The rule is:

<In order to clarify, the Sacrifice ability should read as follows:
A front-line unit with this ability (listed on its Faction Sheet)
is automatically destroyed during the Resolve Skirmishes
step of a battle regardless of whether or not the opponent
has sufficient strength to destroy it. This ability is ignored
if the unit with the sacrifice ability is unable to attack both
the opposing front line unit and supporting units (due to its
attack capability)>

But when an unit whit sacrifice is destroyed for his ability, destroy the opponent front-line unit ?

If no , whit an ONLY Sourge you can attack an enemy that have 1 fly-unit and a ground-unit... (then ground unit will is a supporting unit)

Then Sourge can't Sacrifice (can't attack the ground unit) but whit his combat card 9/6 can kill the opponent fly-unit...and if luckly can survive

If yes , whit a Sourge you can attack an opponet flying-unit and you can use a bad combat-card: the sacrifice ability destroy sourge and opponet flying unit...

Even with Sacrifice ability, your front line unit (Scourge or Infested Terran) must have sufficent strenght to destroy the FLU . Otherwise you will lose your unit without any effect.

If such unit can attack any of opposing units in skirmish (also some supporting units), it dies.

The only exception is a skirmish vs cloaked units (without Detector it will survive - it can't attack cloaked units, but it's quite improbable due to low health value).

Of course, you don't need to have a unit with Sacrifice to use that trick. Denouvers/Valkyries/Corsairs and also strong ground units (Tanks/Archons/Ultralisks) can destroy supporting units in such way.

Fifagi said:

Fifagi said:

Sacrifice itself doesn't affect opponent units in any way. Think of it this way - the scourge attacks by ramming the opponent and dies in the attempt. The ramming effect on the opponent is already covered in the attack value. One thing that seems odd (unless I missed something) is that the success against the supporting unit is completely determined by using the FLU combat values.

If no , whit an ONLY Sourge you can attack an enemy that have 1 fly-unit and a ground-unit... (then ground unit will is a supporting unit)

Then Sourge can't Sacrifice (can't attack the ground unit) but whit his combat card 9/6 can kill the opponent fly-unit...and if luckly can survive

http://new.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/StarCraft/scbw_faq.pdf

The clarification of Scourge Sacrifice here indicates that scourge will always die if it is able to attack either front line or supporting units (unless opposing unit that it is able to attack is cloaked).

cyb3k said:

cyb3k said:

mmmh...but this is very bizzarre...Why ?

Because if I attack whit a Sourge (CC 9/6 & RC +1healt) a Wraith that use combat card 6/7 i kill Wraith but my Scourge dead too (for Sacrifice Ability)

If I attack whit a Sourge (CC 9/6 & RC +1healt) a Wraith that use CC 6/7 whit Support Unit Vulture I kill the Wraith but my Sourge don't dead because the sacrifice ability don't work (sourge can't attack Volture)...

I don't think that can be true...

Fifagi said:

Your unit with Sacrifice dies [because of that ability] if it can attack at least one of opposing units in skirmish. It doesn't matter if [attacked enemy unit] it is a front line unit or not - it will be attacked/destroyed (or: it must withdraw because of its Cloaking ability, and your Scrouge survives because of that).

HighlanderMWC said:

NO

No front line *OR* supporting units, but front line AND supporting units

But, when Sourge use his Sarcifice ability, kill the opponent Front Line Unit ?

Because, if not and I attack whit a Sourge (CC 9/6 & RC +1healt) a Wraith that use combat card 6/7 i kill Wraith but my Scourge dead too (for Sacrifice Ability)

BUT if I attack whit a Sourge (CC 9/6 & RC +1healt) a Wraith that use CC 6/7 whit Support Unit Vulture I kill the Wraith but my Sourge don't dead because the sacrifice ability don't work (sourge can't attack Volture)...

I don't think that can be true...

Fifagi said:

Sacrifice is ignored if the scourge cannot attack the FLU (due attack capability) AND the scourge cannot attack the supporting unit (due to attack capability). Another way to state this is that sacrifice occurs if it can attack the FLU OR the supporting unit.

Scourge v Wraith = Scourge dead unless wraith cloaked

Scourge v Wraith FLU + vulture = scourge dead unless wraith cloaked

Scourge v vulture FLU + wraith = scourge dead unless wraith cloaked

Interestingly it would seem that there would be a way to have a scourge unit live after causing a kill if it forced a cloaked unit to withdraw but there were no friendly or empty areas to withdraw to on the same planet.

