This is just wondering what you guys think...I know there is always slight differences in fluff, but I was wondering... to my knowledge slayers run around naked. Slayers, like most dwarves tend to be proud, tenatious, and stubborn. Now in my adventures, the group will be heading to Nippon or Cathay. Being based on Feudal Japan and Dynasty China these will be a people of great honor, discipline, and manners (at least that is how it would be portrayed). The problem will lie in the conflict of the Slayer's natural tendences and agression vs the culture and hospitality. What do you guys think? Do you guys have any problem with the Slayers and social encounters because of the inherent fluff?

I'd think the troll-slayer should be a reluctant/forced participant in any thing he has issue with - formalities, ceremonies, etc. He can grumble and complain, but if you have to do something then you have to do it. Seems like it should be good roleplaying!

Yeah, of course you are right. Slayers are just an odd character class being mostly unsocial and suicidal.

I have always found slayers hard to deal with from a GM's perspective. I know they can be all sorts of fun to play, but their one-sidedness has a tendency to force combat and/or agressive situations that may not have happened without them. That said, I have toned down the anti-social, fanatical, suicidal, etc. in my campaigns. I encourage characters to play out the grief and shame in other ways like sullenness or exacerbating the inherent stubbornness and intolerance that dwarfs embody. I see the slayer oath as a very personal thing. Someone else can't step in and tell a dwarf exactly how to do it. Is someone really going to stop your slayer in the street and tell him he isn't doing it right because he wears a shirt or even leather armor? (I hate to railroad a player into something just because that is how it is portrayed in the fluff.) If a player really insists on playing a slayer, I try my best to help them have fun, but the suspension of disbelief only goes so far. We play in a fairly realistic campaign (relatively speaking of course). If they insist on playing in a suicidal manner - fortune can only get them out of so many situations. Eventually that kind of behavior leads to its natural consequences... Another concern is how the slayer's actions impact the group. I remeber one campaign I ran when no matter how carefully the party planned and prepared, nearly all of their efforts were ruined by the slayer. Instead of leading monsters into an ambush or even just sneaking past them, the slayer always forced combat. Of course the others all jumped in to save their buddy, but they suffered some serious consequences and set backs because of it. It lead to a lot of tension between players and although it sometimes enhanced the roleplaying feel, sometimes it was very negative. I guess everyone has to find the right balance for their game and players, but those would be my suggestions.

We've never had that problem. Have you read any of the Felix and Gotrek stories?

I don't think of Slayers as suicidal exactly. Or the term doesn't work exactly.... they have sharp bits if they wanted to just be dead they could hack some of their own limbs off and bleed to death. So I don't see them as suicidal so much as redemptive... if thats a word! They want to go out big in such a way to redeem whatever transgression made them a slayer or at least take away the shame from the family/clan.

A slayer might avoid a fight against a bunch of two bit hoods if there were so many that he might actually lose... there isn't any glory in getting killed in a back alley by a thieves guild. He wants to die fighitng at a bare minimum a troll... if not a giant or a demon or something better!

Pretty sure in one of the very first Gotrek Gurnnisson stories he actually grudgingly thanks Felix for saving his life becuase he was almost shot dead by some nobody and that would have been a shameful way to die. So I don't think they have to look for fights everywhere or try to actively die. Just need to seek out challenges or for sure not avoid them, and think of glory over defense... but don't 'just' want to die.

Thinking about it... the samurai might find a lot to like in a troll slayer. His ways are weird - not just committing sepuku immediately - but choosing death to save face is what they are all about!

Thnx Awes... good input. The player in question is really into slayers(dwarves in general) so it won't be easy to persuade him against acting the way they are portrayed, but I have a few ideas on how to make him a bit more manageable in these areas. If not, then he may get his oath's wish- haha. The saving grace of they semi-annoying (actually I enjoy his slayer) slayer class is it has a built in character-fix. haha.

A raving and violent lunatic is a social problem in most parts of the world, even Cathay. But Slayers aren't raving violent lunatics.

Jericho said:

It's true, Troll Slayers are often statted with the Frenzy equivalent in games (including BB and WAR), which makes people think they're frothing loonies. But Troll Slayer psychology would be more aptly described as suicidal bravery.

Herr Arnulfe said:

Not true. In WFB they are unbreakable, which means they won't run away, and in BB they are Dauntless which gives them a better chance of taking on bigger opponents. In neither case, and indeed in all the WH lore, there is nothing supporting the concept of slayers as frothing maniacs.

They are suicidal, in that they seek their own death, but it is a considered and measured suicide aimed at regaining honour. If they die causing the deaths of their friends by being stupid, they won't regain their honour. I feel that if people are playing the frothing lunatic, they are getting slayers confused with berserkers.

I think slayers are problematic in that they won't run away once a fight has begun (running from a horde of scumbags is dishonourable), which means that friends will often stay in the fight because the slayer is staying. However, the slayer seeks an honourable death and will be measured and deliberate in choosing the manner of their death - they want it sung of, after all.

Slayers can move in any society, albeit awkwardly, but they won't be able to conceal what they are.

Bertolac said:

I believe Blood Bowl Slayers have both Dauntless and Frenzy. WAR Slayers have a frenzied rage-type ability. This could be a case of shoe-horning Slayers into existing mechanics to avoid creating a unique Slayer ability, but I do think it can cause misunderstandings if players aren't too familiar with the setting.

Forgot that.

However, I don't think nutter-slayers can be blamed on other games. I actually think what happens is that players see the imagery, think 'barbarian' and don't read the background. I'd love to play a slayer myself (I'm always the GM in WFRP - someone else did it once...it wasn't WFRP) as a sombre, intense and impossibly noble; staunch friend, loyal companion and searching patiently and deliberately for a fitting death.

I think people get too involved with sterotyping these characters. I played Vampire from White Wolf and they had a character type that was crazy- it was built into the character class (Malkavian Vampire). The problem was whenever people wolud want to play them they would always make these over the top Robin Williams characters. Sometimes it worked but mostly it didn't. After a while I would have to explain to them that most "crazy" people don't talk to animals and chop people up with knives (although some do, of course). I would have them read up a little on mental illness and they would find out that there isn't mush fun or cool about being mentally diminished. It can make an interesting character- but not something you would WANT to be if given the choice. I think Slayers can be looked at in a similar light. They can be all arrogant and crazy like Gotrex, but there isn't many stories that are written about them. I would think of them as way way more tragic characters, like failed Samurai or something similar.

Hivemind said:

Well, this Slayer-Oriental setting matter is two sided:

- First: Slayers are commonly little rough and and not so polity. They dont really got anything to lose - that why the additude. But it doesn't really come with the career, it is just result commonly. Slayer could be polity also if it chooses - being diplomatic dont usually just get you to fights...

- Second: Slayers are Dwarfs and Dwarfs do like oriental (Nippon, Cathay) way. If we use historial Japan and China as base for Nippon ja Cathay, then there are Samurai type of honorable warriors ready to die for their master, people driven to perfection in their field of expertise, customs...etc. This is very much Dwarf-way also. Dwarfs lack of respect to humans time to time is because how humans behavior is - They are strange race that can back-stab each other. Dwarfs dont do that. But among the oriental-humans there are more respect aspects that Dwarfs feel their own.

SO, in short - Slayer could be very respect among the oriental-folk, and Slayer may also find their way respectful and like it. Especially those Samurai-type of warriors.