My character is looking to expand into Healer (specialization) and take Heal/Harm, but so far as I can tell all that will do is open up Medicine as a class skill.

Nothing else in the Healer talent tree will help with the Heal/harm power... am I correct? Surgeon says you have to make an actual medicine roll so youd have to actually ... you know... treat them.

I'm not reading this incorrectly right? The talent tree requires that you actually treat your patient as a normal Dr would and heal I guess would be more stop-gap...

I suppose it works : )

Correct, Heal/Harm gains no benefit from the Healer Specialization's talents. The only time Medicine checks are involved with Heal/Harm are in regards to healing/causing Critical Injuries, which don't benefit from Surgeon or Physician.

It might still be a good idea to go into Healer if you plan on being the group doctor anyways; but if all you're looking at towards healing is through the Heal/Harm power itself, then you're better off putting the XP for the specialization directly towards Medicine or in a specialization that gives access to 2 force ratings.

Correct, Heal/Harm gains no benefit from the Healer Specialization's talents. The only time Medicine checks are involved with Heal/Harm are in regards to healing/causing Critical Injuries, which don't benefit from Surgeon or Physician.

I think that they do. Physician and Surgeon both say "When the character makes a Medicine check to help a character heal wounds". The Heal/Harm power Control upgrade to deal with critical wounds says "For Heal, the Force User may make a Hard Medicine check as part of the pool to activate this power."

Therefore since this is a 'Medicine check' then Surgeon and Physician will both apply, and their bonuses will apply to the character who is being healed of the Critical wound. Additionally, since this is a 'Medicine check' than once per session a character with 'Natural Doctor" can reroll a failure on the Medical roll; but probably can not reroll the Force Dice part of the roll, just the Medical pool.

Note also that since this use of the Force to heal Critical wounds is also a 'Medicine check' then all the normal equipment modifiers for a Medicine check will also apply. Therefore if the character using Heal/Harm has no Medical kit, they will add a Black die to their roll. If they have a Portable Healing Kit they will roll normally. If they have a Physician's Kit they will add one Blue die and an automatic one advantage to their roll.

And for the truly pedantic I also note that this use of your Physicians Kit would not even, by the RAW, require that you actually be close enough to use the kit on that patient. With enough Range upgrades to Heal/Harm you could Heal someone of a critical wound from Long range, and gain a bonus from the Physicians Kit in your hands, or take a penalty from your lack of any medical tools in your hands - despite the fact that they're 50 meters away. This last bit seems a bit much.

Additionally, since this is a 'Medicine check' than once per session a character with 'Natural Doctor" can reroll a failure on the Medical roll; but probably can not reroll the Force Dice part of the roll, just the Medical pool.

The way the dice pool mechanics are supposed to work: you woul reroll the entire pool, including Force dice. Note the words "as part of the pool."

And for the truly pedantic I also note that this use of your Physicians Kit would not even, by the RAW, require that you actually be close enough to use the kit on that patient. With enough Range upgrades to Heal/Harm you could Heal someone of a critical wound from Long range, and gain a bonus from the Physicians Kit in your hands, or take a penalty from your lack of any medical tools in your hands - despite the fact that they're 50 meters away. This last bit seems a bit much.

It does, and I as the GM would be fine saying that you can't benefit from your kit unless you are engaged with your target.

And for the truly pedantic I also note that this use of your Physicians Kit would not even, by the RAW, require that you actually be close enough to use the kit on that patient. With enough Range upgrades to Heal/Harm you could Heal someone of a critical wound from Long range, and gain a bonus from the Physicians Kit in your hands, or take a penalty from your lack of any medical tools in your hands - despite the fact that they're 50 meters away. This last bit seems a bit much.

As a pedant, I'm currently imagining a Jedi using the Force to move various surgical equipment with the Force across a football field to heal someone at long range.

I think that they do. Physician and Surgeon both say "When the character makes a Medicine check to help a character heal wounds". The Heal/Harm power Control upgrade to deal with critical wounds says "For Heal, the Force User may make a Hard Medicine check as part of the pool to activate this power."

Therefore since this is a 'Medicine check' then Surgeon and Physician will both apply, and their bonuses will apply to the character who is being healed of the Critical wound.

The problem with allowing it though, is that it doesn't make sense. From a rules standpoint, sure you can argue it gets to apply since you have to activate the base power of Heal - which Heals wounds, and since there's a Medicine check involved - you get to slap Physician and Surgeon on, but it seems more like just trying to game the system.

Using a normal medicine check to heal criticals doesn't get the boost from the talents. Using just Heal by itself doesn't get the boost from the talents. So how does it make sense that a player can heal more wounds/strain with Heal with the help of the talents just because they're fixing a critical injury?

A player with 3 Intellect and 3 Skill ranks in Medicine can on a successful activation of Heal, recover 6 Wounds, plus and additional 6 Strain using a single light side point. This is before Strength upgrade activation, further skill or characteristic upgrades, and before Magnitude upgrades that let a player hit multiple people in range for the same amount. It really doesn't need Physician or Surgeon tacked on to when healing criticals, which are there in the first place because standard Medicine checks are more unpredictable since it's based solely on successes.

