33 minutes ago, clanofwolves said:

You guys are talking micro details of rules.....

Isnt this a Krayts thread?

It'll derail soon enough.

50 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:

I thought the streamer host was one of the TOs (not a marshal or a judge, just one of the organizers). If I got it wrong, yeah that's not a good example.

Yeah, the statement was that VTTV wasn't going to interfere with games... but lets not go down that road again. And, really, no it doesn't change or deflate your argument at all. It's just a poor example to use.

My thoughts are that FFG have a game that's grown well beyond their expectations. They may have hoped to have this level of success, but I don't think they could honestly come out and say they expected the game to be drawing hundreds of people to large scale events years later. Their support for the tournament scene has been pretty good considering the size of the company, but it has limits and we might be seeing a touch of that. Add in the complexities of some of the newer cards and some of the odd wording they've used, and it'll compound the issues in tournament organization. FFG has to make a step to further evolve to support the game - the question in my mind is, what way do they step? From what I previously quoted from @GreenDragoon - it would appear that FFG is looking at defending their current position instead of maybe using the opportunity to develop some floor rules.

Somebody (Chris Brown?) mentions in the latest OCX episode that they asked the streamers (Gold Squadron Podcast) to inform them about board state errors at a tournament, at around 47:00.

I would want that to happen to my game to be honest. I know my friend felt sorry and uncomfortable about his win. And none of us would be angry at a judge telling us to play the game correctly.

How is that even a question?

I think @LagJanson is on point as to why this is happening. It just feels so unnecessary.

38 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Somebody (Chris Brown?) mentions in the latest OCX episode that they asked the streamers (Gold Squadron Podcast) to inform them about board state errors at a tournament, at around 47:00.

I would want that to happen to my game to be honest. I know my friend felt sorry and uncomfortable about his win. And none of us would be angry at a judge telling us to play the game correctly.

How is that even a question?

I think @LagJanson is on point as to why this is happening. It just feels so unnecessary.

Which I agree with. If a board state error is found and can be easily corrected, I really don't see why not. Mistakes happen, but everyone should is all faith try and correct them. While I think that GSP sometimes goes overboard, I prefer it to VTTV who was flat out wrong. If they want 100% non-interference, they should start casting Star Trek Attack Wing instead. At least in that game it is thematic to have a Prime Directive.

3 minutes ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:

While I think that GSP sometimes goes overboard, I prefer it to VTTV who was flat out wrong.

The issue is that "going overboard" is not always balanced if one of the streamer's friends is currently playing. The VTTV approach was to ensure absolute fairness as the #1 goal. You can't favor one side if you decided to be a passive observer.

I, for one, am glad that we've entered the arms race to blatantly cheating on stream in a way that cannot be reported to judges/marshalls according to the rules, should they be updated Armada-style. It'll bring skill back into the game, though not quite the same skill we all expected. It's really just the next evolution of X-wing, where people with good prestidigitation skills get ahead by changing (or swapping) dials and/or dice!

Wasn't is the Krayt podcast that originally called for cheating on streams or illegal lists, to make light of the shadiness that went unchecked? It seems FFG learned the wrong lesson from that

Wait, the Marshall was telling the judges at a premiere event to ignore part of the tournament regulations? That's ridiculous.

At Worlds, if a judge watching my game sees something wrong, please interrupt us. Judge non-interference is madness.

im so playing through RA1-2 as long as the snow keeps sticking around up here. thanks for that.

5 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

im so playing through RA1-2 as long as the snow keeps sticking around up here. thanks for that.

Same! But I'm also playing through 3 again, because that was my entry point for the series.

Also, listening to people who haven't seen the timeline try and guess what happens next is too great.

1 minute ago, Do I need a Username said:

Same! But I'm also playing through 3 again, because that was my entry point for the series.

Also, listening to people who haven't seen the timeline try and guess what happens next is too great.

I have 3, but never tried it... part of the Origins anniversary collection for C&C. Renegades is another one that I want to relive the cheese on. I loved C&C, was my favorite growing up... we should have gotten another Generals. 3 was decent. 4 was hot steaming garbage.

22 minutes ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:

I prefer it to VTTV who was flat out wrong

VTTV in the past corrected game states based on user response - I know - I've been corrected on stream... I was embarrassed, yes, but also quite thankful for the correction at the same time. I don't know what changed VTTV's position for the Nationals, but I also know that wasn't the only game state issue missed. It was just the biggest one because it was the finals.

3 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

I have 3, but never tried it... part of the Origins anniversary collection for C&C. Renegades is another one that I want to relive the cheese on. I loved C&C, was my favorite growing up... we should have gotten another Generals. 3 was decent. 4 was hot steaming garbage.

I liked 4, which I get is an unpopular opinion, but I like the idea of mobile bases. Not as good as the other ones, but not as terrible as everyone makes it sound.

Renegades is an FPS (Which you probably know, just making sure) with the most annoying voice barks in the series. Pretty fun though. The Multiplayer practice is a riot. Also, you can drive Mammoth tanks, which is pretty cool.

Never was any good at those old RTS games... I played Dune II back in the day by Westwood and loved it, but was BAD. C&C, a little bit... was super bad. Warcraft? ACK... Too many choices, too quick - wait, stop invading and let me think!!!

