8 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:

I feel perversly vindicated that you guys are finally starting to see how boring is to play HS in a meta inflated by properly built rebel beef (which for me means Wedge/Cassian/Braylen + 1, possibily a generic B or Biggs, maaaaybe a Y but definitely not an A-wing or another X that's not Biggs).

It's not unbeatable and 2.0 have seen even more broken lists so far (Whisper Redline Soontir for example), but in the hyperspace context it's quite oppressive. Again, I think it's just the increased importance of dice variance that's making feel like list building power levels are closer than they actually are

Your metas were way more wholesome than mine since it took so long to catch up, for myself I can't wait for the point changes and the end of hyperspace season

7 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Hmm. Cassian + Braylen (or generic Bs) weren't options before the, frankly really stupid, additions to hyperspace. I dispute "your metas were way more wholesome than mine" - unless you were literally playing in the future.

Basically what Brunas said - I was having fun before this entry.

Personally my local hyperspace meta is pretty wholesome, I'd say. Though I'll let you all judge.

http://i.imgur.com/GAqMhr2.jpg

EDIT: Our league is hyperspace by default with extended only if both parties consent.

I think it's strange how we keep trying to convince each other that the patch of grass 'they' really like is actually brown and more smelly than the one 'we' prefer. That is the constant topic. As if we had not mentally adjusted to two important changes:

1. Every meta is temporary and lasts at most 6 months (point adjustments), more often 3 months (new waves), and likely just 6 weeks (also new waves). And there are shifts within the same constraints, too.
2. There is always a format that is more fun for you. Or less bad. However you want to look at it, it is there.

You can always walk over to the other patch and smell the grass. Heck, you can have one nostril on each patch and smell them at the same time if you want. I know I do. And me preferring the smell of hyperspace doesn't mean that extended smells bad, or that someone else has to like hyperspace. /rant

Furthermore, I want to say that udders are clearly more efficient and thus superior in everything but aesthetics.

11 minutes ago, Ablazoned said:

Personally my local hyperspace meta is pretty wholesome, I'd say. Though I'll let you all judge.

http://i.imgur.com/GAqMhr2.jpg

EDIT: Our league is hyperspace by default with extended only if both parties consent.

WAT

A

T

2 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

I think it's strange how we keep trying to convince each other that the patch of grass 'they' really like is actually brown and more smelly than the one 'we' prefer. That is the constant topic. As if we had not mentally adjusted to two important changes:

1. Every meta is temporary and lasts at most 6 months (point adjustments), more often 3 months (new waves), and likely just 6 weeks (also new waves). And there are shifts within the same constraints, too.
2. There is always a format that is more fun for you. Or less bad. However you want to look at it, it is there.

You can always walk over to the other patch and smell the grass. Heck, you can have one nostril on each patch and smell them at the same time if you want. I know I do. And me preferring the smell of hyperspace doesn't mean that extended smells bad, or that someone else has to like hyperspace. /rant

Furthermore, I want to say that udders are clearly more efficient and thus superior in everything but aesthetics.

Let's be real though - at this point, the only thing that matters is aesthetics, right? Technology is amazing, and despite what some zealots will tell you, it's OK to use baby formula!

Re:format wars, this is all I feel anymore on hyperspace

Turns out 6 months is a really long time to not enjoy a meta, though, sadly

The Extended vs Hyperspace debate is still dumb.

You can like either, both, or neither and change your mind infinite times and not be wrong.

The Hyperspace expansion was a strange and unnecessary change that I'm not sure who was asking for it, which makes it a curious choice on the part of FFG OP.

1 minute ago, Brunas said:

Let's be real though - at this point, the only thing that matters is aesthetics, right? Technology is amazing, and despite what some zealots will tell you, it's OK to use baby formula!

On one hand, I'm turning more and more lactose intolerant or at least sensitive, so I can't drink as much milk anymore. But on the other hand, I used to drink half a liter milk every morning during puberty. And for that, baby formula is not an option. So udders and their efficiency is or at least was highly relevant to me in my past. Unless... uh...

4 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Re:format wars, this is all I feel anymore on hyperspace

I agree to some extent, I really think wave 2 was more fun than I've ever had, and more than I have now. It was so. so. good!

But, and going into what @Tlfj200 said:

I think it really depends a lot on where you play the game. I get one or two large events per year, one trial and a SOS or national that I can go to. The rest are small events. That means the meta during that time matters a lot to me. It also means that I am anyway used to long periods of less competitive play, or less play in general.