I think that they do. Physician and Surgeon both say "When the character makes a Medicine check to help a character heal wounds". The Heal/Harm power Control upgrade to deal with critical wounds says "For Heal, the Force User may make a Hard Medicine check as part of the pool to activate this power."

Therefore since this is a 'Medicine check' then Surgeon and Physician will both apply, and their bonuses will apply to the character who is being healed of the Critical wound. Additionally, since this is a 'Medicine check' than once per session a character with 'Natural Doctor" can reroll a failure on the Medical roll; but probably can not reroll the Force Dice part of the roll, just the Medical pool.

Note also that since this use of the Force to heal Critical wounds is also a 'Medicine check' then all the normal equipment modifiers for a Medicine check will also apply. Therefore if the character using Heal/Harm has no Medical kit, they will add a Black die to their roll. If they have a Portable Healing Kit they will roll normally. If they have a Physician's Kit they will add one Blue die and an automatic one advantage to their roll.

And for the truly pedantic I also note that this use of your Physicians Kit would not even, by the RAW, require that you actually be close enough to use the kit on that patient. With enough Range upgrades to Heal/Harm you could Heal someone of a critical wound from Long range, and gain a bonus from the Physicians Kit in your hands, or take a penalty from your lack of any medical tools in your hands - despite the fact that they're 50 meters away. This last bit seems a bit much.

Problem is you're not making a Medicine check to heal wounds; you are making a Medicine check to heal a critical injury. That's a "wound" (narrative) not a "Wound" (mechanic). Surgeon and Physician would not apply in that case, but I'd allow Natural Doctor to.

I think that they do. Physician and Surgeon both say "When the character makes a Medicine check to help a character heal wounds". The Heal/Harm power Control upgrade to deal with critical wounds says "For Heal, the Force User may make a Hard Medicine check as part of the pool to activate this power."

Therefore since this is a 'Medicine check' then Surgeon and Physician will both apply, and their bonuses will apply to the character who is being healed of the Critical wound.

A player with 3 Intellect and 3 Skill ranks in Medicine can on a successful activation of Heal, recover 6 Wounds, plus and additional 6 Strain using a single light side point. This is before Strength upgrade activation, further skill or characteristic upgrades, and before Magnitude upgrades that let a player hit multiple people in range for the same amount. It really doesn't need Physician or Surgeon tacked on to when healing criticals, which are there in the first place because standard Medicine checks are more unpredictable since it's based solely on successes.

Physician and Surgeon both represent extra knowledge of the body that lets you heal more. When you use the force to heal wounds you are telling their body what to do to heal. If you have extra knowledge you can tell their body better and they will heal more. Since Physician and Surgeon are more specialized than skill ranks in Medicine they do not apply to all circumstance. The current rules model this.

Problem is you're not making a Medicine check to heal wounds; you are making a Medicine check to heal a critical injury. That's a "wound" (narrative) not a "Wound" (mechanic). Surgeon and Physician would not apply in that case, but I'd allow Natural Doctor to.

The rules say that "A particularly dangerous type of wound is a critical injury." [sW F&D Beta pg 158 and SW EOTE p 216, under 'Critical Injuries']

Therefore Critical Injuries are a subset of wounds according to the rules. Therefore a check to Heal a Critical Injury IS a check to heal a Wound in game mechanical terms. Therefore any benefits that would apply to a check to heal wounds will apply.

Problem is you're not making a Medicine check to heal wounds; you are making a Medicine check to heal a critical injury. That's a "wound" (narrative) not a "Wound" (mechanic). Surgeon and Physician would not apply in that case, but I'd allow Natural Doctor to.

The rules say that "A particularly dangerous type of wound is a critical injury." [sW F&D Beta pg 158 and SW EOTE p 216, under 'Critical Injuries']

Therefore Critical Injuries are a subset of wounds according to the rules. Therefore a check to Heal a Critical Injury IS a check to heal a Wound in game mechanical terms. Therefore any benefits that would apply to a check to heal wounds will apply.

I'm going to argue that one; when you're using Medicine to help someone recover from wounds, you are attempting to recover the numerical amount of "Wound Damage" they have incured OR you're attempting to heal that person of a Critical Injury, as you say "A particularly dangerous type of wound". If you succeed at a Medicine Check to heal a character's critical injury, only the critical injury is removed.

Page 161, Medical Care it has two separate paragraphs talking about healing numerical damage (wounds and strain) and a separate paragraph about what happens when you try to heal someone of their critical injuries. There are sections later on taking about "Recovering from Wounds" and "Recovering from Critical Injuries". Separate actions, separate effects. At no point in the discussion of Critical Injuries is there any mention of wound recovery. They're separate effects.

But you know what? It's your game too. If you want to allow Physician and Surgeon affect Medicine rolls when used to recover Critical Injuries go for it.

At my table, they won't affect Medicine checks made to recover Critical Injuries.