7 minutes ago, jagsba said:Is it? we don't know what happens when you fly over it, but how bad would that effect have to be for you not to just take the obstacles that give you free reinforce?
It would be horrible for a large amount of 2dice attacks, for example.
1 minute ago, svelok said:If they obstruct, you get 1.0 reinforce. Ion token for 1.0 reinforce is really not a great trade for Soontir. It's a pretty good trade for RAC.
That would be interesting and I like it.
Harder for RAC to hide behind a cloud too, so yeah... I like it.
If it's an ion token as a consequence anyway. Seems to be the common thought, but FFG doesn't necessarily need to go that way.
*sigh* all the new tokens and effects means I'll never get my sons to a tournament again, there's too many things to know and juggle during a match. I get that kids are not the target demographics, but it still makes me sad because I just had this outside hope that I could get them interested in time for the Q3 Hyperspace Trials we'll have locally.
I guess this also massively impacts how easy the game is to pick up for new players when there are so many different tokens, obstacles, and effects you may face and have to account for. But that doesn't affect me, so I don't care 
I'll enjoy watching streams and playing a 5 faction Wave 1 (maybe 2) games at home.
Let me know when RZ-2s and Scum TIEs become horrendously bad so I can buy them used on the cheap 
3 minutes ago, LagJanson said:Hypothetically, an ion token is pretty rough for a small base to try dodging around in them. Baring Sabine, Advanced Sensors or a SNR force user...
only if you're trying to shoot through it, I'm fine putting it on my flank and hiding from strafing shots
2 minutes ago, svelok said:Take a strain, can't shoot while parked on it?
If you bring 3 gas clouds, first player can place two of them, so they don't synergize with bidding for second?
It's also the future, so FFG can just change their rules if they're too potent.
you can't shoot on asteroids already so its already ahead just on the reinforce. If you take a strain when you land on it, and you land on it as often as you get obstructed shots, you're coming out ahead (basically guaranteed evade > extra evade dice). And if you land on them as often as you get obstructions, you're flying really poorly.
2 minutes ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:What I would sort of like to see if that your ship gets ionized (as in full ion tokens for the size) for overlap, but no dmg rolled. It gives a risk/reward that is different from asteroids/debris. You had better make your current turn count because your next turn is going to hurt.
I do think ion is one of the worse effects it could dole out, but even then, you shouldn't be hitting it near as much as you're getting the reinforce from it. It just seems stupid good.
Just now, drjkel said:*sigh* all the new tokens and effects means I'll never get my sons to a tournament again, there's too many things to know and juggle during a match. I get that kids are not the target demographics, but it still makes me sad because I just had this outside hope that I could get them interested in time for the Q3 Hyperspace Trials we'll have locally.
I guess this also massively impacts how easy the game is to pick up for new players when there are so many different tokens, obstacles, and effects you may face and have to account for. But that doesn't affect me, so I don't care
I'll enjoy watching streams and playing a 5 faction Wave 1 (maybe 2) games at home.
Let me know when RZ-2s and Scum TIEs become horrendously bad so I can buy them used on the cheap
They'll surprise you and learn it completely before you do, if they're interested.
...48 upgrades in the box? It's unofficially a separatist core set, that's unexpected and really cool.
3 ships and effectively a conversion kit for $50 is quite the steal.
Just now, jagsba said:only if you're trying to shoot through it, I'm fine putting it on my flank and hiding from strafing shots
Yeah, they'll be great for running... which is not necessarily a great thing for the game. New obstacle of choice for Kylo?
6 minutes ago, svelok said:If they obstruct, you get 1.0 reinforce. Ion token for 1.0 reinforce is really not a great trade for Soontir. It's a pretty good trade for RAC.
That would be interesting and I like it.
its not a straight ion for reinforce trade off though. The ration of reinforce to ion is contingent on player skill (i.e. getting obstructed shots vs not landing on clouds). You're getting multiple reinforces for each ion you might get.
3 minutes ago, LagJanson said:Yeah, they'll be great for running... which is not necessarily a great thing for the game. New obstacle of choice for Kylo?
again, I don't know what ship doesn't like free autothrusters. It'll be better on higher AGI ships, but its still good on low ones.
1 minute ago, jagsba said:again, I don't know what ship doesn't like free autothrusters. It'll be better on higher AGI ships, but its still good on low ones.
I'll give you a second example: ships that benefit a lot from rocks - and squads with them. Grappling struts for example, so most CIS squads? Miningguild TIEs too. Squads that want to blow up seismics, so the squad of legend v1 and the better little brother with deathrain.
And then much if not most with trickshot due to the larger size.
Looks like an interesting choice to me, not an auto include.
11 minutes ago, Brunas said:...48 upgrades in the box? It's unofficially a separatist core set, that's unexpected and really cool.
3 ships and effectively a conversion kit for $50 is quite the steal.
Try $39.95. Even bigger steal.
1 minute ago, RStan said:Try $39.95. Even bigger steal.
13 minutes ago, LagJanson said:They'll surprise you and learn it completely before you do, if they're interested.
