3 hours ago, catachanninja said:I'm not sure I believe in non corran e wings, but the rest are on my list to try once my l5r training montage ends in November. Though we may have FO by then lol. Poor rebels get my attention for a maximum of like 6 days
Rogue squadron are amazing ordnance carriers. Mostly because people see a non-Corran e-wing and discount it.
The overunder is even more entertaining if you fill it out before!
I played the DashRoark against a WhisperSloane Striker list and got taken apart, lost with something around 130-200. The red barrel roll is really dangerous because of slow blues and because it messes so hard with the action economy in the next turn - no coordination for stresses Dash. Outrider to move over an obstacle is not always possible, and landing on a rock means you lose two shots or roll away again, so again getting stressed. Of course bring debris, but two play the game
Edited by GreenDragoonwith quadjumper swarms being something people are toying with right now, bringing debris doesn't seem a bad call for other reasons...
3 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:The overunder is even more entertaining if you fill it out before!
I played the DashRoark against a WhisperSloane Striker list and got taken apart, lost with something around 130-200. The red barrel roll is really dangerous because of slow blues and because it messes so hard with the action economy in the next turn - no coordination for stresses Dash. Outrider to move over an obstacle is not always possible, and landing on a rock means you lose two shots or roll away again, so again getting stressed. Of course bring debris, but two play the game
I found turn zero really interesting. I needed to set up a cluster to orbit, my opponents have all played against Dash before so tried to stop me. Both games I lost were against lists with seismics where they just erased obstacles in the first few turns.
I think flying like old Dash is a trap. You cannot afford to lose the focus mods, so Barrel rolling should/must be a last resort, rather than something you think about doing constantly.
I keep looking at Kanan crew with outrider, then I get scared at how expensive the build is
57 minutes ago, Dreadai said:I think flying like old Dash is a trap. You cannot afford to lose the focus mods, so Barrel rolling should/must be a last resort, rather than something you think about doing constantly.
Yes, and I completely fell into it. The game didn‘t last long, 3 rounds of combat
The issue with 2 ships build is that while it used to be one of the most forgiving archetype right now it's the complete opposite being the most unforgiving one.
I'm having moderate success with a lone wolf kanan jarrus R2d2 han with proton wedge but you have very few way to recover from either mistakes or bad variance
5 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:The issue with 2 ships build is that while it used to be one of the most forgiving archetype right now it's the complete opposite being the most unforgiving one.
I only tried Dash, but I completely agree on at least that example!
So what is more forgiving? For me it was Y-wings and Punishers so far. To my surprise I have to add
12 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:The issue with 2 ships build is that while it used to be one of the most forgiving archetype right now it's the complete opposite being the most unforgiving one.
I'm having moderate success with a lone wolf kanan jarrus R2d2 han with proton wedge but you have very few way to recover from either mistakes or bad variance
From the Rebel side, that definitely seems to be true. Boba + Fenn/Guri feels fine for two ships because they can be tough/dodgy and deal enough damage to keep up in the damage race. Defender + whatever seems to have the survivability to come out on top. Rebels don't have that, not really. They don't have combos of toughness while also dealing out enough damage...at least not from my experience.
Thoughts about the game.
38 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:The issue with 2 ships build is that while it used to be one of the most forgiving archetype right now it's the complete opposite being the most unforgiving one.
I'm having moderate success with a lone wolf kanan jarrus R2d2 han with proton wedge but you have very few way to recover from either mistakes or bad variance
Every time I mention turrets I get this response. Why does large base turret == 2 ship list?
Just now, Brunas said:Every time I mention turrets I get this response. Why does large base turret == 2 ship list?
I think mostly because the sub-50 point ships either want to be in a swarm of 4+ so they won't fit with a turret ship, and the aces cost more than 50 kitted out properly so you can't have more than 1.
Basically more of an anomaly of the 200 point list building than anything else.
5 hours ago, Dreadai said:Rogue squadron are amazing ordnance carriers. Mostly because people see a non-Corran e-wing and discount it.
Let me be honest. I see E-wings and discount them, as a chassis. The only usable E-wing was corran in 1.0 and he got nerfed pretty heavily. Their inability to either Double repo, Repo+token, or double token means they take damage when you shoot them. As an alpha carrier, they cost too much to be taken en-masse and are outclassed by the T-65 in terms of cost efficency.
Honestly I love it this way. FFG managed to make the ship lore-accurate. An overdesigned hangar queen that costs too much to function, and tries to do jobs that the T-65 does more cost effectively.
3 minutes ago, Brunas said:Every time I mention turrets I get this response. Why does large base turret == 2 ship list?
Idk, all my Han lists I try to build are Han 3z.
But i'm making my hans overly Thicc i fear.
45 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:The issue with 2 ships build is that while it used to be one of the most forgiving archetype right now it's the complete opposite being the most unforgiving one.
I'm having moderate success with a lone wolf kanan jarrus R2d2 han with proton wedge but you have very few way to recover from either mistakes or bad variance
I ran Rexler Brath + Whisper in a couple games last night as a 2 ship list. It was stupid. Definitely not hard mode.
3 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:Idk, all my Han lists I try to build are Han 3z.
But i'm making my hans overly Thicc i fear.
I keep looking at Falcon builds and keep thinking that I get 85% of their capability if I keep them below 100 points. That extra 15% for maximum capability doesn't seem worth it, at least on paper. But for me, it's only been on paper.
27 minutes ago, gennataos said:Boba + Fenn/Guri feels fine for two ships because they can be tough/dodgy and deal enough damage to keep up in the damage race.
