Argh!

For some reason- the herald now seems so complicated its crazy!

Avi: For the Masks Idea, that's actually pretty cool- I will use it for the "Servant of the Crawling Chaos" version of this priest, which won't have any of the forced fleeing abilities. But I would need a few things to add to it, which I am currently pondering, so it won't be up until later on this evening.

Veet: Well, the idea was that the investigator would be forced to flee if he fails the first combat check, and every subsequent round after. He'd have no choice in the matter- so even if he doesn't want too, or he thinks he can beat the monster if hadn't rolled 18 Ones in a single turn, he'd have to try to run away.

The General theme is running when logic would dictate to stay and fight- so failing the horror check causes you to drop your weapons and try to escape, stopping the combat and wasting your turn. If you succeed, well- your gone, but the monster is still alive, you'll have to fight it all over again some other time. Exhausted items are still exhausted, and you would have to try the horror check once more if you want to fight it again- which, I believe you can do right away, right? You can do more than a single combat per turn as long as your still on the same square.

The second ability is the same- if you don't kill the monster after your first combat check, instead of mutually engaging blows until either you or the creature is dead- You try to escape. If you succeed, then you gotta start back at square 1 later, doing a horror check all over again. If you fail, the creature attacks you while your back is turned, getting essentially a free hit.

All in all, monsters will force you to evade them twice- if your unlucky. Once for failing the horror check, another time if you don't kill it right away.

The other two abilities are very thematic as well- the more you find out about the priest (Getting clues), the more sanity you lose. As you run from monsters, you realize the inevitability of the priest catching you and devouring you. But by embracing this and going crazy (picking up madness), or pushing away the knowledge from your mind (sacrificing clues), you gather the resolve to keep on running a bit further

Finally, as for the "not to be described" ability, for this guy, i changed into something that, even though its horribly worded, I think is also appropriate. Instead of throwing fight or lore check to escape Leng, Speed or evade checks would be necessary. Failure means the priest catches up- and devours the investigator.

Sorry to bring back a really old Herald- but I want him to be playable, so any help rewording the entire thing would be very appreciated!

I will have a new Mask based one up by this evening.

Edit- Quality better now? Or did you mean the picture itself wasn't cool enough? Because I really liked that Picture I have another one for the Mask Version though, that's closer to the description in the story.

One more question about Abnormal Possibilities: is that supposed to be one sanity per clue or just one sanity to pick up any clues at the location?

One sanity per clue would be more fitting- but you can choose how many you want to pick up.

Just a couple initial thoughts. Gates to Leng are rare enough that the penalty for sealing them doesn't seem like enough. Make it a sneak check only (and disallow Elder Signs). Otherwise just take out the ability changing it to sneak/speed, since it's essentially only taking up space (not really adding to game difficulty).

Also, do you mean for each clue token gained to cause a sanity loss? Or just one sanity loss when a person stops to pick up clues in a location?

Oh, I see Veet already asked it ;'D

Maybe have him force open gates to Leng?

Start of the Game- Place the two gates of Leng on this sheet instead.

When a gate opens, roll a die. on a 1 or 2, replace it by a gate to Leng from the sheet. If there are none available, raise the terror level by One. Gates to Leng cannot be sealed (Even with an elder sign), and must be closed by passing either a sneak or speed check instead of the customary fight or lore. Investigators who fail this test are devoured.

What this means- gates to Leng will see a lot more action, and it will force player to constantly keep closing them or raise the terror level. If the gates are ignored, the Terror Level will rise up- and gate surges will ensure that the streets are flooded with monsters that will really hinder investigators.

To top off the lot, I was thinking something along of the lines- "Whenever an Investigator is devoured, add a doom token to the track". That would make him really intense, as the high priest throws his victims into the pit in his room, a sacrifice to the outer gods. Then again, this seems like a perfect ability for the mask version...

Saldre said:

I'd save it for the masks (since several of the masks devour).

Um, again, I'd just the entire sneak/speed thing, since it's not likely to make a difference in game mechanics, just in theme and it'll be taking up text space and reader's attention (my general rule is if something doesn't significantly add to the game, don't add it). I like the idea of having the gates recur and raise the terror track. I'm not sure if it's necessary to make them unsealable though. What do you think that adds to the game or the theme? I mean, the herald already seems fairly difficult. Although I'm still not entirely sure what exactly you have in mind for its final abilities. Or if the above image, plus this latter bit is your draft for it?

Hmm, and having him raise the Terror Level would be good for Hastur :')

Here's some abridged text I've come up with so far:

An investigator taking clues from the board loses a sanity per clue.

Investigators failing a horror check or a combat check must then make an evade check (ignore ambush) to try and end combat. A failed evade check results in taking the monster’s combat damage and continuing to a new round of combat.

Investigators who successfully evade a monster gain a Yellow Sign token.

Investigators with 4 Yellow Sign tokens are devoured.

---

I'm unclear about whether you want investigators to only be able to remove one of their yellow signs per turn, or all of them.

Saldre: you mentioned my name with Nyarlotep heralds, but I guess you means Rodjuvet's ones.

For your herald, there are 2 stark fears paragraph. Was it because you did not know which one to choose ? I like the first one, the second one makes has less impact (usually, when everything goes fine, there is no second round :-).

