One thing we aren't taking into account, the average cruiser costs a few million credits and isn't really something that normal people would waste just to win a battle. Not to mention the personnel casualties involved or the other resources squandered just to take out one threat. Suicide tactics are rarely a viable military option. Desperation, however, will lead people to take extreme measures.

26 minutes ago, crashnburninc said:

One thing we aren't taking into account, the average cruiser costs a few million credits and isn't really something that normal people would waste just to win a battle. Not to mention the personnel casualties involved or the other resources squandered just to take out one threat. Suicide tactics are rarely a viable military option. Desperation, however, will lead people to take extreme measures.

That’s nothing compared to the cost of a Death Star though. Also, the one instance of this being done was entirely a spur of the moment tactic. If properly planned out, a cheaper ship could be retrofitted or even purpose-built, with largely automated controls/a droid crew/remote controls/a rescue pod for the crew to bug out with built into the command bridge, etc. Similar things could be done on a smaller scale with bombers vs destroyers (just make sure the bombers can actually go fast), and so on. The reason it’s not is simply that it wouldn’t make for a good story.

1 hour ago, crashnburninc said:

One thing we aren't taking into account, the average cruiser costs a few million credits and isn't really something that normal people would waste just to win a battle. Not to mention the personnel casualties involved or the other resources squandered just to take out one threat. Suicide tactics are rarely a viable military option. Desperation, however, will lead people to take extreme measures.

These sorts of discussions always derail the original purpose of the threads they creep up in. It comes down to either being a viable tactic for mass implementation which undermines existing canon or a rather difficult to orchestrate/expensive etc. Option. Different people see it different ways, but what I will say is that there is no end of examples of self-sacrifice in Star Wars... it’s basically one of the main themes that is repeated... and as we can see in our own world, it’s also the tactic that those with little power facing overwhelming military power often use.

All that said, Episode VI was the last episode of real Star Wars, so you know which side of the debate I fall on.

Now can we return to the discussion of the books merits lol?

Is there any chance someone would be able to post Darth Maul's statistics? I heard Maul's stats in this book are a reflection of him in Rebels and thus would be weaker than he would be in Phantom Menace and TCW?

I'm brand new to the game, having just switched over from SAGA. I just purchased the EoE core book and Forces of Destiny beginners box today at a local game store. It is going to be awhile before I have enough money to be able to pick this book up (even if was able to, it is sold out everywhere in my area).

Hi and welcome to the forum

We could answer a few questions about Maul but posting of significant stats isnt allowed. There are guidelines to follow.

The stats for Maul are from Rebels and not from the Prequels, that is before the Clone Wars. So Dawn of Rebellion stats for him are stronger than he would be then in episode 1. Rebels ends just before a New Hope or episode 4.

Cool and understandable.

Looking forward to getting my hands on this book eventually, and seeing his stats. Been waiting for a book like Dawn of the Rebellion before investing in FF Star Wars. One of the main reason I was holding out on SAGA so long. As a GM, I love to give the PCs a major antagonist to chase/have a rivalry with, and from personal experience having one of the named villains has a greater appeal to it for some.

-Can someone at least tell me if Vader has stronger stats than Maul? Just for curiosity/fan fiction reasons

8 hours ago, Sincereagape said:

Cool and understandable.

Looking forward to getting my hands on this book eventually, and seeing his stats. Been waiting for a book like Dawn of the Rebellion before investing in FF Star Wars. One of the main reason I was holding out on SAGA so long. As a GM, I love to give the PCs a major antagonist to chase/have a rivalry with, and from personal experience having one of the named villains has a greater appeal to it for some.

-Can someone at least tell me if Vader has stronger stats than Maul? Just for curiosity/fan fiction reasons

Vader (force rating 6) would wreck maul (force rating 4)

Was able to pick up a copy of the book this week at the local game store. Pretty good book potentially worth the 40.00. It is a little on the thin side but the quality oft the hardcover, content, and illustrations within make up for that. What you expect from Fantasy Flight.

The Major goodies are the NPC stats for curiosity sake and game play. I like how the NPCs are scattered throughout the book and sectioned into worlds with some story seeds revolving around the planet. The additional statistics for universal specializations, talents, skills, weapons, and vehicles towards the tail end of the book was formatted well.

Overall I thought the statistics for the heroic/villain characters was pretty spot on. (Except for 1-2).