1 hour ago, Biophysical said:

https://starfightermafia.blogspot.com/2019/05/article-10-fat-turret-rises-and-token.html?m=1

Here's another archetype that you can fit as rather decent: Delta + 3 bombers. Because I like to count to 200 or take a double-digit bid (THERE IS NO RELIABLE IN-BETWEEN ACCORDING TO MY FAULTY PLAYSTYLE, LOL) I figured the tanky endgame is easier to play than the agressive one of Vader. The bombers offer great area denial and customizability: I currently rock a cluster Jonus (better than it sounds, especially with the plentitude of sub-I4), a barrage seismic Scimitar, and a barrage proton Scimitar. Yes, the bombs are needed according to this list, as the combo of a seismic + proton scares the **** out of low-health flankers, can often times sneak a crit into Rebel beef trying to cycle, forces Han to move wider, and allows the Bombers some area denial when they meander to another target/k-turn and shut off rockets for that round.

I don't think it's as good as Juke and Nuke (what I'm starting to call archetype 5), but it's a far more relaxing game than the adrenaline rush of counting to 200 so as to receive the initiative to power up juke, hopefully setting up a killbox correctly, hoping you did your math right, and selecting the most optimal firing order. Ultimately, I think the best defender archetype is an unlisted one: Lambda + 2I5 Token Stackers. At the very least, it's the highest performing and most popular. At Adepticon (sure, old news, but there were more people than usual who appreciated the beauty of defenders):

Compare these results to:

2 aces + filler:

Juke and Nuke:

Misc.

1 out of 7 made the cut: that's a decent conversion rate of 14%. 3 had a winning record, giving it an only slightly underwhelming rate of 43%. Intriguingly, there were no generics or Ryad. The only non-Rex was a Vess paired with Vader. 4 of the 7 lists were what some might call "experimental" (the misc. category and Matt Erbe's cut archetype). I'd say that people are continuing to figure them out and coming with interesting results.

I've been screaming it before; I'll be a madman in the streets some more. Defenders are criminally underrated.

I'll agree with you Defenders are underrated, while throwing every red flag in existence for attempting to do analysis on a sample size of 7.

Fight me?

33 minutes ago, Ablazoned said:

Personally my local hyperspace meta is pretty wholesome, I'd say. Though I'll let you all judge.

http://i.imgur.com/GAqMhr2.jpg

EDIT: Our league is hyperspace by default with extended only if both parties consent.

This is very wholesome; nothing less expected from Ablazoned's neck of the woods. It looks like you can just fly whatever and expect to have a good time. The most annoying thing I see is Invennicible, but that's annoying more than oppressive, and it's not even in the top 10 of lists.

3 minutes ago, Brunas said:

I'll agree with you Defenders are underrated, while throwing every red flag in existence for attempting to do analysis on a sample size of 7.

Fight me?

No, I will not fight. Except you threw off my point of subtlety, so i guess it's time to say it outright then: EVEN IN A ****ING MASSIVE-*** TOURNEY OF 251 PEOPLE, WE CAN'T EVEN GET 10 PEOPLE TO FLY A DEFENDER. HOW CAN WE AS A COMMUNITY DISMISS THE CHASSIS WHEN WE LITERALLY--NOT IN THE FIGURATIVE SENSE, BUT THE ORIGINAL AND ACTUAL MEANING OF THE WORD-- NOT FLY IT SERIOUSLY????!!!!!

1 minute ago, player3010587 said:

No, I will not fight. Except you threw off my point of subtlety, so i guess it's time to say it outright then: EVEN IN A ****ING MASSIVE-*** TOURNEY OF 251 PEOPLE, WE CAN'T EVEN GET 10 PEOPLE TO FLY A DEFENDER. HOW CAN WE AS A COMMUNITY DISMISS THE CHASSIS WHEN WE LITERALLY--NOT IN THE FIGURATIVE SENSE, BUT THE ORIGINAL AND ACTUAL MEANING OF THE WORD-- NOT FLY IT SERIOUSLY????!!!!!

Haha, there's a few things that seem obviously good that people aren't playing...

YV-666

Auzituck

Defenders

is the start of the list...

17 minutes ago, player3010587 said:

I've been screaming it before; I'll be a madman in the streets some more. Defenders are criminally underrated.

3 minutes ago, Brunas said:

I'll agree with you Defenders are underrated, while throwing every red flag in existence for attempting to do analysis on a sample size of 7.