Toying with HotS right now though. I've played a couple of games similar and I like the setup of this one better, and the character crossovers from other games I find interesting.

1 minute ago, Do I need a Username said:

Renegades is an FPS (Which you probably know, just making sure) with the most annoying voice barks in the series. Pretty fun though. The Multiplayer practice is a riot. Also, you can drive Mammoth tanks, which is pretty cool.

I loved Renegades, it was the only FPS I used to play. So much fun to sneak into bases and spread out some mines!

Red Alert 1 and 2 belong to the greatest games of my childhood! No chance against Warcraft 2 and 3, but such a good campaign mode. I stopped after Generals.

1 minute ago, LagJanson said:

I played Dune II back in the day by Westwood and loved it

Yes! Although, going back to an RTS where you can only select 1 unit at a time would probably be an NPE.

Anyone else excited for that new Battletech video game? From what I can tell it has Arcs and Giant Robots which is a good start.

5 minutes ago, sirjorj said:

Yes! Although, going back to an RTS where you can only select 1 unit at a time would probably be an NPE.

Oh heck yeah. I went back to Dune after doing poorly with the early path systems in C&C and was very sad.

Also - Total Annihilation was a blast. Also terrible, but mah custom units!

Just now, LagJanson said:

Oh heck yeah. I went back to Dune after doing poorly with the early path systems in C&C and was very sad.

Also - Total Annihilation was a blast. Also terrible, but mah custom units!

I think there was a 'Dune 2000' or something that was a more modern remake. I probably have that CD in a storage bin around here somewhere.

And TA with some add-ons was a blast. I remember playing that in college.

Just now, Boom Owl said:

Anyone else excited for that new Battletech video game? From what I can tell it has Arcs and Giant Robots which is a good start.

Battletech simultaneously makes me nostalgic and salty. The video games always trigger me with the re-interpretations of the mechanics which I had to spend years memorizing...

2 minutes ago, sirjorj said:

I think there was a 'Dune 2000' or something that was a more modern remake. I probably have that CD in a storage bin around here somewhere.

There was... don't bother finding the CD as it really didn't capture the magic of the original.

@clanofwolves - Success. Thread derailed. We may resume clean-up operations of this train wreck now.

19 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

Never was any good at those old RTS games... I played Dune II back in the day by Westwood and loved it, but was BAD. C&C, a little bit... was super bad. Warcraft? ACK... Too many choices, too quick - wait, stop invading and let me think!!!

Toying with HotS right now though. I've played a couple of games similar and I like the setup of this one better, and the character crossovers from other games I find interesting.

HotS has been my go PC competitive game for a while. It is casual enough to be silly, but I can try hard if I want to.

HotS will always be Heart of the Swarm for me.

Starcraft has many great Disney song parodies by the way!

Edit: Found my old playlist for laddering!

Always fired that up, hit zerg and started with an 8 or 10 pool, then switched to random or terran. So much fun was had back then!

21 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Anyone else excited for that new Battletech video game? From what I can tell it has Arcs and Giant Robots which is a good start.

oh yea, I'm a backer and pretty f'in pumped. Battletech was my first ever mini's game, played it back in the early-mid 90's along with MTG when I was still in grade 5-7 I think? So much fun. I still got some mini's kicking around I'm sure.

14 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

Battletech simultaneously makes me nostalgic and salty. The video games always trigger me with the re-interpretations of the mechanics which I had to spend years memorizing...

There was... don't bother finding the CD as it really didn't capture the magic of the original.

Which is funny because J.W. was involved in the first few Mechwarriors and Mechcommanders I think... and he wrote the original game. He is major part of this game too, and it is the closest version to tabletop you can get I do believe. Some mechanics had to change for balance reasons, but the beta was fun and looked very pretty. I'm excited for the campaign.

going to get very hard balancing wife, son, work, Battletech, Overwatch, Legion, X-Wing, and sleeping soon.. Very tough.

6 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

Which is funny because J.W. was involved in the first few Mechwarriors and Mechcommanders I think... and he wrote the original game. He is major part of this game too, and it is the closest version to tabletop you can get I do believe. Some mechanics had to change for balance reasons, but the beta was fun and looked very pretty. I'm excited for the campaign.

That'd be nice if the new game is like the table top. Retire MegaMek (actually, I retired THAT years ago...) Yeah, I get triggered by lack of consistency, and the MechWarrior games seemed to meander a bit. Yes, balance and enjoyment purposes were most likely the causes, not whimsy. I'm actually craving to throw some 'mechs on the table again. Need to refresh my brain and re-learn how to use my force to defend the trophy at GenCon.

14 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

going to get very hard balancing wife, son, work, Battletech, Overwatch, Legion, X-Wing, and sleeping soon.. Very tough.

I see your problem there. You've got too many things to balance. Eliminate sleep, and that should help. Sleep is for the weak anyway.

5 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

I'm actually craving to throw some 'mechs on the table again.

I was too, until I saw our local community and decided I'm not in that body odor class, so I opted out. The power of cheetos and redbull is too strong there...

14 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

I was too, until I saw our local community and decided I'm not in that body odor class, so I opted out. The power of cheetos and redbull is too strong there...

That's how I feel about MTG - I mean, it's also not that fun of a game IMO - but I've smelled my FLGS on a Friday evening and I would definitely never want to play Magic now.