when they say 3 marks at 2-10 or whatever it is what does that mean? also who is in the y-wing that you see after lukes torps go in before the deathstar blows up?

Keyan Farlander

The 'Marks' comment is referencing X number of enemy craft located at a certain angle from their ships, if I recall correctly.

Also the line was from Gold Leader, Jon "Dutch" Vander, not Gold Seven Keyan Farlander.(Who, incidentally, was the only surviving member of Gold Squadron)

Sable was right, the 'marks' indicates enemy vessels. The 210 part is a degrees around your own vessel, so 210 would be calling out the marks just over your left shoulder (8 o'clock), so behind you, where you really dont want enemy craft.

Although no one would say two-ten, they would say two-one-zero or if they were really lazy two-one-oh but then again it is another universe so maybe it is different...

They said two ten, not 210.

210 woud make sense were this ground or wet navy combat but not in the air or space. You need the third dimension for calling targets.

Two Ten is just short for saying two o'clock by ten o'clock.

Call the nose of your craft 12o'clock making your left wing 9 o'clock your right wing 3 o'clock and your rear 6.

The Ten would be the location of the target on a second clock face, this one being vertical.

They said two ten, not 210.

210 woud make sense were this ground or wet navy combat but not in the air or space. You need the third dimension for calling targets.

Two Ten is just short for saying two o'clock by ten o'clock.

Call the nose of your craft 12o'clock making your left wing 9 o'clock your right wing 3 o'clock and your rear 6.

The Ten would be the location of the target on a second clock face, this one being vertical.

makes sense I guess

the Third Dimension doesn't necessarily have to be a number.

It could be "High" or "Low" relative to you.

It also could be "Positive" or "Negative"

IF a negative bearing is said it means they're coming in from below. But since the only thing below the fighters attacking the Deathstar was the Deathstar the call out of only "Positive" numbers signalling "they're coming from above" does make some sense.

although if you listen to the Dialogue during the battle It reminds me of playing Call of Duty with the call outs.. lacks consistency.

While Red Leader's flight encounter's the TIE's Luke calls out "[they're] coming in point Three-Five"

In the trench Wedge calls out "Fighters coming point Three"

from the clips "point Three" appears to be "6 o'clock" since Vader and the Ties are already in the trench.

Don't worry about the numbers since we don't know what the relative station point is. It's there to simulate Dogfight com-traffic.

So... alright, I watched the trench run scene a couple times.

During the second attempt; Red Leader(Garven Dreis), Red 10 and Red 12, Luke calls the targets incoming at .35(Point Three Five).

Red 10 looks up and to the left.

That would have been the same as calling 350º, right?
I mean, they are below plane of the surface and North-Northwest is at 337.5°. Which would also answer what they meant by calling 2-10 (being is South-Southwest at 202.5° and Southwest at 225°) and he looked over his shoulder to the left.

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.
...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

Also the line was from Gold Leader, Jon "Dutch" Vander, not Gold Seven Keyan Farlander.(Who, incidentally, was the only surviving member of Gold Squadron)

i wasnt stating who said what as the question was: WHAT does this mean, and WHO survived, since my answer was a WHO and not a WHAT, i was only answering the second question.

Also the line was from Gold Leader, Jon "Dutch" Vander, not Gold Seven Keyan Farlander.(Who, incidentally, was the only surviving member of Gold Squadron)

i wasnt stating who said what as the question was: WHAT does this mean, and WHO survived, since my answer was a WHO and not a WHAT, i was only answering the second question.

I am half retarded today...

thats ok, im 100% polish so im lucky if i survive any day!!!

I always thought they meant speed with the point three five bit

I'm pretty sure George Lucas just made up numbers that sounded cool for the script. Except for the "three marks" part — that definitely means "three enemy fighters" or at least "three bogies," which is easy enough to come up with for a script.

Keep in mind, Lucas watched a LOT of WWII Aerial combat footage and listened to a lot of radio chatter for those scenes. I'm sure that influenced things a bit.

In ROTJ, they start using degrees. As cool as I think it is, I doubt there was any sort of logic. During the deleted scenes on the blu-ray, they feed the pilots a list of generic lines, so it's not like it was written into the script.

Also, that's assuming they use the same units of measure in star wars. The "12 o'clock high" thing is in reference to a clock; the star wars chatter could be in reference to some mundane thing we just don't know about.

the Third Dimension doesn't necessarily have to be a number.

It could be "High" or "Low" relative to you.

It also could be "Positive" or "Negative"

IF a negative bearing is said it means they're coming in from below. But since the only thing below the fighters attacking the Deathstar was the Deathstar the call out of only "Positive" numbers signalling "they're coming from above" does make some sense.

although if you listen to the Dialogue during the battle It reminds me of playing Call of Duty with the call outs.. lacks consistency.

