I agree, the only "Mary Sue" thin for me was the mind trick. I was even ok with her beating Kylo. Some people are just good fighters. but the mind trick?

TBH I get the feeling she was part of the Jedi academy, I think the scene with the Knights of Ren was actually a memory that was unlocked. So she may have subconsciously known it was possible.

Kylo was also severely wounded, and had just been fighting Finn which means he was also probably on his last legs by the time he faced her.

Geniunely the only skill I can find fault with is the mind trick, and that's only because as far as I know she'd never seen it before so why would she think to do it?

Maybe after experience Kylo's shenanigans she thought though it might be worth a try.

Oh, and GUNBOAT!!!!!!

TBH I get the feeling she was part of the Jedi academy, I think the scene with the Knights of Ren was actually a memory that was unlocked. So she may have subconsciously known it was possible.

Kylo was also severely wounded, and had just been fighting Finn which means he was also probably on his last legs by the time he faced her.

I agree something had to be up...I mean, her abilities just popping up with instantly learned Jedi mind-tricks and immediate ability to fight with a light-saber was the worst part of the movie in my opinion, unless there is a backstory like what you speak of....there has to be or we're just making this chick super-girl or something like that.

Oh, and.....

Happy GUNBOAT Friday!!

She'd never flown it though and that means she'd be unfamiliar with the ships handling

Hence the first thing she does is fly it into the ground.

She's clearly shown to be already familiar with the Falcon's systems given she knows all the stuff Unkar did to it. She's spent her life getting to know the inner workings of starships given her living was finding the good/functioning parts in them.

Geniunely the only skill I can find fault with is the mind trick, and that's only because as far as I know she'd never seen it before so why would she think to do it?

Jedi intuition?

Exactly! She's naturally strong in the force, she sees things before they happen, giving the impression of supernatural reflexes. Same reason Anakin was able to win a pod race (with a pod he built himself). Combine this with her knowledge of the ship and I don't have any problem with it.

As for the Jedi mind trick, anybody who knows anything about Jedi would have at least heard rumours about that, and she obvious knows something about Jedi - she knows who Luke Skywalker is, for example. I see that as her realising the stuff she's heard is real, realising she has powers when she accidentally turned back Kylo's mind link (and perhaps even absorbing some of his knowledge of the force through that link) and being open to believing in it. Her willingness to believe, her almost child-like optimism. is what makes her such a quick learner in the force, as opposed to Luke's skeptisism which held him back.

I don't like Rey.

In one minute she's gone from crashing the falcon into a sand dune, to flying through the superstructure of a completely unlit Super Star Destroyer in a fat vessel with an offset cockpit.

There's more to my dislike her but knowing how to fly the Falcon like a pro after a minute of flight is numero uno.

TBH I get the feeling she was part of the Jedi academy, I think the scene with the Knights of Ren was actually a memory that was unlocked. So she may have subconsciously known it was possible.

Kylo was also severely wounded, and had just been fighting Finn which means he was also probably on his last legs by the time he faced her.

I agree something had to be up...I mean, her abilities just popping up with instantly learned Jedi mind-tricks and immediate ability to fight with a light-saber was the worst part of the movie in my opinion, unless there is a backstory like what you speak of....there has to be or we're just making this chick super-girl or something like that.

The lightsaber battle was thought through actually. Look at how Rey fights with it: lots of thrusts and broad moves. Kind of like... a staff?

In one minute she's gone from crashing the falcon into a sand dune, to flying through the superstructure of a completely unlit Super Star Destroyer in a fat vessel with an offset cockpit.

At a not particularly fast speed, she bails out of there quite quickly and she knows her way around the thing. It's no Hoth Asteroid Field.

TBH I get the feeling she was part of the Jedi academy, I think the scene with the Knights of Ren was actually a memory that was unlocked. So she may have subconsciously known it was possible.

Kylo was also severely wounded, and had just been fighting Finn which means he was also probably on his last legs by the time he faced her.

I agree something had to be up...I mean, her abilities just popping up with instantly learned Jedi mind-tricks and immediate ability to fight with a light-saber was the worst part of the movie in my opinion, unless there is a backstory like what you speak of....there has to be or we're just making this chick super-girl or something like that.

The lightsaber battle was thought through actually. Look at how Rey fights with it: lots of thrusts and broad moves. Kind of like... a staff?

In one minute she's gone from crashing the falcon into a sand dune, to flying through the superstructure of a completely unlit Super Star Destroyer in a fat vessel with an offset cockpit.

At a not particularly fast speed, she bails out of there quite quickly and she knows her way around the thing. It's no Hoth Asteroid Field.