HighlanderMWC said:

Scourge vs Wraith it's correct.

Scourge vs Wraith FLU + Vulture, it's wrong...scourge don't dead: read FAQ "This ability is ignored if the unit with the sacrifice ability is unable to attack BOTH the opposing front line unit and supporting units" (it's both...not only one)...Scourge can't attack Vulture

Scouge vs Vulture FLU + Warith, it's wrong because Scourge don't dead: Scourge it's unable tu attack Vulture, then sacrifice is ignored because can't attach BOTH Flu and supporting

Fifagi said:

if FFG want that Scourge dead if it can attack FLU OR Supporting units, wrote ""This ability is ignored if the unit with the sacrifice ability is unable to attack the opposing front line unit OR supporting units" and not ""This ability is ignored if the unit with the sacrifice ability is unable to attack *BOTH* the opposing front line unit *AND* supporting units"

They wrote BOTH and AND, not OR...than need BOTH, not only one of two...

Fifagi said:

Sorry...If both is present (Scourge can't attack) the ability Sacrifice doesn't work.

If is prensent ONLY one Sacrifice works...OK...my mistake...

Then Sacrifice is only a malus ?

Whit original Game, if Scourge doesn't died in combat it Sacrifice himself and destory the flyer Opponent FLU...now no ?

The reason for the confusion is that the attack and self-destruction are being handled by separate mechanics in the boardgame. The offensive combat value for the scourge represents the impact it gives to the opponent. The special ability "sacrifice" just provides a mechanism to have the unit destroy itself when it attempts that attack.

HighlanderMWC said:

But isn't normal that if a marine FLU + Wraith vs Scourge...the Scourge dead, but doesn't destroy an unit -.-

In videogame the sourge sacrifice himself for damage/kill an enemy unit...than is better the Sourge Combat card of orginal game, not BR: in original game marine FLU + Wraith don't Kill Scourge, and scourge doesn't dead...

When a scourge attacks, it collides with the enemy and the scourge explodes. The scourge dies in this explosion. The scourge has sacrificed itself whether it has sufficient strength to kill the enemy or not. Assuming there is an enemy that the scourge can attack - an enemy air unit in either the front line or supporting - the scourge will destroy itself in the impact. Hence the sacrifice ability applying to the scourge.

The enemy unit could possibly survive the impact assuming a card was played that provided the enemy front line unit with a high enough health rating.

The only way that the scourge can have the sarcifice ability not activate is if there are no enemy flying units in the front line and no enemy flying units supporting the non flying enemy front line unit. The scourge can still be possibly killed if its health is not high enough but it won't sacrifice itself.

A noted exception to sacrifice is when there is an enemy flying unit, but that unit has cloaking. In the cloaking situation, the cloak prevents the scourge from impacting, and therefor from sacrificing itself.

WAIT !!!

I wrote to FF and i received this:

"The scourge's sacrifice ability refers to only the FRONT LINE UNIT.

Therefore, in your example, the front line unit was a wraith, and the
scourge is therefore destroyed. The vulture was assisting, and was not
front line (it does not become a front line unit even though the
wraith died).

The only time the scourge would NOT die, is if it was unable to attack
the front line unit at the start of the battle. For example, if the
scourge was fighting a lone vulture neither unit would die (since they
can't attack eachother). The sacrifice ability would not be triggered.

I hope that this answers your question!
-Corey Konieczka
Fantasy Flight Games
Design and Development"

Then the rule is different ?

Thanks

It isn't. The response actually confirms our suggestions.

"The scourge's sacrifice ability refers to only the FRONT LINE UNIT".

But, refers to your FLU.

Supporting Scrouge can't die because of Sacrifice ability.

Scrouge as FLU dies because of Sacrifice ability, if it can attack enemy FLU or supporting / assist unit.

(what can be read here: http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/StarCraft/scbw_faq.pdf )

Fifagi, I'm wondering if part of the problem is that you may be looking at this rule from a boolean logic point of view. Boolean logic doesn't allways work properly on regular sentences.

The english 'and' is often the boolean equivalent of a union of 2 sets as opposed to the intersection of 2 sets. This is the boolean equivalent of 'OR'.

