Here the news.

Anyone willing to go to Sarnath?

I tough that got destroyed?

For a fairly solid reward (clue, Unique and 2 ES), Sarnath doesn't appear to be too difficult. Darrell Simmons might actually be a viable one to send in.

Whereas I want to grab ES Michael and send him to the City of Gugs, ideally with a Shotgun in hand, get those Perils!

Compared to the pain he (it?) is in AH, Ghatanothoa looks rather weak in ES, especially his final combat. If the number of dice rolled increased at each Midnight (first attack, each investigator rolls 1 green, second attack, 2 green, etc.) it would bring about the end sooner. Also, can Harvey/Michael use their ability on G's attack ?

Dam,

fair points about who's the best for which OW, but remember OWs enter play facedown, so you don't really know whether you're entering the Dreamlands or Sarnath. Could be messy.

This seems more stand-alone than expansion as it changes most of the mechanics of ES. Not complaining as ANYTHING Elder Signs is good by me but I don't see it meshing into the original game unless the game starts in the museum and then goes out side through an event in game.

Still very excited to get this! Any further cluse as to when it is coming out besdies Q1?

As for Dam's second query (i.e., may Harvey and Michael activate their reroll abilities on Ghat's attack), I found the answer in the rulebook. Pag. 15 of the revised version reads:

Some investigator abilities can be used “once per roll.” This means that the player can use this ability only once each time he starts a new roll during an adventure.

Since investigators are not attempting to resolve an adventure while resolving Ghat's attack, Harvey and Michael cannot use their special ability

Admittedly, I'll remain the one detractor, as I'm never enamored by any system which replaces, instead of adopts, new aspects, especially for an expansion to a core game. In this case, I'm particularly crestfallen, as the game appears to have moved (or deteriorated) into a modified dice-and-card Arkham Horror lite, with much of the narrative gone.

Another expansion is always welcome, but I'm going to have pass on this one...I'm not sure what to call it, but an expansion, it is not.

Cheers,

Joe

My fellow investigator (i.e. my wife) and I really had no interest in playing Elder Signs anymore. I think we played the last expansion once and then had no interest in taking it off the shelf again. (We've played it a few more times with friends that wanted to play it. But we wouldn't have chosen it ourselves.)

This expansion sounds like it mixes up the mechanics enough to provide some interesting strategic and tactical choices.

So I am very interested in this expansion perhaps for the very same reason The Professor isn't.

Fenyx,

You might be exactly right. As the game now moves away from its roots, I'm inclined to immerse myself in the AH experience. When I have an hour and I want my Lovecraftian fix, Elder Sign will always be there. I hope that the new expansion draws both you and your wife back into its clutches (I mean that in the most positive way ).

Cheers,

Joe

You know my opinion on the subject is biased, so that feel free to discard what I'm about to say.

Joe: I see your concern. Problem is that Elder Sign is since the very beginning a lighter form of Arkham Horror, with an Ancient One trying to wake up, and Investigators trying to seal him away by collecting a certain number of Elder Signs (in Arkham you have to put six seals on the table, but there's not such a big difference, in my opinion). If you failed collecting the ES, you had to face final battle and eventually see Arkham succombing to its destiny. We have the same investigators pool, the same Other Worlds; the setting is inside a museum while Arkham is set on a wider map. So, the real question should be: what makes Elder Sign a different game? For me it's the fact that it's a dice game, whereas Arkham is a card-driven game. Indeed, with Gates of Arkham (which I agree, is more an Elder Sign 2.0: when I started the testing for this back in January last year, I was more or less "what the heck? this expands nothing, it's just another game") the game goes outside the museum, but then? I don't think a game in a museum could have been expanded endlessly: even Elder Sign: Omens moved outside the museum, with campaigns in the northern wastes or Egypt or the Pacific Ocean. But for me it's always Elder Sign: you have the same rules, the same "OMG let's roll the dice and pray I can kill that Dhole", the same tricks to avoid bad stuff. This expansion represents a turning point in the game (I hope): away from the womb of the museum, Elder Sign is free to reach greater horizons, going into places dear to the Mythos where Arkham could never go (and where neither Eldritch can go: indeed, you can add as many sideboards to the world of EH, but wouldn't it be awesome having an entire game set in the Heart of Africa? It's impossible for Arkham, it's impossible for EH, but we can have that for ES).

Additionally, the core game and the first expansion make ES a nice game, but players that really want to go deeper in strategy and tactics after a while will become bored. Our friend Dam played the game for a while (IIRC) with the doom track of each AO having a max of 5 spaces; and he was still able to win consistently.

How can you fix a game that has such problems of balance? Adding cards will dilute the problem, but will never solve it, and in the end the game will become so bloated that it will simply be horrible. In this way we have one expansion that is basically the perfect stand-alone game: it never suffers from dilution, and it provides quite a challenge (my win-loss ratio so far is 50-50, and agains one Ancient One I'm behind something like 20-80). And I do hope the next expansions won't be boosting Gates of Arkham, but provide a completely different setting. An Innsmouth-themed expansion, a "Shadows of Yog-Sothoth" campaign (if someone remembers this ancient RPG supplement) or something set in other mysterious places. I know I'll use all the investigators, all the AOs, all the many small cards (or most of them, at least) and I'll have a completely different challenge, having an everchanging game that will never grow old on me like the "old" ES did.

Fenyx: for fun, I played three games of this with one of my closest friend that was always in the "let's roll the dice, don't think about tactics since the game is easy" mood. We lost all games with zero Elder Signs collected. Additionally, it's one of the few games I played that, even if you're used to mop Arkham's streets, you still have fun losing.

End of the rant Thanks for the patience, I'm too a fanboy of this one, I guess