3 pips. Unless their jawas. In which case, UTINNI!!!!!!!!!!!!

1 base, 1silhuette, 1range.

You’d need a lot of upgrades to that power, and I think you’d need more pips to spend.

You get one Silhouette increase per Strength upgrade, but I believe that each one requires a pip, and you start at Sil 0. So, Sil 1 is just one Strength upgrade.

You get one range band increase per Range upgrade, and you start at Short. So, the first Range upgrade would get you to Medium, the second Range upgrade would get you to Long. And using each of these upgrades would require one pip each, for a total of two pips.

Then you need one pip to activate the base power.

By my math, you’d need a total of four pips to toss an enemy up to Long range and then let them fall, and to reliably get that without having to convert dark side pips, you’d need more than four dice — more like six or seven.

So, yeah — if you’re FR 6, or you’re FR 4 as a darksider who doesn’t mind spending both light and dark side points, then you can play Popcorn Time with your enemies, and squish them one at a time.

Of course, that Force Move can be resisted by the target, so if they successfully resist then you just spent those pips for no effect.

Technically all you ever need is four pips (1 to activate Move, and 1 for each Upgrade type).

Every single Upgrade gives all the ranks of it's type that you purchased for the low, low cost of one pip.

Here's Range:

Range Upgrade: Spend [one Force point] to increase the maximum range at which the Force user can move objects by a number of range bands equal to the number of Range upgrades purchased . The Force user may activate this multiple times, increasing the range by this number each time. However, remember the Force user must still spend Force points to activate the power’s actual effects.

Important sentence bolded.

So for one pip you can move them out to Long if you purchased all 3 Range upgrades. For two pips out to Long x 2... which is how far again? How many pips to flip that Jawa into orbit?

Note: Strength may not be activated multiple times, so Sil 4 is the top out, which means at most like what? Light Freighters, shuttles, and small Patrol Boats can be tossed about... or snatched from the sky and smashed to the ground like an ANGRY GOD!

Important sentence bolded.

Thanks for that correction!

So for one pip you can move them out to Long if you purchased all 3 Range upgrades. For two pips out to Long x 2... which is how far again? How many pips to flip that Jawa into orbit?

The range limits seem to be exponential, so two pips on Range would get you to Extreme, four pips on Range would get you to Close, and so on.

Note: Strength may not be activated multiple times, so Sil 4 is the top out, which means at most like what? Light Freighters, shuttles, and small Patrol Boats can be tossed about... or snatched from the sky and smashed to the ground like an ANGRY GOD!

Yeah. I’m wondering how someone manages to do something like grabbing a Star Destroyer and pulling that down.

What are people's thoughts on keeping/improving (to all force powers) the current version of Force Assault, but making the talent harder to reach, much as Niman Disciple's own +1FR talent is hard to access?

By removing the connection between Force Assault and the Reflect above it, the cost for Force Assault goes from 75 to 110 minimum... while making Nimian's FR2 cost more to access than it would otherwise.

This pushes back any potential abuse by delaying the Nimian's access to higher force ratings, mastered force powers, or anything else that requires XP

What are people's thoughts on keeping/improving (to all force powers) the current version of Force Assault, but making the talent harder to reach, much as Niman Disciple's own +1FR talent is hard to access?

I think that's perfect.

I'd say that in light of dropping Force Assault down to something along the lines of what I suggested, removing the connection between Row 4's Reflect and leaving the power as-is (usable with Move) works to balance out the talent.

With the understanding that removal of the connection to the row 4 reflect is nessisary for balance reasns regardless...

...I'm going to come back around to my original assertion. Why pigonhole the "force useing saber style" into just move object?

...I'm going to come back around to my original assertion. Why pigonhole the "force useing saber style" into just move object?

Because!

With the understanding that removal of the connection to the row 4 reflect is nessisary for balance reasns regardless...

...I'm going to come back around to my original assertion. Why pigonhole the "force useing saber style" into just move object?

Likely due to the pre-existing EU lore (which again, FFG has shown a full willingness to mine the EU for material, even if it's no longer "canon") which cites that Niman's combat-related Force usage revolves around telekinesis.

While I cannot argue that FFG may well go with that line of reasoning, I feel it would be unnesisarally limiting and go against the very "genericness" they seem to be going for with the carears in F&D.

While I cannot argue that FFG may well go with that line of reasoning, I feel it would be unnesisarally limiting and go against the very "genericness" they seem to be going for with the carears in F&D.

The problem isn't that Niman Disciple is too focused, just that you want it to do more than it already offers.

Yeah. I’m wondering how someone manages to do something like grabbing a Star Destroyer and pulling that down.

They don't. Because the 'Force Unleashed' is stupid.

Just my opinion.

Yeah. I’m wondering how someone manages to do something like grabbing a Star Destroyer and pulling that down.

They don't. Because the 'Force Unleashed' is stupid.

Just my opinion.

Force Unleashed was a video game who's big draw was to be as "over-the-top" as possible. It was meant to be the equivalent of a fun "beat 'em up" style of game, not a statement on how Force users should be protrayed in terms of power. It was a one-off (originally) simply to let players revel in the destructive potential that the Force offered but prior video games never really capitalized on.

Though in regards to the Star Destroyer sequence, that was less Starkiller pulling it from orbit and more him guiding it along the lines of a controlled crash; it was still coming down no matter what he did, the only difference was the amount of planetary devastation that could have been caused if it'd just been allowed to crash without outside direction.

As the story goes, George Lucas was shown a tech-demo by guys at LucasArts, which was an unnamed Force user pretty much causing all sorts of TK-based carnage as part of the demonstration. At the end of which, George (allegedly) said "Make that game, I want to play it." And so, Force Unleashed came about. Given that the majority of other Star Wars media, most notably TCW, didn't go the route of over-powered Force shenanigans, it's safe to say that even the Lucasfilm staff didn't see Force Unleashed as being any sort of guidebook on how powerful Jedi or Sith were meant to be in the Star Wars setting.

Starkiller was also very unique in his training, and his potential. He should never be seen as a standard for common force use.

I actually like FU because it shows the limitations of the force user, even one as BA as starkiller/vader. Ignoring the dramatic license of destroying tie's with lightning blasts, NOTHING in force unleashed is beyond the mechanics presented in FFGSW IMO (with the star destroyer being a narrative thing, that he couldn't stop it but at least slow it down).

But There is a fine line between FU and the over the top EU things that just make my eyes roll. So I don't sweat anyone that doesn't like those more flamboyant and flagrant uses of power.