So seems as Nationals was overwhelmingly dominated by falcons, It seems because of the phantom you have to play a falcon or die trying. Almost all of the top 8 were falcons of some sort. This is exactly what I was afraid of when the phantom was announced and It really is bad. My local tournament, 7 out of 8 squads had falcons and one phantom squad. I think FFG really screwed up bad here. The new meta just sucks and I am very disappointed and saddened.

Swarms still destroy falcons. I am not sure why everyone is so afraid of them now.

I do pretty well, and I haven't played falcons in a few weeks.

4/8 of the top 8 had Falcons.

Only the winning squad used a Phantom, and it was Whisper. 3/8 used Shuttles and Soontir Fel, and the other was a TIE swarm that eats Falcons like popcorn.

Its still rediculous, I thought it was more falcons due to Paul Heavers article on tc

Your opponent chooses Rock, do you choose Scissors or Paper?

....

Clearly the meta is shifting in favor of the unstoppable Shuttle.

Falcons aren't dominating.

Are you really surprised that people emulate what they perceive to be the best squads? Everything is temporary. Except the tie swarm. It is the great white of Xwing. It doesn't have to evolve. It just keeps winning. Wait a few days and people will be talking about the next new hot thing that is ruining the game.

Oh, right. We hadn't had a good "OMG TEH SKYZ IS FALLING!!11" thread in a bit.

Well done!

Wait a few days and people will be talking about the next new hot thing that is ruining the game.

It'll be TIE Bombers.

(I'm not actually kidding; Jonus/Bomber/Bomber/TIE Fighter isn't very Falcon-friendly.)

Was it that the Falcon is so powerful, so people played it, or that really good players played it and thus did well? An extremely important distinction. Any tournament is just a snapshot at a time. Right now, where Phantom panic is at an all-time high, a lot of smart players played good counters (with Fat Falcons being the current "thing"), and ended up, by all accounts, outsmarting themselves a bit when they faced few, if any, Phantoms. The Falcon meta will pass (particularly with subsequent releases and counters that are on the way) and be replaced with new hotness. If anything, this is a blip and I feel that, when S&V multiplies the build options, it will be very difficult to find ANY one build that can be considered "all comers" without taking the skill of the player first and foremost into account.

Let me go out on a limb and suggest that you're probably going to see an overshift towards "anti-Falcon" builds (Outmaneuver to deny 3CPO, Z95/TIE Swarms, Cluster Missiles, HLC Brath, etc.) and I'd put my money on the smart players being a step ahead of that and countering those counters rather than running Falcons into the teeth of that competition, but that's just me.

People deserve to loose if they make post like this...they are clearly NOT an X-Winger, they are random gamer tourist... who do not LOVE STAR WARS.

Scram!

Or get with the program.

I own two Falcons. I think I've used them, in over two years of playing, twice. In total. I don't find them all that interesting. It's only one ship, and it only has one attack.

I won my FLGS tournament with an Imperial non-Swarm build. I beat Falcons to do it. They're not invincible by any stretch.

IMO, the state of the meta is simply a result of the number of releases we have had this year. Wave 4 dropped during a major tournament season and was immediately legal, resulting in an immense shift in what we perceive as "the meta," and that change took hold before the meta had a chance to really mature. Wave 4 has been out for barely two months, Wave 5 is dripping in with a full release soon and a third faction is on the horizon. The game is and has been in a consistent state of flux for several months and that is not slowing. It may very well not before Worlds in November. In the World Championship, I would certainly expect a lot of turrets, assuming Wave 5 is out and legal, but, come, next year, the game will be very different than it is now. List mainstays are going nowhere, IE Threepio Falcons, Turret ships, TIE Swarms, mobility lists, XXBB, Rebel Swarms, etc, and we are getting a third faction which, at this point, is mostly unknown to us. You are complaining because the game is not what it was six months ago, but it will be different again in six more months. No reason to fret. Its better that the game change and develop, and it's amazing that these new lists exist while lists that were powerful day 1 are equally powerful now. Have to give a hand to the designers for that. That time six months ago before any of these new cards saw a game where it was quite risky to run a Falcon, and now the Falcon is a mainstay in many competitive lists. Nothing about that is a bad thing. The only thing that is different is we just haven't had time to see the current meta settle down, but it will be different after Rebel Aces, Wave 5, and Scum and Villainy. Just wait.