In her 15 or so years on Jakku she's probably covered every inch of that 11 mile long SSD, so she knew exactly what she was doing when she chose to fly into it. This is why fighting people on their home turf is a bad idea, they know the terrain too well.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

Yup, because according to Star Wars, if you have the Force you ain't gotta explain anything.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Yeah totally.. I've seen Battlefield Earth, if cavemen can learn to fly Harrier Jumpjets from flight sims... A force attuned lady should have no issues.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Taking Armor training simulator runs on Fort Knox doesn't make me a Tanker. The point is she becomes proficient at it, because lol plot armor. Hell, all of her field work is questionable, yet she seems to do better than trained pilots and commandos because of the farce.

I take back what I said, getting a refund for ebooks is a much better way to vent my frustration and a nice **** you to a particular sellout.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Y-wing has a significantly different silhouette from the falcon, a lower speed oh and that's not shown in the film so it's completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Taking Armor training simulator runs on Fort Knox doesn't make me a Tanker. The point is she becomes proficient at it, because lol plot armor. Hell, all of her field work is questionable, yet she seems to do better than trained pilots and commandos because of the farce.

I take back what I said, getting a refund for ebooks is a much better way to vent my frustration and a nice **** you to a particular sellout.

This is actually why I hate the Force in Star Wars. Because pretty much every character that survives/does something extravagant is Force Sensitive. What about all the other guys/gals? They just get left in the dust, they die to get information about a moon.

Just give me Stormtroopers that can actually shoot and pit them against Rebels. Leave the Jedi/Sith out. I will be entertained.

Because crawling through something slowly clearly equates with flying through at high speed...

I guess you missed the part where she spent her evenings flying flight sims.

Taking Armor training simulator runs on Fort Knox doesn't make me a Tanker. The point is she becomes proficient at it, because lol plot armor. Hell, all of her field work is questionable, yet she seems to do better than trained pilots and commandos because of the farce.

I take back what I said, getting a refund for ebooks is a much better way to vent my frustration and a nice **** you to a particular sellout.

The real question is if it was a male character doing the exact same things would there have been any question?

The real question is if it was a male character doing the exact same things would there have been any question?

uh... yes.

The real question is if it was a male character doing the exact same things would there have been any question?

uh... yes.

Really because I can think of dozens of movies where similar things happen. A beat cop takes out a team of professional mercenaries trying to take over a tower block?

The real question is if it was a male character doing the exact same things would there have been any question?

uh... yes.

Really because I can think of dozens of movies where similar things happen. A beat cop takes out a team of professional mercenaries trying to take over a tower block?

Well for a start John McClain was a trained law enforcement officer with field experience in a major population centre.

Secondly he got hurt a lot in die hard despite his training every encounter took its toll.

Thirdly he didn't jump into a f-15 with no training then fly through a bunch of skyscrapers during a dog fight, each encounter was plausible and employed minimal plot armour.

Trying to imply sexism is stupid because I'm willing to bet everyone loves aliens, had they established she could fly in the movie it'd be a none issue but they didn't, Luke owned a speeder and flew through canyons shooting small animals so his success in the trench run was believable.

A trained beat cop, not a trained anti-terrorism/SAS/Special forces operative. In Die Hard II he takes on a team of seasoned black operatives, and in one of the later ones he takes out a Harrier Jump Jet with a taxi... The character is so over the top as to be silly... But we are all fine with that. Yes he gets hurt, but that is really an excuse for him to look even more macho.

Yeah and every one admits II is a dumb movie.

It's an action movie it's a male power fantasy it's meant to be ott, women have their fantasy fulfilling movies but they don't get attacked for them.

It's not like Anakin got a free ride people hated both versions as being irritating, attack of the clones romance scenes are cringeworthy no humans act like that.

Kylo ren also gets tons of crap.

So get past the sexism angle that's not why we think she's Mary sue.

Yeah and every one admits II is a dumb movie.

It's an action movie it's a male power fantasy it's meant to be ott, women have their fantasy fulfilling movies but they don't get attacked for them.

It's not like Anakin got a free ride people hated both versions as being irritating, attack of the clones romance scenes are cringeworthy no humans act like that.

Kylo ren also gets tons of crap.

So get past the sexism angle that's not why we think she's Mary sue.

She's not more a Mary Sue than Luke was... (now I think you might be correct to argue that Luke is a Gary Stu)... So I find it a bit mad people give him a pass, but not Rey.

Or what about Anakin building a droid and being a top level Pod Racer before he was 8.

Luke was established to already be an experienced pilot used to flying in enclosed canyons and well practiced at shooting small targets, he trained for the trench run for years without knowing it.

That's not a Gary stue.

Ray was not established as a pilot yet performs feats even a veteran would think twice about in a ship she's never flown before.

Anakin was a Gary stue, he got into an unfamiliar vehicle type flew into combat where experienced pilots die in droves then takes out the mother ship solo.

And people hate Anakin.