 4 imperials for my 6 games, not a single beef or swarm or brawler. That's just unlucky.
• Played game 5 against Faan. Again, he's a great guy and I learned a lot and enjoyed playing against him and getting schooled. That was my second loss, so I drew two of the best players of the weekend. Still, he plays correctly to the point of it being uncomfortable.
  • I was a bit salty to draw him as matchup, but that happens
  • Again a handwritten list, no half points on it.

And then all the "no you can't cloak, my dials are set" and similar crap that is just unacceptable. I compromised my own standards "because it's a continental", but it looks like there's no end on how low people are willing to go.

But I got to ask: what is it with handwritten lists? Who does that? Why do people do that, and why can't you print a yasb list? You know what list you bring to a continental... right? And what the **** is it with the official squadbuilder and the lack of text? I had a hungarian and polish version printed just in case, but apparently it's too difficult.

/rant

Seriously though, it is too much. The game is currently great, even if aces make their comeback and even with force. But fly casual is gone.
Completely gone? No, a small group of indomitable casuals still holds against the invaders (I don't know how many of you know Asterix...)

17 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

But I got to ask: what is it with handwritten lists?

What kind of bourgeois monster owns a printer in this day and age?

Also I always wondered how long it'd take for people to notice the European WAAC mask slipping.