For example, lets say you and I were to play the Desparate Alliance scenario, and it was agreed that I would play The Overmind. The Overmind in this scenario gets access to units from both The Overmind Faction and the Queen Of Blades Faction. If while setting up I asked you "Could you please pass me the green and purple units." I'm not refering to peices that have both green AND purple on them, but I am refering to the units of green color as well as the units of purple color. Equivalently, the union of both green units and purple units.

Even though the word 'and' was used, it wasn't a boolean 'AND'. It is the boolean equivalent of 'OR'.

Now from the FAQ we have:

unable to attack [ both the opposing front line unit and supporting units ]

=

NOT attack [ Union of opposing front line unit and supporting units ]

=

NOT [ attack (opposing front line unit) OR attack (supporting units) ]

=

[ NOT (attack opposing front line unit) ] AND [ NOT (attack supporting units ) ]

=

[ NOT (attack opposing front line unit) ] Intersected with [ NOT (attack supporting units) ]

Lets say our whole set can be divided into 4 mutually exclusive sets by 2 classifications: FLU = Front line unit, and AIR = Flying units. Each classification has a complement: NOT (FLU) and NOT (AIR).
The 4 mutually exclusive sets would then be:

Set A = (FLU) intersected with (AIR) = a front line air unit.
Set B = NOT(FLU) intersected with (AIR) = an air unit in support of a front line unit.
Set C = (FLU) intersected with NOT(AIR) = a front line ground unit.
Set D = NOT(FLU) intersected with NOT(AIR) = a ground unit in support of a front line unit.

Visually the whole space could look like:

AB
CD

NOT(A) = B union C union D:

...B
CD

NOT(B) = A union C union D:

A...
CD

Think of if this way. A scourge can attack air units only. So with a scourge, both A and B can be attacked. So for the scourge to be unable to attack both the opposing front line unit and supporting units we have:

[ NOT(A) ] intersected with [ NOT(B) ]
Which would equivalently be: © UNION (D).

Visually that would look like:

CD

As you can see in this case sacrifice does not trigger: only when there are no attackable air units in the skirmish.

They added in a contingency to cover the situation for when there is an air unit that successfully cloaks.

Wow, I feel really nerdy right now...

cyb3k said:

But in FAQ wrote then the sacrifice Doesn't work if Sourge can't attack FLU AND Supporting units

Then if a FLU is a Volture and a Support units a Wraith the sourge HAVE TO sacrifice itself...this said the faq, right ?

But Corey Konieczka worte to me that "The only time the scourge would NOT die, is if it was unable to attack
the front line unit at the start of the battle" (doesn't wrote supporting units), than if a volture is a FLU and a Wraith a supporting units, Scoruge don't died -.- ... different from FAQ :-/

Fifagi said:

Read again a response.

You will find the following quote:

"For example, if the scourge was fighting a lone vulture neither unit would die"

If you still have doubts, ask Corey for clarification. But I see he was trying to explain you the rule from FAQ... But did it incorrectly.

cyb3k said:

Sorry...i didn't read ione -.-

Ah...but i understand the faq.

Sacrifice-unitis is alway destoryed...it isn't destoyed ONLY if it can't attack FLU AND support units, or opposing unit has clocked

I’ve bought the expansion 2 days ago and I still haven’t played it, but I want to be sure about something:
So if a scourge attack a cloaked wraith and as sufficient strength, it does not sacrifice, that is understood, but does the wraith retreat (and maybe is forced to by destroyed if no area to withdraw)?
And if a scourge attack a vulture supported by a wraith and as sufficient strength, does the wraith withdraw (and maybe is forced to by destroyed if no area to withdraw)?

Dagoma said:

Yes, it must withdraw. And, although it's quite improbable, your Scrouge may "destroy" Wraith without being destroyed itself!

In both cases, defender must play "Cloaking" card in the skirmish to withdraw.

"In order to clarify, the Sacrifice ability should read as follows:
A front-line unit with this ability (listed on its Faction Sheet)
is automatically destroyed during the Resolve Skirmishes
step of a battle regardless of whether or not the opponent
has sufficient strength to destroy it. This ability is ignored
if the unit with the sacrifice ability is unable to attack both
the opposing front line unit and supporting units (due to its
attack capability). This is also ignored if the opposing unit
has cloaking and a friendly detector is not present."