While Red Leader's flight encounter's the TIE's Luke calls out "[they're] coming in point Three-Five"

In the trench Wedge calls out "Fighters coming point Three"

from the clips "point Three" appears to be "6 o'clock" since Vader and the Ties are already in the trench.

Don't worry about the numbers since we don't know what the relative station point is. It's there to simulate Dogfight com-traffic.

I suspect they wouldn't say "High" or "Low" because they more than likely couldn't know for sure which direction your fighter was oriented. If he says High and you're upside down relative to him, he's going to get you killed.

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.

...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

You sir/madam, amuse me. The parsecs thing had to be a fluke that Lucas tried to correct later on. "Oh, well the Kessel Run is in black hole territory so you have to avoid them so you would travel a greater distance whereas the Falcon had a better navicomputer to allow it to fly closer to the holes and thus travel less distance..." blah blah blah.

The last bit about moving torpedoes at right angles made me smile. I think I always wondered why everyone else's Protons just shot straight out but Luke's curved to a ridiculous degree, to the point that it seemed only someone with the power of the force could have even pulled off that shot. Of course it was explained at some point (Note: not in the movies) that Proton Torpedoes could have a programmed trajectory and were highly maneuverable.

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.

...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

You sir/madam, amuse me. The parsecs thing had to be a fluke that Lucas tried to correct later on. "Oh, well the Kessel Run is in black hole territory so you have to avoid them so you would travel a greater distance whereas the Falcon had a better navicomputer to allow it to fly closer to the holes and thus travel less distance..." blah blah blah.

When Han makes that comment in the movie, if you notice, Obi Won throws him a smirk-glance as if to say, " Did you actually just say that? "

I think it was done on purpose to give the illusion that Han Solo believes his ship is so fast it travels less distance.

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.

...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

You sir/madam, amuse me. The parsecs thing had to be a fluke that Lucas tried to correct later on. "Oh, well the Kessel Run is in black hole territory so you have to avoid them so you would travel a greater distance whereas the Falcon had a better navicomputer to allow it to fly closer to the holes and thus travel less distance..." blah blah blah.

When Han makes that comment in the movie, if you notice, Obi Won throws him a smirk-glance as if to say, " Did you actually just say that? "

I think it was done on purpose to give the illusion that Han Solo believes his ship is so fast it travels less distance.

Maybe... It felt like a line that just sounded cool that he added in that later had to be fixed because of the whole issue with it sounding like time and not distance. The biggest flaw in the Parsec line has to be the fact that it is a measurement from our Earth to our Sun and Star Wars takes place in a completely different Galaxy a long time ago.

Lol!

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.

...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

You sir/madam, amuse me. The parsecs thing had to be a fluke that Lucas tried to correct later on. "Oh, well the Kessel Run is in black hole territory so you have to avoid them so you would travel a greater distance whereas the Falcon had a better navicomputer to allow it to fly closer to the holes and thus travel less distance..." blah blah blah.

When Han makes that comment in the movie, if you notice, Obi Won throws him a smirk-glance as if to say, " Did you actually just say that? "

I think it was done on purpose to give the illusion that Han Solo believes his ship is so fast it travels less distance.

Also, as a side note, I am sure this dialog stands up considering Han has the ship that can make the Kessel run in under 12 parsecs.

...and there are space wizards that can move a torpedoes at right angles.

You sir/madam, amuse me. The parsecs thing had to be a fluke that Lucas tried to correct later on. "Oh, well the Kessel Run is in black hole territory so you have to avoid them so you would travel a greater distance whereas the Falcon had a better navicomputer to allow it to fly closer to the holes and thus travel less distance..." blah blah blah.

The last bit about moving torpedoes at right angles made me smile. I think I always wondered why everyone else's Protons just shot straight out but Luke's curved to a ridiculous degree, to the point that it seemed only someone with the power of the force could have even pulled off that shot. Of course it was explained at some point (Note: not in the movies) that Proton Torpedoes could have a programmed trajectory and were highly maneuverable.

my attempt to bring levity to this topic...

Concerning Kessel; There was a discussion with some other, friends of mine, Star Wars geeks, years ago. We had discussed the fact that to successfully navigate the Kessel system(a smuggler's route to the uninitiated), a pilot would weave in and out of the 18 parsec section of space, between the black holes. We felt that Han knew someone that had made the run in the modified craft in under 12 parsecs via sling shot around the edges of the singularities.

"It's the ship that made the Kessel Run in less than twelve parsecs"

He made it sound like a race... either way we went WAY off topic.

It's true, Han never said he did it.

It's true, Han never said he did it.

Correct. He never said he did it. He was just boasting that the Millennium Falcon could do it.

Han: "You've never heard of the Millennium Falcon?"

Obi: *shakes head no*

Han: "It's the ship that made the Kessel Run in less than 12 parsecs."

Obi: *shoots smirk-glance, and stares at Han*