I thought Id share this pearl with you all. I just got a playing group together and of the 4 of them only two of them are even remotely familiar with the 40k Universe. I am pretty well versed as Ive been an avid fan for 20 years so I sell them on the idea. Being grim dark neophites they all have ideas that fit very easily into my plan and are about what youd expect for new players in a military campaign.... that is all except one.

One player wants to play...... wait for it....... a Ratling, Sniper, Psyker.

Now when I heard this a couple of things happened. The first that my mind screamed at the mental image of a hobbit looking psyker running around the battlefield, the second was I wanted to slap him for having asked to play such a non cannon character, then the last stage of my revulsion cycle was actual contemplation. Upon moderate inspection I could not find a rule based reason to deny him his request. He could be from a Ratling world which gives him some Ballistic Skill ability at a low level but enough to make him feel "sniper-ish" and then have developed powers only to be hauled off on a Blackship where he was then selected to endure the Sanctioning process. The Rules seem to back it but the side of me that loves cannon was still retching in disbelief of the concept. With further contemplation I had to admit that with most things involving "variety" in 40k; it is almost impossible to say something DOES NOT exist given the sheer span of human existance. Something may be exceedingly rare but on a long enough timeline with enough people involved you can find just about anything. Somewhere there has to be a Space Wolf Long Tooth Veteran sitting in a recliner eating chicken wings while watching My Little Pony and wearing a beer stained robe. Oh god my grey matter just popped again.

Ratling World precludes the use of the Psyker specialism. Ratling specialism does not grant the Psyker trait. This combination is not possible to use under the official rules as written.

I see that you Sir are correct and that I need to read my publications more thoroughly. That being said it only addressed the Game Mechanic issue which as GM I am willing to bend for a good story and if it isnt totally beyond any physical possibility. Since the second half of my initial messages addressed that specific issue I stand by my decision. I also have to mention that the descrition of why Ratlings cannot be support specialists didnt seem to make a lot of sense to me; though it is late here and I am more than a little tired as I read it now.

This was meant to be more general entertainment to get a chuckle out of some fellow fans of the genre rather than a rules discussion.

I wanted to nip any spree of ratling psykers in the bud on the basis of a rules misunderstanding. =P You're quite welcome to waive anything you want in your own game.

Good point

narrative wise, a Ratling is an Abhuman, and that alone prevents them from being officially sanctioned by the Adeptus Astra Telepathica. Unsanctioned Ratling psykers would...either be food for the Golden Throne or killed outright, if not caught out right.

The setting itself would destroy such a character by sheer merit of it's own grittyness. Your takling about an Imperium that puts people to death for falling outside the genetic template of 'pure' humanity by a mere 3% margin even if no obvious mutations exist.

Do it if you want to, cuz fun is always first, but it's no way compatible with the canon.

Might as well make him a Space Marine while you're at it, since a Ratling Sharpshooter Psyker already shreds all canon.

Oh come now gentlemen and Necrons amnd Blood Angles would never work together either right? Oh wait.... Dont get me wrong Matt Ward is a Cannon killing retconning machine but my point stands to at least a degree.

@Cogniczar, your statements thouygh accurate for the current editions of 40K are in my opinion a bit short sighted when looking at 40K lore as a whole. We are also talking about a mythos that at one point had Regiments of Beastmen, Dwarves on Harleys, and Limosines with laser weapons. As I said if we take the Lore as a whole and realize the sheer exspansive size of the universe; there are many manymore permutations of existance than those that we see touted today as the "only" way things can be. I completely agree that a Ratling Psyker is a largely ridiculous idea, but to say that it is impossible to exist given the entire 40k Mythos, and the statistical probability of odd ball things happening with the number of variables we are talking about is a bit narrow minded (in muy opinion).

To be clear I would never encourage large scale use of this mindset but its is the way in which I am at some level justify in what I view as a rational way the existance of such a generally ludicrious character.

In the end the fact that my conscience hurt for even defending the idea means I need to address this with the player. Since im using Minion rules for companions I'll simply have him go with a standard Psyker and a Ratling as a companion.

In the end the fact that my conscience hurt for even defending the idea means I need to address this with the player. Since im using Minion rules for companions I'll simply have him go with a standard Psyker and a Ratling as a companion.

Why?

