So..

i just came from a tournament where 2 players were banned for any further tournaments at least at this location...

I was actually thinking about this problem as well for a longer time and never knew how to actually deal with it...

The DAMAGE deck...

Do you ask your opponent before you start to look through his deck?

I never did... i would have actually felt like a jerk...

Today, taught me the lesson.. if i don't know the opponent i want to see the deck...

2 players had modified damage decks.

The decks were build with 33 cards so at first glance you don't suspect anything...

It came up as one of the players was receiving several critical damage cards from an attack.

He revealed the cards and the opponent got suspicious since all of the sudden there were 3 Munitions Failures on the board on the opponents side...

He called the TO and he was taking a look... he had 5 Munitions Failures and 5 Damaged Engines and 3 Thrust Control Fires... and so on... not a single Critical Hit.

As caught, he responded that it might have been accidentally since he plays with his roommate all the time and maybe they screwed up the cards.

Well, the roommate was participating in this tournament as well so the TO stopped his roomies game and was taking a look as his Damage Deck as well.

Which should contain now 14 Critical Hits correct?

NO... he had beside some differences the same modified Damage Deck as his friend...

All the games of these two had been annulled and given the win to their opponent...

As already said.. they are also excluded form any further tournaments at this location...

(and im sure soon will be banned from other locations as well since the XWing community seems to be well informed and close)

So what to do now?

Do i really have to ask now every opponent to please show me his cards?

How about a Damage Deck swap at the start of each game?

If you get the cards from your opponent you will take a look at it anyway to make sure all is correct and you will not feel like a jerk for asking since it is the rule.

What you would do?

As a side note, im very disappointed that we reached this kind of level in this game... we are not playing for thousands of dollars winnings or anything significant...

I still don't get it...

Ah well....

Happy 4th ya all who are in the states

Your opponent should be giving you the opportunity to shuffle/cut his deck before the match anyways, so you might as well take a cursory look while the cards are in your hands to see if anything seems out of place. I'd like to think something as egregious as five Munitions Failures would stand out.

A simple solution would be for players to :

- Exchange damage decks

- Take a quick look and count cards if necessary

- Shuffle

- Give back to the owner

Accidents involving multiple decks "can" happen, but a stacked deck will show quite clearly.

I went to a couple tournaments where players check each others damage decks before the first game.

It should be done at that start of the tournament, before the first game. Check for 33 cards, 7 critical hits and 2 of each other card. then shufle and cut and give back.

You should never trust anyone at a tournament. I would suspect the most common way to cheat is to take out the direct hits, so do a quick count always. If enough people count it will discourage this activity in fear of getting caught.

One way to get around this is to share one damage deck?

Wheaton's Law, just saying.

One way to get around this is to share one damage deck?

Negative. Each player is supposed to provide his own. If you deal 2 crits to mean and I get 2 Direct hits that means there is only 5 left in the deck for you to get hit with, which immediately puts you at an unfair advantage

As a side note, im very disappointed that we reached this kind of level in this game... we are not playing for thousands of dollars winnings or anything significant...

I still don't get it...

I personally don't care if you WERE playing for thousands of dollars ... this is still wrong on so many levels. Given that you aren't, it makes it worse I suppose.

Reminds me of someone I knew when I was much, much younger ... he cheated all the time in Monopoly (stealing money from the bank mostly, although sometimes skipping squares as he counted his movement). It really is sad that some people have to do anything they can simply to win ...

In the Descent 2nd Edition game forum, I made a post titled "Can you have fun even if you aren't winning ...". Apparently there are plenty of people who can't.

Sad.

"Can you have fun even if you aren't winning ...". Apparently there are plenty of people who can't.

Sad.

I'm glad I enjoy the game even when I don't win. (Well, except when the dice go way south, but that's just frustration more than anything.)

Locally we've changed it, so there's only winning and "community building".

It wouldn't surprise me if that TO does random deck checks in future ... That should discourage it.

Thats pretty disgusting.

Is it bad that I had thought about this about the hour after I had started this game? I don't do it, but I have thought about how to do it, and when I play in a game store, I ask to cut my opponents deck, and i do a quick thumb through.

On a site note, big thumbs up to the TO for some quick thinking, catching two cheaters in one shot!

Stuff like this that as a general rule I don't do tourney's. I participated at Imdaar Alpha and the lack of TO supervision and lack of rules knowledge by the players (coupled with my honesty) made it a rather frustrating affair.

Sorry people have to go through this sort of thing. Sucks...

-Cal

Yeah, this is one of the most obvious but least effective ways to cheat. It's going to have a minimal effect most games. That said cheating is cheating. Still despicable.

Stuff like this that as a general rule I don't do tourney's. I participated at Imdaar Alpha and the lack of TO supervision and lack of rules knowledge by the players (coupled with my honesty) made it a rather frustrating affair.

Sorry people have to go through this sort of thing. Sucks...

-Cal

This has always struck me as a possibility. I wouldn't want to seem like a jerk for asking to see an opponent's damage deck before play, but it's probably a good habit to get into.

You should have broken all of his ships.

Well, the thing is...

I know that i "should" go through the deck of my opponent...

But i really was not ready for the.. i "have" to...

I think that's more the point what bugs me about it...

And i think that there is still the... i dont wanna look like a jerk... thing in some peoples mind which made it so easy for them at this point... (even that they got caught).

It also ruins the trust and believe in your opponent which is what i really hate...

I loved/love the game for being an easy going thing...

Well , maybe we are beyond this point now.

Get ready it gets serious!

I will never check a damage deck. If the other player is that desperate to win a little plastic spaceship game then I just feel sorry for them.

This has always struck me as a possibility. I wouldn't want to seem like a jerk for asking to see an opponent's damage deck before play, but it's probably a good habit to get into.

There's an easy way to approach the topic. Offer the opponent the opportunity to check your deck, then wait expectantly. If they don't offer you the same courtesy, at that point it's a good idea to ask. If they volunteer it up readily, chances are you don't need to look anyway.

That being said this is really despicable. Hopefully the TO took the opportunity to publicly shame the two players.

Stuff like this just doesn't even occur to me. I can't fathom altering the deck. My second set of damage cards are still in the starter box untouched.

On a side note, what is this winning at X-Wing you speak of?

Yeah, it had occurred to me that this was possible, but given the likelihood that it would have a marked affect on the outcome on the game seemed to me to be too remote to make the cheating worth it.

I'm sad that people try.

I also imagine that some people just get off on the thrill of cheating for it's own sake.

How old were the cheaters in this case?