On 4/27/2018 at 8:28 PM, EliasWindrider said:

Vader (force rating 6) would wreck maul (force rating 4)

Vader has better total overall statistics numerically..but Maul is right behind him (literally one point in almost everything except force). So, I would say, according to Dawn of the Rebellion at least, that Vader takes a duel between them 6-7/10 times with Maul having better than a punchers chance each round.

That being said, being a Vader "Mark" I thought that Vader's stats were a little low. The sidebar on page 5 for the "iconic NPCs" about altering their stats to fit your campaign helps in keeping the fan boys at bay. ?

Vader being only adversary 4... feels low.

To be honest if you take the view that Star Wars is Lucas's campaign, which seems to be FFG take when they first started at least. Then Vader is only a Rival. The Emperor = Nemesis. Right?

19 hours ago, Sincereagape said:

So, I would say, according to Dawn of the Rebellion at least, that Vader takes a duel between them 6-7/10 times with Maul having better than a punchers chance each round.

Someone should set up a Sorry About the Mess Exhibition Match for them to duke it out.

12 hours ago, AK_Aramis said:

Vader being only adversary 4... feels low.

He's also packing Durable 3, Parry 5, Reflect 5, the Improved version of both of those, a base soak value of 7, and plenty of strain to fuel Parry/Reflect, as well as plenty of wounds to sponge up what little does get through. You might be able to hit him, but actually causing any serious harm to the guy is another story.

So if you don't have a Breach weapon (like a lightsaber), then you're not going to be doing a whole lot of damage to him, and with that many ranks of Adversary (3 reds if attacking in melee or at medium range there's a very good chance he's going to get a free crack in at you in the process.

5 hours ago, Donovan Morningfire said:

He's also packing Durable 3, Parry 5, Reflect 5, the Improved version of both of those, a base soak value of 7, and plenty of strain to fuel Parry/Reflect, as well as plenty of wounds to sponge up what little does get through. You might be able to hit him, but actually causing any serious harm to the guy is another story.

So if you don't have a Breach weapon (like a lightsaber), then you're not going to be doing a whole lot of damage to him, and with that many ranks of Adversary (3 reds if attacking in melee or at medium range there's a very good chance he's going to get a free crack in at you in the process.

That is not enough! I want to be able to run this scene time and time again just when the PCs become invested into their characters!

Darth_Vader has entered the game.

TPK

J/k ?

8 hours ago, Sincereagape said:

That is not enough! I want to be able to run this scene time and time again just when the PCs become invested into their characters!

I know this was said as a joke, but given there's posters here lacking a sense of humor...

Scene in question was Vader brutally dismantling a large minion group of Rebel soldiers, who at the start had enough numbers to have a dice pool high enough to hit Vader with some of their shots and have enough uncancelled successes to actually inflict a few points of damage in the initial round, but also rolled enough threat to let Vader use his Improved Parry to begin whittling down the group before he started doing so literally with a combination of lightsaber strikes and the Move power.

For those who have the book.....is it odd to anyone else that Maul does not have Reflect? Part of me wants to add it to his Talent list, but part of me wants to keep his stats RAW for the player group.

Also: We had our first session last week, and had a lot of fun. Maul is at the top of the pyramid in terms of being an antagonist. This was my first time GMing FF Star Wars and the group had some diff with two rodian mercs who turned out to betray them in the end by sniping Malefax from Mountain Top Rescue just after the PCs converted him back from the dark side.

We're planning to run first part of Lure of the Lost next (Warden) then a small job for them to get credits for lightsabers, then the FaD GM Kit story (Crystals!) and then finish up with last parts of Lure of the Lost. Rav will be one of the PCs former Master during the Clone Wars (Sentinal Shadow who edges on the grey). In between the stories they will have visions of Maul doing some heinous things.

I'm really giddy/excited to throw Maul at them. But I'm afraid that he'll wreck them. What do you think about a 4th or 5th session encounter with Maul? Will they survive (They should have at least 50-75 exp by then each, all of them started at RAW. So far Three Force Users and One Smuggler/Scoundrel [Balances out all of the Ancient Weapons and Hokey Space Religion at the table]). With hopefully 5th PC on the way. When should I bring out Maul aka the Iconic NPC?

2 hours ago, Sincereagape said:

For those who have the book.....is it odd to anyone else that Maul does not have Reflect? Part of me wants to add it to his Talent list, but part of me wants to keep his stats RAW for the player group.

Also: We had our first session last week, and had a lot of fun. Maul is at the top of the pyramid in terms of being an antagonist. This was my first time GMing FF Star Wars and the group had some diff with two rodian mercs who turned out to betray them in the end by sniping Malefax from Mountain Top Rescue just after the PCs converted him back from the dark side.