Also, take the time to read this thread about why there is nothing wrong with the game:

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/108276-the-sky-is-not-falling/#entry1114035

Was it that the Falcon is so powerful, so people played it, or that really good players played it and thus did well?

Once I get 100% of the lists (crossing my fingers that FFG follows through on this), then I can let you know!

FYI, we DO have these kinds of statistics in the Regionals thread now.

In the tourney I played on Sat only one of the top four were using YT's. There was a TIE swarm against four X's and two YT's and a Z against an all Phantom list.

I didn't stick around to see who won, but 25% doesn't seem overpowered to me.

The Phantom's easy to kill. The Falcons are dominating because everyone overestimated the phantom and A: Counterbuilt and B: didn't go with the firepower builds that the phantom's fairly good against and which shred Falcons.

GenCon's US national had a bit of everything according to FFG.

My local tournament, 7 out of 8 squads had falcons and one phantom squad. I think FFG really screwed up bad here. The new meta just sucks and I am very disappointed and saddened.

Our local tournament yesterday had 12 players with ZERO Falcons.

Top spot went to Wes, E'tahn, and 3x Headhunters. The #2 was a tricked-out Whisper + Howl miniswarm. #3 was Wedge/Airen/Corran. Apologies to those involved if I'm messing up the order, but I seem to remember that #4 was 2x BH and a Doom Shuttle.

Three of those four made the elimination cut at the Kublacon regionals.

But seriously - as long as we're going to look at anecdotes, that's a solid group of top players, in the top 4, without a single repeated ship among them.

The Phantom is big, and scary, and take a lot of adaptation, not the least of which is figuring out how to just not be terrified of it. Or you can skip all that learning, and fly Falcons - which have always been a perfectly good ship, and gotten a bit better lately.

I think the overall meta is fine and healthy, honestly. There's the usual bit of panicked stampeeding to what the internet says is the best, but I think it's fine.

The Phantom's easy to kill. The Falcons are dominating because everyone overestimated the phantom and A: Counterbuilt and B: didn't go with the firepower builds that the phantom's fairly good against and which shred Falcons.

GenCon's US national had a bit of everything according to FFG.

This got my like but deserved a quote too.

The meta isn't always about what's best - it's about guessing what's going to be common, and trying to deal with it. That can produce some very skewed results, especially in singular events, but they tend to be short-lived cycles.

Its still rediculous, I thought it was more falcons due to Paul Heavers article on tc

Why is it ridiculous? So having 6-7/8 top 8 lists running TIE Swarm was better was it?

4/8 of the top 8 had Falcons.

Only the winning squad used a Phantom, and it was Whisper. 3/8 used Shuttles and Soontir Fel, and the other was a TIE swarm that eats Falcons like popcorn.

5/8 actually.

But anyways, i just think the falcon is an overreaction to the phantoms, and people haven't really had the time to sit down to play different lists. I don't find phantoms that hard to deal with (i mean, it is hard, but it is not impossible by any stretch).

To really understand what's happening, you need to know all of the squads that were competing.

4/8 of the top 8 had Falcons.

Only the winning squad used a Phantom, and it was Whisper. 3/8 used Shuttles and Soontir Fel, and the other was a TIE swarm that eats Falcons like popcorn.

5/8 actually.

But anyways, i just think the falcon is an overreaction to the phantoms, and people haven't really had the time to sit down to play different lists. I don't find phantoms that hard to deal with (i mean, it is hard, but it is not impossible by any stretch).

And a key thing to remember is that Phantoms are hard to fly well, so a lot of the time it is waiting for that one opportunity you get when things don't go 100% for it.

People deserve to loose if they make post like this...they are clearly NOT an X-Winger, they are random gamer tourist... who do not LOVE STAR WARS.

Scram!

Or get with the program.

I think this is a little over the top. Some people have opinions on the game because they enjoy it very much. When something affects the game they like in a way they do not like (in this case everyone rushes to falcons+3PO to counter phantoms and over saturates the game with similar lists) it may be something to discuss in detail without resorting to "you hate my fluff you're not a real Gamer" type comments.

Constructive comments that back up an opposite view will work better not only to develop a less saturated meta but also more civilized boards.

OP: I'm still trying to find a good Rebel squad (no turrets) that can go after Phantoms and Falcons as well. I've done very well countering Phantoms by activating a high pilot skill X or E and using R3-A2 and following with low skilled accurate shots. I'm still working on it but I find that Wes really does well with R3-A2 and effectively shuts down ACD and as a bonus, leaves him naked and alone facing the rest of your list.