Location of Cards whose ability I like to use:

May I use the movement ability on Wildrider Squadron if it's at a different planet? Only if it moves to the current one?

Location of Targets:

I play "Archon's Terror", may I only rout targets at the current planet?

I play "Power from Pain", does my opponent need to sac a unit at the planet we are currently combating?

May I use the movement ability on Wildrider Squadron if it's at a different planet? Only if it moves to the current one?

When you would normally attack with it, you can move it. So the planet it is at needs to be resolving. So no if your resolving a planet that is adjacent to a planet with the Squadron, then you can not move it to the planet you are on.

I play "Archon's Terror", may I only rout targets at the current planet?

Yeah, I haven't got the books in front of me, but I am pretty sure that it triggers on the planet it is on as you do your combat strike.

I play "Power from Pain", does my opponent need to sac a unit at the planet we are currently combating?

Yes, same thing.. this is a combat action like the one above.

Sorry, but the above answers are incorrect. I think booored might be confusing "combat action" with a unit's "combat turn."

"Combat Action" indicates a player action that can be taken during the Combat phase. They are not the same thing as the "combat turn" of a character (i.e., a unit's turn to attack during an active combat) and do not substitute for a unit's attack during a particular combat. Instead, they are used during the "Player Action" windows on the game's timing charts.

There is nothing in the rules that says you can only use player actions during the Combat phase that are on cards located at a planet where there is currently a battle taking place. So the only "location" limits imposed on a card are the ones that the card imposes on itself.

Wildrider Squadron reads: "Combat Action: Move this unit to an adjacent planet. (Limit once per phase.)" So, at any point during the Combat Phase when you can take an action, you can use his ability to move him one planet over in either direction. Nothing in the rules or on the card says that either the planet he moves from or moves to has to be the First Planet or a planet that is currently experiencing a battle. Heck, you don't even have to use the ability during a combat (because there are player action windows before each combat begins).

Archon's Terror reads: "Combat Action: Rout a target non-unique unit." Again, at any point during the Combat Phase when you can take an action, during combat or not, you can use the event. Since there is nothing on the card limiting you to the First Planet, or any planet for that matter, you can rout any unit from any planet, during combat at that planet or not.

Power from Pain reads: "Combat Action: Your opponent must sacrifice an army unit, if able." By now, I'm sure you get the gist. With no limits in the rules or on the card, the opponent can sacrifice any (army) unit at any planet or in his HQ.

ktom has this perfectly correct. (I was writing up pretty much exactly the same but he beat me to it.)

Wildrider Squadron reads: "Combat Action: Move this unit to an adjacent planet. (Limit once per phase.)" So, at any point during the Combat Phase when you can take an action, you can use his ability to move him one planet over in either direction. Nothing in the rules or on the card says that either the planet he moves from or moves to has to be the First Planet or a planet that is currently experiencing a battle. Heck, you don't even have to use the ability during a combat (because there are player action windows before each combat begins).

What he was asking is if he is at the planet adjacent to a planet in the middle of combat, could you use his combat action to move him to that planet.. and you can't. You need to use the combat action as you do his combat attack. So the planet he is on needs to be resolving, not a planet he is next to.

Archon's Terror reads: "Combat Action: Rout a target non-unique unit." Again, at any point during the Combat Phase when you can take an action, during combat or not, you can use the event. Since there is nothing on the card limiting you to the First Planet, or any planet for that matter, you can rout any unit from any planet, during combat at that planet or not.

Again no. You resolve the planets in order.. not just any random unit anywhere that is deployed. He ability can only resolve during his combat attack, and therefore can not be used unless he is at a planet that is currently resolving.

Power from Pain reads: "Combat Action: Your opponent must sacrifice an army unit, if able." By now, I'm sure you get the gist. With no limits in the rules or on the card, the opponent can sacrifice any (army) unit at any planet or in his HQ.

Yeah, you are getting it as well I hope.. the combat action happens when you select him to attack. So again, he must be deployed at the planet that is resolving.

Booored, sorry, but you're wrong. All a "combat action" does is specify that this action can only be done during the combat phase. It has nothing to do with combat turns, or planet resolution, and certainly has no relationship to when a unit is attacking.

hmmm... got any quotes from the manual to support this?

Yep, I was the rules editor (and a playtester) after all :-)

RRG pg 3, Actions:

"Some Action effects have a phase name as a precursor to the word “Action.” Such effects are still considered Action effects, with the restriction that they can only be initiated during an action window in the specified phase."

Look at the timing charts. There are action windows before every combat turn. Either player may take actions during an action window. I'm on my phone right now so can't give the exact rules quote, but ktom is correct.

I'll also throw in that if "combat action" can only be used when a unit attacks, combat actions on events and supports seem pretty useless.

I haven't got the manual in front of me but combat action is not defined specifically anywhere in it as far as I know. In fact I remember searching for it in the of and only getting 2 hits, both i the example graphic.

As for the action window chart. That is for action available to players by choice. The entire point of a named action window is to allow actions to take place in a unique way.

Now you guys may be right (I have a rules question sent to FFG now, I'll post the response) but I hope it is NOT true.

It completely guts the game and reduces the tactical choices severely. Suddenly positional location means nothing apart from attack vs health values. Gone is any thought into where you want a effect to occur, planning and counter planning is reduced significantly. It is now just about brute force. If this is true is is seriously bad for the complexity of the game.

On the other hand if the combat action is a special case non-player controlled event that occurs as you attack, then positional data suddenly means so much. Thinking turns ahead, thinking where and when to commit your control units. Remember actions are all may effects, so you do not have to choose them.

Look at "Archon's Terror"... "Combat Action: Rout a target non-unique unit."