We're planning to run first part of Lure of the Lost next (Warden) then a small job for them to get credits for lightsabers, then the FaD GM Kit story (Crystals!) and then finish up with last parts of Lure of the Lost. Rav will be one of the PCs former Master during the Clone Wars (Sentinal Shadow who edges on the grey). In between the stories they will have visions of Maul doing some heinous things.

I'm really giddy/excited to throw Maul at them. But I'm afraid that he'll wreck them. What do you think about a 4th or 5th session encounter with Maul? Will they survive (They should have at least 50-75 exp by then each, all of them started at RAW. So far Three Force Users and One Smuggler/Scoundrel [Balances out all of the Ancient Weapons and Hokey Space Religion at the table]). With hopefully 5th PC on the way. When should I bring out Maul aka the Iconic NPC?

NO, it doesn't seem odd to me at all. We never see Maul deflecting blaster bolts and canonically, his training had been for the purpose of killing lightsaber wielding Jedi , not blaster wielders.

36 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:

NO, it doesn't seem odd to me at all. We never see Maul deflecting blaster bolts and canonically, his training had been for the purpose of killing lightsaber wielding Jedi , not blaster wielders.

There are plenty of times animated Maul has deflected blaster bolts in both The Clone Wars and once in Rebels.

About :55 seconds in

Season 3 of Rebels episode Holocrons of Fate Maul deflects the blaster bolts of one member of the Ghost Squadron (wanna say sabine or hera). At this point Rebels and TCW are canon. Dawn of the Rebellion is modeled after Rebels.

On 3/1/2018 at 1:48 AM, Underachiever599 said:

Oh, I'm fully aware. I just feel it's underwhelming that they stat out Vader as barely better than a straight-out-of-the-CRB Inquisitor.

Basically all of the FFG Material is build around the idea of PUGs with fresh chacters starting at 150xp knight play and stopping to play together after a few sessions at about 300xp.
Everyone else is expected to just build their own stuff and buy splatbooks not aimed at them regardless because of a nice location here and there and some new bloated mechanics or new gear. And naturally the new specs.

It's an odd focus for their publications. I don't really get it.

On 5/12/2018 at 3:03 AM, Sincereagape said:

That is not enough! I want to be able to run this scene time and time again just when the PCs become invested into their characters!

For that he definitely needs a bit more extra stats, because that's what most PC groups can do at 300-500 XP. Slaughtering minions in 1-2 rounds of combat. ?

Was wondering if anyone has ran any of the "Modulated Encounters" from this sourcebook yet? And if so, how successful was the session/story?

Edited: Removed specific example due to planning to run Play by Post Game on these forums

Does anyone have stats for the Sphyrna (Hammerhead) Corvette?

2 hours ago, AshleyFall said:

Does anyone have stats for the Sphyrna (Hammerhead) Corvette?

Are you talking about the ship from Rebels and Rogue One , or from KotOR ? If the latter: there's this . It's from the Shipyard found on This is the Blog You're Looking For . If you want the one from Rebels/Rogue One, that's on page 129 of Dawn of Rebellion .

On 5/25/2018 at 3:00 PM, Sincereagape said:

There are plenty of times animated Maul has deflected blaster bolts in both The Clone Wars and once in Rebels.

About :55 seconds in

Season 3 of Rebels episode Holocrons of Fate Maul deflects the blaster bolts of one member of the Ghost Squadron (wanna say sabine or hera). At this point Rebels and TCW are canon. Dawn of the Rebellion is modeled after Rebels.

Could these not be explained just as easily as Maul's defense, soak, or missed attacks, from a narrative perspective? Does he NEED the talent?

4 hours ago, KRKappel said:

Could these not be explained just as easily as Maul's defense, soak    , or missed attacks, from a narrative perspective? Does he NEED the talent? 

I've not followed this exchange, so forgive me if I restate something already said.

Parry and Reflect are almost fundamental to the feel of a skilled lightsaber warrior in this system. They convey the mechanical flavor of Jedi/Sith fighting much more than any other part of the game. I wouldn't say they're needed, but there should be a good reason for their absence.

10 hours ago, KRKappel said:

Could these not be explained just as easily as Maul's defense, soak, or missed attacks, from a narrative perspective? Does he NEED the talent?

Well, at some level nobody needs any talents, and everything can be narrative. I think the game works best when the mechanics underscore the result and you don't have to invent a rationalization. Once can be an accident, sure, but repetition suggests control...in game terms, an XP investment.