To have a Tie Advanced but no Avenger is like..

A tabletop WW2 game that has Elefant and King Tigers but no Panzer 3 or 4 tanks...

The Avengers were used much more than both the Defenders and the Advanced series ...

The advanced was a prototype.. it really, probably shouldn't have much more to it other than titled upgrades or modifications. It was a great platform for that.. I feel there 8 no room for avengers because there are interceptors and defenders now.. no real reason to have them..

That's like saying there's no need for EWings because we have AWings and XWings...

Still... probably not enough for a new sculpt...

I could be wrong... but only time will tell. FFG has done unexpected things before.. I'm betting again avengers.. but I didn't play the video games.. so I'm not a fan of those.

They end up with better guns, better shields and less armour. The E-Wing stats really. Just give it a boost action and swap the upgrades for a missile and tractor beam upgrade.

I think it would be a good candidate for the first Imp ship with a segnor turn. I don't see such a maneuver staying faction specific for long.

Plus any Tie Fighter and a lot of X-Wing players will recognize it so it has "sellability".

To have a Tie Advanced but no Avenger is like..

A tabletop WW2 game that has Elefant and King Tigers but no Panzer 3 or 4 tanks...

The Avengers were used much more than both the Defenders and the Advanced series ...

The advanced was a prototype.. it really, probably shouldn't have much more to it other than titled upgrades or modifications. It was a great platform for that.. I feel there 8 no room for avengers because there are interceptors and defenders now.. no real reason to have them..

That's like saying there's no need for EWings because we have AWings and XWings...

I'll disagree here the A wing isn't here because of X wings, not part of the line and the X wing isn't a prototype.. the E wing is an upgrade of the X wing 20 or more years down the road.. really 2 different situations here.. and a bad example..

Still... probably not enough for a new sculpt...

I could be wrong... but only time will tell. FFG has done unexpected things before.. I'm betting again avengers.. but I didn't play the video games.. so I'm not a fan of those.

They end up with better guns, better shields and less armour. The E-Wing stats really. Just give it a boost action and swap the upgrades for a missile and tractor beam upgrade.

I think it would be a good candidate for the first Imp ship with a segnor turn. I don't see such a maneuver staying faction specific for long.

Plus any Tie Fighter and a lot of X-Wing players will recognize it so it has "sellability".

Creating a new mold for a similar ship is expensive, they can just give the Advanced the same upgrades and use titles or modifications and get the same results.. the wing change and the oblong cockpit aren't important, and personally I feel the avenger is fugly.. but that's just my opinion..

like I said, I could be wrong.. all these speculation threads get tiring after a while, the OP did it because he did one like this a year ago or so and just likes Marek and wants more of him in the game.. I threw out some comments but in the long run I think either late this year or early next, FFG is gonna release the info on their ideas to 'fix' the advanced,.. and I'm sure there will be all sorts of whining and crying about it as it won't fit everyone's idea of what they wanted.. I'm sure that is also when they will either reveal an new ship type to go with it, or they will just package it in the old advanced mold.. it's always been out of our hands anyway...

There are a few other ships I'd rather see them do, but a fix for the advanced is something I would really like to see to make them more interesting to run, or slightly more cost effective..

As I've mentioned its more than cosmetic. Certainly more distinct than say the yt1300 and yt2400.

I don't want a fixed tie advanced that negates any point in FFG making a tie avenger

I feel the Defender negates the Advanced anyway. Vader is 27 pts, the generic PS1 Defender is 30. With a better attack, shield and dial. And with the current all or nothing PS, you only lose an extra action, which is huge for Vader, but nothing for every other ship not running PtL.

If anything, I think the Advanced should be priced like an X-Wing, which just isn't doable.

The E-Wing is the Tie Avenger stat-wise.

Subtract the droid slot. Change Torp Slot to Beam Weapon Slot.

And here you have it.

I wish FFG would leave the Tie Advanced alone. Darth Vader is not broken, and I don't need the other Tie Advanceds.

A unique ship for a unique pilot.

Darth Vader

Engine Upgrade

Expose

Not cheap, certainly, but nobody laughs at that one.

Best arc dodge.

Best turtle

3 attack dice with Target Lock, when in position.

Adding more attacks, a cannon slot or a system slot is not the way to go here. The TIE Advanced needs to be different from the Interceptor and the Defender, and preferably more than just a little. A 0-point modification that adds a second missile slot, maybe? If you wanted to boost the generics without making Vader too powerful, just at a 0-point title with an effect similar to R2-D6.

The way I see it, there is no way to 'fix' the other pilots without making Vader insanely OP. Maybe a title for the 'Advanced' Only, not the 'Advanced X1'?

The way I see it, there is no way to 'fix' the other pilots without making Vader insanely OP. Maybe a title for the 'Advanced' Only, not the 'Advanced X1'?

How could Vader become 'insanely OP' anyway? He deserves a boost as well.

The way I see it, there is no way to 'fix' the other pilots without making Vader insanely OP. Maybe a title for the 'Advanced' Only, not the 'Advanced X1'?

I dont see any problems with Vader being insanely OP.

I honestly wouldnt complain if they turned Vader into some 5atk 5agi monster, it is vader after all

I'm almost certain FFG will have taken care of it and we now just have to wait and see what they have done....

Dare I say we're waiting on the boat?

There are many ways to fix the TA, but unless you give it an entirely new dial it'll never be used.

Here's my take on how on some Tie Advanced title cards.

Each expansion for a specific ship, gives it some flavor and something unique to the ship. Rebel Aces makes the A-wing the only ship that can take two EPT cards. Imperial Aces makes the Intercepter the only ship that can two modifications. Keeping that in mind, a Tie-Advanced expansion needs to be enable something that only that ship can do. Let's embrace the "experimental" aspect of the ship.