Fight me?

My worry, and the point of the article is a lot less about power, which I think they have at least in B+/A- tier, but fun. They are not fun to play against swarms. Their win condition reached through hyper defense and avoidance. They get really fun when they're using their defense to be aggressive, though, which they can do against low ship count lists.

Just now, Brunas said:

Haha, there's a few things that seem obviously good that people aren't playing...

YV-666

Auzituck

Defenders

is the start of the list...

Don't tell me nobody's put Juke, perc copilot, and jyn on Wulfarro. Because that is stupid good. A little expensive, but a 3 die gun that always jukes something of yours regardless of position is pretty good. And if you get it angry, it becomes a 4 die gun!

52 minutes ago, Tlfj200 said:

Basically what Brunas said - I was having fun before this entry.

Yeah I did some extended messing around with Cassian/Braylen and it was on my wish list for hyperspace. I still can't believe they patched it in.

3 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Haha, there's a few things that seem obviously good that people aren't playing...

YV-666

Auzituck

Defenders

is the start of the list...

YV666 has a lot of great crew options including 4LOM and Zuckuss crew that each got cheaper from the points update. On top of that it gained gunner which means either BT1 for Bossk or Dengar for any of them seem pretty solid. I worked on this awhile back and had some success, but ended up taking 5As to Adepticon instead.

11 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Haha, there's a few things that seem obviously good that people aren't playing...

YV-666

Auzituck

Defenders

is the start of the list...

NO. If a ship doesn't get used in Extended it is bad and should feel bad.

Huh. Wookies have six 3+ speed moves and can take afterburners.

53 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

On one hand, I'm turning more and more lactose intolerant or at least sensitive, so I can't drink as much milk anymore.

Lactase pills really help. I took them for about a month, and my sensitivity to dairy went away. And then a few months later it came back, so I started taking lactase again, and then it went away and hasn't been back. The only time I really have issues now is if I eat a large Dairy Queen Blizzard, which is really too much ice cream at one sitting, so I kind of deserve the ensuing tummy troubles. Anyway, I advise not staying away from dairy or you'll be lactose sensitive for good.

10 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Huh. Wookies have six 3+ speed moves and can take afterburners.

Wullffwarro — Auzituck Gunship	56
Afterburners	6
Ship Total: 62
Half Points: 31 Threshold: 4

Just remember to stay in range of Saw!

12 hours ago, Boom Owl said:

So...talking about Rebel Beef Stew.

Its probably the only version of Rebels I have ever actually had an interest in playing.

god, same.

I was practicing my favorite Republic list against it and just comparing my ARCs to his B-Wings and getting super jealous of how fun they looked to fly.

Then I realized this was a solvable problem.

Buncha X-Wings and a Partisan? Boring as ****. No thanks

1 Tallon Rolls and a double stress-management U-Wing? Oh, hey, I'm here.

13 hours ago, Tlfj200 said:

...why has my thoughts on extended vs hyperspace flipped again...?

because the house always wins

45 minutes ago, player3010587 said:

Don't tell me nobody's put Juke, perc copilot, and jyn on Wulfarro. Because that is stupid good. A little expensive, but a 3 die gun that always jukes something of yours regardless of position is pretty good. And if you get it angry, it becomes a 4 die gun!

39 minutes ago, RStan said:

YV666 has a lot of great crew options including 4LOM and Zuckuss crew that each got cheaper from the points update. On top of that it gained gunner which means either BT1 for Bossk or Dengar for any of them seem pretty solid. I worked on this awhile back and had some success, but ended up taking 5As to Adepticon instead.

I posted examples of ships that are good with minimal upgrades because they die, and what happens?

THEY FILL THEM UP WITH UPGRADES, EVERY TIME

1 minute ago, Brunas said:

I posted examples of ships that are good with minimal upgrades because they die, and what happens?

THEY FILL THEM UP WITH UPGRADES, EVERY TIME

Upgrades on a wookie or luke gunner on han? List building is hard.

48 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Haha, there's a few things that seem obviously good that people aren't playing...

YV-666

I liked YV-666 a lot better before they took out the third crew slot and made it a gunner.

Jabba-Contraband-Lando was my favorite setup on either a Slaver or Moralo. Now, I don't care. I guess Dengar is okay in place of Lando, but I want that cool token that gets me defensive buffs for your shots and offensive mods for my shots. Or as Braylen would call it, a stress token...