Are you telling me that as this has no tap cost, you can just choose its action as many times as you like? Targeting any unit at any planet regardless of what planet you are at? There is no tap effect, and you can make as many actions as you like in a action window, and there is no "limit once per turn" text... can you just point at Archon's Terror and say "I do this X times, between each time you can have the chance to do a action"

Archon's Terror is an event card.

Archon's Terror is an event. You pay for it, it executes once, it goes to your discard pile.

Archon's Terror is an event. You pay for it, it executes once, it goes to your discard pile.

yeah well, that is a bit embarrassing, haven't exactly memorized the card pool yet. Looking at cardgamedb the UNITS that have combat actions either have limits on them or the ability make no sense restricted to planets.

Ok, I believe you now.

Thank you very much. Especially to ktom. I guessed it to be like this, but wanted to be sure. Coming from L5R with Location Rules it feels kind of weird at first place, but I'll get accustomed to it.

Thank you very much. Especially to ktom. I guessed it to be like this, but wanted to be sure. Coming from L5R with Location Rules it feels kind of weird at first place, but I'll get accustomed to it.

Oh, yeah. Coming from L5R, this is going to take some getting used to. Location and presence is a LOT looser here than it is in L5R.

Ok, I believe you now.

Because of this, I know I am beating a dead horse here, but "water is wet" and, since this is a discussion board, the people posting are not necessarily the only audience. So here are the rule references that led to the answers given:

> Definition of "Combat Action" : (RRG, p.3) booored is correct that there is nowhere in the rules that specifically says "A 'Combat Action' is...". But PBrennan's quote above from the general definition of "Action" simultaneously defines "Deploy Action," "Command Action," "Combat Action" and "Headquarters Action." So there is a definition of "Combat Action" in the rules -- it is a player action that a player can choose to use (and therefore a "triggered ability"), but only in the Combat Phase. (Just like a "Deploy Action" is a player action/triggered ability that a player can choose to use, but only in the Deploy Phase.)

> Definition of "Combat Turn": (RRG, p. 5) The opportunity for a player to make an attack. Further, on RRG, p. 26, it is clarified that when a player takes a "Combat Turn," his options are to "attack using a ready unit" or to "pass if he cannot attack." RRG, p.26 goes on to explain that in resolving an attack, the player 1) Identifies/exhausts the attacker, 2) Identifies the defender, and 3) Deals the attacker's damage to the defender. Note that there is no option to use a player action (including a "Combat Action") during a combat turn .

> With those definitions in mind, we look at the timing charts on RRG, p. 22 to see if/when a player can use Actions ("Combat Actions" or simple "Actions" that are not phase dependent) during a battle. Without typing out the entire chart, the basic pattern is that players alternate taking "Combat Turns," starting with the player who has initiative for the battle, but that there is an opportunity for "Player Actions" (including "Combat Actions") between every Combat Turn.

So, the general conclusion is that "Combat Actions" can be triggered, as defined on the individual cards, just about any time in the Combat Phase when a player is not actually taking a Combat Turn. This also means that depending on when I decide to play my Combat Action, I could conceivably trigger the action and then immediately have an opportunity to attack (ie, take my next combat turn).

Looking at cardgamedb the UNITS that have combat actions either have limits on them or the ability make no sense restricted to planets.

This is actually a really important point. Most non-event cards with Actions of any kind - especially Combat Actions - place limits on themselves, specifying "limit once per phase" or saying the effects are only applied at the "same" or an "adjacent" planet. Keep an eye out for the card-specific limitations.

To continue the discussion, I think we played this right, but for Archon's Terror, it's not targeting a specific unit, so I believe the Tau Support of Communications Relay cannot be used to protect a unit from the card ability, right?

Relay reads: Interrupt : When your opponent triggers an ability that targets a unit you control with 1 or more attachments, exhaust this support to cancel its effects.

One slight caveat ... it's not quite true that you can trigger an action and then immediately follow with an attack. After you take an action, your opponent always has the opportunity to take an action within that action window. It's only when both players consecutively pass on taking an action that the action window closes and the game continues (in this case, on to performing a combat turn).

To continue the discussion, I think we played this right, but for Archon's Terror, it's not targeting a specific unit, so I believe the Tau Support of Communications Relay cannot be used to protect a unit from the card ability, right?

Relay reads: Interrupt : When your opponent triggers an ability that targets a unit you control with 1 or more attachments, exhaust this support to cancel its effects.

If an effect doesn't include the word "target", then Comms Relay can't be used to protect against it. But in this case, Archon Terror says "Rout a target non-unique unit.", so it does target a unit, and therefore it can be used (as long as the routed unit is under your control and has 1 or more attachments, obviously.)

Whoops, my bad. My example card was supposed to be "Power from Pain": Combat Action: Your opponent must sacrifice an army unit, if able.

It's only when both players consecutively pass on taking an action that the action window closes and the game continues (in this case, on to performing a combat turn).

Yes, I should have been more exact in my description of the mechanics.

However, the practical experience will probably be the "I take a Combat Action (and everyone technically passes before I) then take a Combat Turn" more often than not.

Whoops, my bad. My example card was supposed to be "Power from Pain": Combat Action: Your opponent must sacrifice an army unit, if able.

In which case, correct, Comms Relay couldn't be used.

However, the practical experience will probably be the "I take a Combat Action (and everyone technically passes before I) then take a Combat Turn" more often than not.

The neat thing about having the action window before every combat turn is that if you have no units left at the planet, an action window opens just before the opponent declares the battle won and can be used to ambush a unit in, rout his unit(s), etc, meaning the battle is never over until its over.