Canon is good and well but should never impede fun. Canon IMO should be used to depict NPC's and the setting. e.g. the orthodoxy of the setting. That shouldn't mean a certain concept isn't possible. It's just uncommon/extremely rare and will likely have certain consequences (perhaps even repurcussions) in game as NPC's will react to him. In an army of untold billions, the player will still remain unremarkable but it will allow the player to play something special that appeals to him.

It's one thing to object to a concept because the player wants POWER!!!! A close combat space marine riding an emperor titan who just inherited a RT warrant and a voidship is to be stamped upon heavily.

But a ratling psyker who has learnt to snipe? What's so bad about that?

Obviously, you'd have to come up with a background that does fit the setting. If sanctioned ratling psykers are not done, he obviously has to be an unsanctioned psyker. Which makes it even more likely that he is a sniper. That's his main profession and cover. Or maybe he's the result of a dalliance between an psyker inquisitor and a ratling and has enjoyed the protection and support of his father before seeking his fortune in the IG. Where he has to make sure the commissars never discover his hidden talents....

The main thing is to keep the character concept compatible with the other player characters regarding power. If you can do that, you should allow it. Because the player will likely be happier if he can play his character concept instead of the compromise you came up with to fit the game's canon setting. Which doesn't really exist anyway.

You make a great point. To be clesar the "sniper" request of his was dropped during generation. I mentioned it simply because if the humor of his initial character concept. He didn't know what he was asking for but to someone who knew more of the lore it was pretty funny.

For what it's worth, I had a "Telekinetic Psnyper" character concept. There's, what was it, Gate of (to?) Infinity that creates portals spanning whole kilometers? What more could a sniper ask for than making distance meaningless? Open a portal in front of you to somewhere in clouds, then make it rain. For added fun, use a fully automatic sniper rifle. Cheesy, but "fun".

If not specifically a Ratling, you could provide the Size (3) Trait as a mutation instead, strip "Ratling only" prerequisites away, or otherwise fulfill the one or two desires that the player has from the Ratling package. That way, the character is still reasonably human.

@Cogniczar, your statements thouygh accurate for the current editions of 40K are in my opinion a bit short sighted when looking at 40K lore as a whole. We are also talking about a mythos that at one point had Regiments of Beastmen, Dwarves on Harleys, and Limosines with laser weapons. As I said if we take the Lore as a whole and realize the sheer exspansive size of the universe; there are many manymore permutations of existance than those that we see touted today as the "only" way things can be. I completely agree that a Ratling Psyker is a largely ridiculous idea, but to say that it is impossible to exist given the entire 40k Mythos, and the statistical probability of odd ball things happening with the number of variables we are talking about is a bit narrow minded (in muy opinion).

A Ratling Psyker has always been possible since the first edition of the wargame, Rogue Trader. That's not even a stretch of the imagination.

A sanctioned psyker has never been possible, due to one of the immutable pillars of this variant setting. All canon, no canon, or however Lynata says, is still based on these immutable pillars - no non-human sanctioned psykers, no female marines, etc.

By no means take my last post as an attempt at discouragement. Have fun! It's totally above and beyond canon adherence. But let's not kid ourselves that it's something that can fall in the grey miasma of the setting. (The SANCTIONED ratling psyker)

Well I have another Ratling story.... A player that had been playing a heavy weapons specialist but never really used his heavy stubber to pin opponents. Sure enough the character died. He then chose a ratling sniper, who actually planned some attacks. First attack used his longlas then charged in with his knife....so one of the group gave him an autopistol to use in melee when required. Two encounters later he is starting combat with the autopistol rather than the longlas. So grey matter exploding and ratlings, there you have it! ;-)

Don't see why not realy,. Ratlings have Always been used as snipers. Now the psyker part is more tricky. Well obviously he's not gonna be astra telepathica, but maybe the character's psychic powers are just started to develop. Maybe something happened when the regiment was in warp transit and a normal ratling sniper started feeling, funny, starte feeling he could do things with his mind. Now He'll have to keep his powers secret or the commisars will send him to the Emperor (either on a Black ship, or with a bolt round to the head.)

And before you say there are no unsanctiond psykers in the guard: Read the Gaunt's Ghosts series. Altough that guy was found out to be a wyrd.

A sanctioned psyker has never been possible, due to one of the immutable pillars of this variant setting. All canon, no canon, or however Lynata says, is still based on these immutable pillars - no non-human sanctioned psykers, no female marines, etc.

Everything and nothing is true .