I doubt it. By the end of 1.0, my oldest son barely looked at his opponents' lists because there were too many potential interactions he couldn't fathom (plus, the language barrier) that he figured it wasn't worth trying to grasp them all. He still did ok by focusing on outflying, but it was one of the things that annoyed him. Son #2 hates anything where you mod your opponent's decisions, so Strain would be horrific for him.
It's fine, I'm 95% resolved to just playing at home now. It just stings that my last slim glimmer of hope that I may get them to a tournament again in the future was just extinguished. I loved seeing how happy my oldest was playing this game, winning or losing, and I miss that.
Again, I know full well I'm in the minority and I'm just a filthy casual now, but part of me misses going to a tournament with my kid knowing we'd roll dice and have a blast.
Back to your originally scheduled program now!
4 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:I'll give you a second example: ships that benefit a lot from rocks - and squads with them. Grappling struts for example, so most CIS squads? Miningguild TIEs too. Squads that want to blow up seismics, so the squad of legend v1 and the better little brother with deathrain.
And then much if not most with trickshot due to the larger size.
Looks like an interesting choice to me, not an auto include.
those are a lot of edge cases though, specific ships that care about obstacle type (CIS and MG TIEs). I'm not sure if seismic lists hate clouds, they can still blow them up, and they can deal damage. If anything, ships are more likely to try to get obstructions from clouds then other obstacles and fly in closer, which benefits the seismic list.
Trick shot is kind of a 'eh its cheap and good' card more than a lynch pin barring a few exceptions (i.e. scum Han).
Sure its not auto include, nothing is. But I don't see how you don't default to gas clouds unless there's a specific ship/card in the list that makes you reconsider.
11 minutes ago, RStan said:Try $39.95. Even bigger steal.
...what? That means they're selling them to stores for... $20? Are they even making money?
What!?
2 minutes ago, Brunas said:...what? That means they're selling them to stores for... $20? Are they even making money?
What!?
FFG is a bunch of greedy money grubbers.
21 minutes ago, jagsba said:again, I don't know what ship doesn't like free autothrusters. It'll be better on higher AGI ships, but its still good on low ones.
For many ships running isn't a valid long term strategy. For most ships running behind the cloud will buy them exactly one turn... maybe enough?
In a single turn though, yes, hide in the clouds!
5 minutes ago, jagsba said:I'm not sure if seismic lists hate clouds, they can still blow them up, and they can deal damage. If anything, ships are more likely to try to get obstructions from clouds then other obstacles and fly in closer, which benefits the seismic list.
It would really surprise me if Seismics work with gas clouds. All FFG has to do is update the RRG for them to not, and it doesn't make sense for them to (my seismic bomb detonates this, uh, hydrogen cloud, scattering chunks of, uh... one damage, it's one damage.)
3 minutes ago, svelok said:It would really surprise me if Seismics work with gas clouds. All FFG has to do is update the RRG for them to not, and it doesn't make sense for them to (my seismic bomb detonates this, uh, hydrogen cloud, scattering chunks of, uh... one damage, it's one damage.)
Would they need to change anything? Presumably they're obstacles:
4 minutes ago, LagJanson said:For many ships running isn't a valid long term strategy. For most ships running behind the cloud will buy them exactly one turn... maybe enough?
In a single turn though, yes, hide in the clouds!
you don't need to be kylo running away to take advantage of it. They'll be useful in a variety of situations.
2 minutes ago, Brunas said:Would they need to change anything? Presumably they're obstacles:
Right now seismics would work on them.
But the text for what the actual bomb templates do is in the RRG, so they'd just have to replace "obstacle" with "debris field or asteroid" and then they wouldn't work on gas clouds.
I'm just guessing that will happen, based on it not making thematic sense, and being an easy change that makes which device you equip more interesting.
1 minute ago, jagsba said:you don't need to be kylo running away to take advantage of it. They'll be useful in a variety of situations.
Not arguing that at all. It will be incredibly useful. I haven't a clue whether it will be game breakingly good, but there will be moments and games stolen by the clouds.
Just not every turn.
1 minute ago, svelok said:Right now seismics would work on them.
But the text for what the actual bomb templates do is in the RRG, so they'd just have to replace "obstacle" with "debris field or asteroid" and then they wouldn't work on gas clouds.
I'm just guessing that will happen, based on it not making thematic sense, and being an easy change that makes which device you equip more interesting.
how does it make more thematic sense that some sort of sound wave bomb in space can blow up a rock, but not make a cloud of gas explode?
1 minute ago, LagJanson said:Not arguing that at all. It will be incredibly useful. I haven't a clue whether it will be game breakingly good, but there will be moments and games stolen by the clouds.
Just not every turn.
oh for sure. My problem is that I don't know why I'd bring the other obstacles unless I'm building my list around them. Was hoping for more variety in obstacle choice, not less.
4 minutes ago, jagsba said:oh for sure. My problem is that I don't know why I'd bring the other obstacles unless I'm building my list around them. Was hoping for more variety in obstacle choice, not less.
Off the top of my head:
I like taking large rocks because I expect at least some of my opponents are scared of them. I think at most I'm going to shuffle one cloud into my two large rock cycle... but hey, lets wait to see what all the rules are before panic and strategy.
Edited by LagJanson