Veet said:

I like this herald very much. It came back to my mind when I realized from which short story it comes from. An excellent tale. The very beginning of it is one of the best starting words of Lovecraft :

"It is true that I have sent six bullets through the head of my best friend, and yet I hope to show by this statement that I am not his murderer. At first I shall be called a madman - madder than the man I shot in his cell at the Arkham Sanitarium. Later some of my readers will weigh each statement, correlate it with the known facts, and ask themselves how I could have believed otherwise than I did after facing the evidence of that horror - that thing on the doorstep."

Therefore, it may be interesting that instead of being devoured and simply removed from the game, the possessed investigator stays around and make "nasty" things until someone "sent six bullets through the head" (and take astenath himself ? :-).

Finally, I am not so sure why you used that picture ??

The bit about allies being replaced by monsters was meant to represent that, I thought about doing the same thing when an investigator is devoured but I already did that with Herbert West, it's still a possibility though.

The picture is supposed to depict the conclusion of the story, true it's actually Edward in Asenath's body but in reality Asenath was Ephram all along to boot (or possibly someone much older). I went for the iconic image of the thing on the doorstep for the herald and figure the pretty little Asenath will be conveyed through the image on her ally card.

amikezor said:

Heh... Actually, I kindof agree with this. In a way it would be more thematic if it were just failed horror checks that caused the investigators to flee (despite not being as difficult).

@Veet

One minor issue, "dice" is plural, "die" singular. You might want to correct that (although maybe not yet).

@Veet:

Where do cultists of the Herbert West go when defeated ? To the Herald (I guess so although nothing is mentioned on the Herald) ?

When terror level reaches 3, the cultist are -3, 3 stamina, right ? If it reaches 6, they are combat -6, stamina 5... and I do not even want to compute actual number for terror 9. So, if used with anything that boost the terror track, this is a really nasty herald... am I correct ?

I did translate Asenath and am translating the Gut Doktor.

For Asenath, I was thinking, why not keeping the bonus she brings to the investigator. In the short story the victim feels really powerful at the beginning, doesn't he ? It would a be a two-sided coin (just a thought).

amikezor said:

They go to the Herald. I'm 99% sure. But you're right, it's not stated. And yes, they get insanely powerful if you let the terror rise. You'll see what that feels like when you play scenario two ;'D

I just thought of an interesting device. The doom track triggering the terror track. I.e. one of the things I hated about one of the difficulty level cards is it shuts down the common item store from the beginning of the game, but, let's say a herald was made that bumps up the terror five or six after the doom track reaches five... Then... Heh... It'd work well on a Hastur or an Azathoth herald.

amikezor said:

Sorry guys, your posts are a little old, but I'm reading the Herbert West herald only now (started thinking about how to beat Avi's Scenario 2)... I do not understand really the maths here. On the herald sheet, it's stated that Cultists have - X combat modifiers, where X is the terror level. What do you intend exactly for combat modifiers? Both the Combat rating and the Combat damage? In this case, when terror hits 6, shouldn't be -6 combat rating, 6 combat damage, and so on?

And another question: when an investigator is devoured, you have to raise the terror level by 2. Fine. This means that I have to discard two Allies from the game. And thus the terror level should increase by another 4. Isn't it a loophole?

(and sorry if you've already answered to these questions somewhere else in this thread - it's not as easy to follow, at least for me)

Julia said:

Hrm... By combat modifier, combat rating is meant. Throughout the manual "modifier" means adjustor of die numbers, however you're right, combat rating is a specialized term. Oh well ::rolls eyes::

::Sigh:: (I'm sighing at the convoluted rules and terminology in case there's any confusion).

Mmmm... So, when the terror is at six the cultists will have five toughness and a -6 combat modifier, they'll only do one damage per hit though.

The allies aren't all returned to the box when an ally is discarded, because discard and return to the box mean different things (i.e. when you return an ally to the box, that's one thing, but when you discard an ally, you remove it from play and return it to the ally deck, that's something else).

Veet will confirm, but it is just the combat rating that is -x (the number of dice you loose).

no loophole since you raise the terror when allies are discarded (not returned to the box). Discarded barely happen, maybe with the exception of duke and sir william brinton. I had the same question some post ago :-)

By the way. Veet, Herbert now haunts the french wiki.

edit: ok Avi you're first ;o)

Avi, Amikezor,
thank you for your answers. You're absolutely right about discarding / returning to the box, my fault (especially when Avi three months ago explained my this point in a different thread)! And yup, got it, the increased toughness is related to the fact that when Terror hits 6, you have 2 shops closed. I made some confusion since Amikezor talked about stamina and I thought - for some curious reason I cannot really figure out - he was referring to the stamina damage the monsters deal, not to their toughness.
Everything is clear, then. Thank you!

Sorry been lost in the hills all day so couldn't post sooner, yes the guys are right on both counts and I will change modifier to rating on the herald for future use.

Veet said:

Veet: since you are around, cultists return to the herald when defeated, right ? Maybe you can add this too. :-)

Yes!....will add that too.

OK made the corrections, remind me if I missed something. Previous postings should update but for anyone who doesn't want to wade back 15 or so pages.....

I still wish I could find a better picture....

This may have been mentioned earlier, but if you raise the terror level by 2 when an Ally is discarded, would that include the Allies discarded when the terror level rises? If so, each terror level rise would be a jump of 3 instead of 1. Or is "discarded" specific to when investigators must discard an Ally, as opposed to being "returned to the box" when the terror level rises?

When the terror level rises allies are "returned to the box" not "discarded". If that were not the case this herald would simply start the game with the terror track at 10 and 10 super-cultist-zombies running around.