As far as official products go, Games Workshop enforces a very loosely defined threshold somewhere in the middle of "100% consistency" and "anything goes" that seems primarily determined by whether or not a product fits the general look and feel of the setting. This is why there are sometimes huge discrepancies between GW's own codices and BL novels or FFG books, even though they still do not cross a certain boundary.

However, the players are of course not bound by this threshold, but only by what they want for themselves. In a franchise that does not have a canon to begin with, how would non-human sanctioned psykers or female Marines be any "less canon" than female Vostroyans, flirty Sororitas or Primarchs surviving Titan-grade plasma weapons?

It comes down to what you can "justify" both for yourself as well as for the group of people you are playing with. Ideally, the setting on your table will be a sort of consensus between everyone's own interpretation and preferences for the setting.

I myself have a pretty stubborn bias towards Games Workshop's version of the setting, but nonetheless we have to acknowledge that GW also wants us to shape the game and its world towards how we as players would like it. As far as its creators are concerned, the setting is exactly as open as you'd want it. The only thing we need to be aware of is that in a Pen&Paper RPG, every participant needs to share a common ground.

"It all stems from the assumption that there's a binding contract between author and reader to adhere to some nonexistent subjective construct or 'true' representation of the setting. There is no such contract, and no such objective truth."

-- Andy Hoare

Yeah, there's a few things that have been, or that that GW would like us to believe have always been consistent (lots about Space Marines, and their Primarchs), and then there is those areas that they have left intentionally vague, to allow their fanbase to feel a certain sense of ownership in the product, like the various SM Chapters and Foundings. I don't know how many of you have actually taken the time to buy a "complete", expansive, competitive, and versatile army of Warhammer 40,000 miniatures, to play against another person who has done the same, rather than just gotten drawn into your next fun role-playing environment, but I choose to believe, almost without exception, that you did NOT do so cheaply, or quickly, and once you've invested $1,000, and possibly as many hours into fabricating your force of Ultramarines, Cadian Shock Troops, Thousand Sons CSMs, or Biel Tann Eldar, you might just want to say you have some say in what they do, such as color scheme, kit-bashing, or making up your own Chapter, Craftworld, Sept, or what have you, and they left it open enough that you can say "these are Adamant Dragons Chapter of Space Marines. They are an off-shoot of the Salamanders, so I used a lot of those models, but their color scheme is white and silver (sort of like diamonds), where their parent chapter is green and gold. They are also pale like the snow of their homeworld (if you see one with Space Marine Sanshelmetitus, and note he's white, even though Vulkan's blood turns you charcoal color, but so what?) They also favor lightning claws, where their parent chapter likes..." That is perfectly doable, and if they follow rules, and don't look like White Scars, nice job. I'm pretty sure one point in the GW cover story, the two Lost Primarchs weren't even so much "heinous and erased", as they were "left vague, that you can make up Chapters of your own", without feeling constrained to follow the Smurfs, the Sparkly Twilight Vampire Marines, or whichever Space Marine Chapters you like or know. I am a big fan of the Imperial Fists, for instance, but I am NOT a big fan of their yellow paint scheme. I don't care for Jango Fett (he didn't happen, for me, nor Mass Effect 3's cash grab on him, Zaaed Masani, but whenever I see an IF in that yellow power armor, I half expect him to explain how his group went off an became "godamn heroes", in a wanky, Australian? accent. The yellow is also sort of bad on its own. You want Space Marines with purple and gold, white with blue trim? Either's fine, and have at it.

I know plenty of people who would say stick with the stuff as presented, and too hell with personality. I can be one of those, and in OW, DW, DH, or a game with Adepta Sororitas, I'd probably be that way, as I'm sometimes a story-tool, that way, but pictures on the Internet, and my own personality failings, I could enjoy a sultry Battle Sister, Eldar who at least SEEM to willingly cooperate with inferiors, or what have you, and in a game of DW, I would certainly grumblingly eat the canon, and let someone play a female Space Marine before I'd try to shoehorn in a PC Inquisitor/AdSor to follow them around. I firmly back the "there are no female Space Marines", from the angle of the story as I know it, but I'm going to make the game WORK, first, and then try to like it, after that. Hell, if I can get past the bit of, in my group of friends who role-play, there are no women, most of the time, and my personal hate-hurdle, there are no interpersonal interactions, between players, because either there are no girls, and two guys don't want to play as if they are in a relationship, or there is one, and she doesn't want to play that way, if she isn't already dating said other player, (I'd possibly kill for one game where something resembling consensual romance between two players happens, but I might have to hire an actor), then I can get over a female Space Marine, or even a Nun with Guns who might hearken a bit more to her life prior to the convent, if that terrible pun is clear. It's a grimdark world, but these are still human beings, different though they may be.