I've witnessed sad Boba who thought he was outside of range 3 of X-Wings... That was a pretty unforgiving mistake. 2-ships lists are indeed VERY unforgiving if you mess up, but some of them have more ways to mess up than others.
3 minutes ago, Kaptin Krunch said:Let me be honest. I see E-wings and discount them, as a chassis. The only usable E-wing was corran in 1.0 and he got nerfed pretty heavily. Their inability to either Double repo, Repo+token, or double token means they take damage when you shoot them. As an alpha carrier, they cost too much to be taken en-masse and are outclassed by the T-65 in terms of cost efficency.
Honestly I love it this way. FFG managed to make the ship lore-accurate. An overdesigned hangar queen that costs too much to function, and tries to do jobs that the T-65 does more cost effectively.
I agree. Completely. It may not necessarily need the token stack, but at the price tag and lack of durability on the frame, you'd better be very sure an E-wing is what you really want in your list. Odds are, it wasn't...
3 minutes ago, Biophysical said:I keep looking at Falcon builds and keep thinking that I get 85% of their capability if I keep them below 100 points. That extra 15% for maximum capability doesn't seem worth it, at least on paper. But for me, it's only been on paper.
Yeah, honestly, I could probably cut the title from this?
But god **** is this Han EXTRA THICC
1 minute ago, LagJanson said:I've witnessed sad Boba who thought he was outside of range 3 of X-Wings.
I've also elected to leave Fenn Rau in arc of Redline with a proton torp instead of Jendon's because I didn't think the LOCK on Fenn was Redlines and preferred a 2-die range 3 shot instead of a 3-die range 3 shot. Then I got torped and was sad.
In your quoted case and mine, people need to git gud. 
Really, though, any Boba player who finds themselves at range 3 of 3 X-Wings does need to git gud.
There are plenty of reasonable options for 3 ship lists with these big turrets, you don't even have to stoop to z95s.
Han Solo (92)
R2-D2 (8)
Luke Skywalker (62)
Servomotor S-foils (0)
Sabine Wren (38)
Total: 200
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
“Duchess” (42)
“Whisper” (52)
Juke (4)
Rear Admiral Chiraneau (88)
Minister Tua (7)
Hotshot Gunner (7)
Total: 200
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
“Leebo” (98)
Magva Yarro (7)
Sabine Wren (38)
Norra Wexley (55)
Total: 198
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
These are just random examples, not endorsing them as "good". The point being, I've never seen anything like them tried ever. I don't really understand what's going on.
6 minutes ago, Brunas said:“Duchess” (42)
“Whisper” (52)
Juke (4)Rear Admiral Chiraneau (88)
Minister Tua (7)
Hotshot Gunner (7)Total: 200
Tried something down this line... but not likely as good.
Trade the gunner and Duchess for Lt Sai and you're set. Ram RAC and Sai towards anything that'll pose a threat to Whisper in end game. Sai reinforcing everything while RAC opens up the guns. It was fun, but I'm not very good with large bases to start with, having rarely used them in the last edition of the game.
An afterthought: I'd like to try it again, though removing Tua for something more offensively minded. The red action prevented coordination the following turn and limited my dial choices too much.
Edited by LagJanson3 minutes ago, Brunas said:There are plenty of reasonable options for 3 ship lists with these big turrets, you don't even have to stoop to z95s.
Han Solo (92)
R2-D2 (8)Luke Skywalker (62)
Servomotor S-foils (0)Sabine Wren (38)
Total: 200
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
“Duchess” (42)
“Whisper” (52)
Juke (4)Rear Admiral Chiraneau (88)
Minister Tua (7)
Hotshot Gunner (7)Total: 200
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
“Leebo” (98)
Magva Yarro (7)Sabine Wren (38)
Norra Wexley (55)
Total: 198
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0
These are just random examples, not endorsing them as "good". The point being, I've never seen anything like them tried ever. I don't really understand what's going on.
We're probably trying to put too many upgrades on the fat turrets and/or their wingmates. Or, maybe just seeing of 1.0 archetypes can work. From what I've seen thus far, they don't. Or, more likely, we headsim stuff like this against currently known archetypes/list and just opt out.
Also here's the actual turn two that followed my turn in screenshot, probably further illustrates the point that even though I had similar ideas I still woubd up in different spots
17 minutes ago, Brunas said:There are plenty of reasonable options for 3 ship lists with these big turrets, you don't even have to stoop to z95s.
I think that it comes down to people wanting to put upgrades on their ships which bloats their costs. You can also do Lando/Wedge/Kyle as well or Leebo(w/3PO) with a naked Wedge and Sabine.
2 minutes ago, gennataos said:We're probably trying to put too many upgrades on the fat turrets and/or their wingmates. Or, maybe just seeing of 1.0 archetypes can work. From what I've seen thus far, they don't. Or, more likely, we headsim stuff like this against currently known archetypes/list and just opt out.
I think the problem is you almost have to? Like you're already paying a ton of points for just the chassis, I think you may need to find ways to make it get there.
@Brunas What’s the best RAC/Vader build you think? I Know most consider RAC not good, but you seem to think he’s decent.
(70) Darth Vader
(12) Supernatural Reflexes
(3) Fire-Control System
(8) Afterburners
Points 93
(88) Rear Admiral Chiraneau
(3) 0-0-0
(7) Minister Tua
(2) BT-1
(3) Shield Upgrade
Points 103
Total points: 196