In the vein of "experimental":

-- Illicit Modification - Title - 1 points - Tie Advanced only:

You may equip an Illicit upgrade card.

With Scum and Villainy coming out, the Tie Advanced could be the only ship outside of the faction to equip these upgrades. Yea, it's weird, but it would make the Tie Advanced stand-out.

-- Experimental Modification - Title - 0 points - Tie Advanced only:

You may equip a modification card for a cost of -2 with a minimum cost of 0.

This encourages more experimentation with the ship. Want hull upgrade, engine upgrade, or an additional shield? You can do it for a lot cheaper. Experimental Interface becomes almost a must-have at 1 point.

These ideas add a lot of flavor and variance to a ship that's competing to be unique with all of its peers. By making modifications cheaper, you're encouraging experimental changes. The illicit upgrade takes this idea to 11 by allowing completely new options for an otherwise bland ship.

My idea to fix the TIE Advanced: a title card (let's call it Avenger) that gives it the Expose EPT without the action cost.

For Instance....

TIE Avenger (title)

At the beginning of the Combat Phase you may reduce your Agility by 1 to increase your Attack by 1.

Cost: 4pts

I think that would improve its damage dealing capacity without stepping on the toes of the Interceptor or Defender. Additionally I like the idea of a ship that your opponent doesn't know if it'll be hard hitting or hard to kill. It'd be a nice versatile problem solver ship that could fill multiple roles in a list depending on a players need for a specific game or round within a game. It'd be nice to have a ship that could either deal damage or tank it, without having to play the price to both at the same time. Heck, I already like giving Vader Expose; its served me well even if people think I'm crazy for doing it.

I still think pilot skill is an elegant way to do it.

[Death Star mk 1] title card, cost 0

Increase pilot skill by 3.

Hell yeah...another TIE Advanced thread and another dollar in the TIE Advanced jar!

Hell yeah...another TIE Advanced thread and another dollar in the TIE Advanced jar!

You bet.

As I've mentioned its more than cosmetic. Certainly more distinct than say the yt1300 and yt2400.

Please tell te uninitiated how so? Especially within the context of this game which already has a "faster more maneuverable ship" a "tougher" ship and it still looks like 2 existing ships cobbled together, and not an improvement on either.

There are many ways to fix the TA, but unless you give it an entirely new dial it'll never be used.

I also had forgotten about the illicit slot. That would be good too.

I really don't care what the fix is for the advanced but it should be modified so it can stand a chance of killing Luke+R2D2 in the endgame. Most of the times, if the last ship you have against you're opponent's last ship is Luke and AreToo, you're screwed.

Rakky, here its a quick breakdown:

The Avenger compared to the Advanced had twice as many lasers. Actually the same type and quantity as the Interceptor and the Defender class.

It had much better shields. In Tie Fighter it had twice as many shields as an X-Wing.

It also had less armour than the Advanced.

Speed and agility wise it was comparable with the Interceptor and A-Wing.

The Avenger also could carry many more missile, and could even swap them for a space bomb!

The Avenger was the first snub fighter to mount a tractor beam.

And lastly it looks way cooler!

I know I've mentioned it before but stat wise it would be identical to the E-Wing.

Avenger is hideous.. all other things aside, it's fugly..

I wish FFG would leave the Tie Advanced alone. Darth Vader is not broken, and I don't need the other Tie Advanceds.

A unique ship for a unique pilot.

Darth Vader

Engine Upgrade

Expose

Not cheap, certainly, but nobody laughs at that one.

Best arc dodge.

Best turtle

3 attack dice with Target Lock, when in position.

Fwiw, outmaneuver is better since it's cheaper, doesn't cost an action and procs in the same situation you'd likely use expose.

I say this as someone who has started flying Vader at 39 points with Outmaneuver, Prockets, and EU. It's a ton of fun and works well, but there are a lot of choices that will be more effective for those points.

Rakky, here its a quick breakdown:

The Avenger compared to the Advanced had twice as many lasers. Actually the same type and quantity as the Interceptor and the Defender class.

It had much better shields. In Tie Fighter it had twice as many shields as an X-Wing.

It also had less armour than the Advanced.

Speed and agility wise it was comparable with the Interceptor and A-Wing.

The Avenger also could carry many more missile, and could even swap them for a space bomb!

The Avenger was the first snub fighter to mount a tractor beam.

And lastly it looks way cooler!

I know I've mentioned it before but stat wise it would be identical to the E-Wing.

And in the context of this game there really isn't room for it or a need for it. You said it yourself:

"same type and quantity as the Interceptor and the Defender class"

-same firepower as 2 existing ships in the game.

"Speed and agility comparable to the interceptor"

-same maneuverability as a pre-existing ship

More shields than advanced and less armor (hull)

-same HP as Hull and sheild upgraded interceptor

AND it looks like an advanced with interceptor wings!

The only real difference you noted was more missiles and space bomb and beam weapon. More missiles is t going to happen, it's the one thing the advanced has that makes it interesting and anymore and you're looking at bomber territory. And a non-bomber with a bomb? As cool as it would be to have an interceptor dial to drop bombs with, again, it doesn't fit in the game.

Beam weapons:

This is where it is IF, and it's a pretty big if because of the above reasons, it happens. The only thing the empire has right now is "advanced tech" (and scum is getting that soon) so it could happen. But, again, how do you fit a ship so like other 2 ships based off a third ship into the product line without making it just a better __________? Title is my answer.

And why would you want to? There are a lot of much better looking and more interesting tie offshoots for that production slot and that would fit in the games context, and look different: droid, predator, hunter...