As an aside, if I had a player who wanted to be a psyker, and also a Ratling, I'd ask them why? Is it real reason, or are you just going for silly (like I might)? Whatever they say, I'd probably say sure, and let them, then we decide if they are Sanctioned, or if they are hiding it. A Tau? No, the material has effectively said they can't, yet, but Ratlings, Ogryns, and them are, to the best of my understanding, still rudimentarily Human, with heavily tweaked genetics, as a result of our tinkering (Navigators), and/or environmental adaptation (heavy worlder), so whatever says Bob the Human CAN develop psyker powers also says John the Ratling can, if maybe just not nearly as often. They both have a soul, and that seems to be critical (sorry Necrons). I'm rather flexible, once I've been placated out of my comfort zone.

or even a Nun with Guns who might hearken a bit more to her life prior to the convent, if that terrible pun is clear. It's a grimdark world, but these are still human beings, different though they may be

*nervous twitch*

What they said. Everything and nothing is canon. Some things are more canon than others. I'd imagine a ratling psyker would be executed on the spot, but it's not that huge of a stretch that he'd be sanctioned, and no stretch at all if he was unsanctioned. Do what feels fun, break the fluff in half if you want. I'm also someone who'd just say okay if a player wanted to play a female space marine, and not an inquisitor or an SOB. Like Lyanata said, more important than any particular source is your table agreeing on what version of 40k are you playing in.

Are you playing in a dead serious grim dark tragic universe where atrocities are as limitless as the stars? Are you playing in a slightly less grim dark version that can actually be taken seriously? Are you playing in a black comedy? Are you playing in an over the top setting of machoness and high adventure? A setting all your own?

Or are you playing old school, when a half Eldar was the chief librarian of the smurfs, Space Marines were regular dudes in power armor, Space marines were space cop not space monk, Space Marines held Eldar babes like they were on the cover of a bad movie, proto Sister of battle were referred to as super secret internal police space marines, and they sold female space marine minis?

I really wish I still had that picture of the female space marine thing. It was definitely an old picture, they had sister in their name and black beakie power armor that didn't have the flourishes we currently associate with them.

And Zoats and Slann in 40k!

And for sheer WTF/awesomeness you can't beat Exodites: Eldar on Dinosaurs!

I'm still waiting for codex Exodites. (With the eldar getting codex upon codex nowadays this might actually happen.)

I really wish I still had that picture of the female space marine thing. It was definitely an old picture, they had sister in their name and black beakie power armor that didn't have the flourishes we currently associate with them.

This one ?

On a sidenote, one remarkable thing about the Sisters is that (barring their visual design) their description from the RT days never actually changed but was merely expanded. The design notes for the 3E Witch Hunters codex even specifically point that out. Unlike with the jumps between later editions, many background details were changed when 40k evolved from Rogue Trader into 2E, but the Sisters were unaffected - admittedly, they only had a four-paragraph-blurb on a single page, so there was not much to go with anyways.

Oh, and the actual quote was "everything and nothing is true" - remarkably, GW seems to intentionally avoid the term "canon" altogether, and it is only a section of the fans that bring it up again and again. Novel author Aaron Dembski-Bowden did a really good explanation, linked in the previous post!

Not quite that one, though that is a great example of the minis I was talking about. It was a drawn pictures, 2 females in black, beakie power armor. I believe they may have been wearing caps. And it was a pretty short description. I've never read RT cover to cover, so whether the image is actually in there, or was in a White Dwarf comic. If they weren't explicitly sisters, then they were definitely part of what would eventually be SOBs as we know them now.

Oh wow, that may be one I am unaware of then. Probably an early WD as I have at least a .. umm, digital copy of the RT rulebook. For posterity.

Gimme a poke if you ever find it again!

The only picture of a Sister in the RT book was this one .

Yeah for sure. I'm pretty sure it was a WD as well, art style was the same, but I've only ever seen it once or twice. I ever stumble upon it again I'll be quick to share it.

http://eldritchepistles.blogspot.be/2013/07/bryan-ansells-rogue-trader-space.html

Found a nice site thas cool picks of ye old timey SM minis. Is it just me or does the death eagle (nr 410614) have boobs?

(Sorry can't paste here for some reason.)