I'm not sure why the issue of ship ownership is equated with metagaming. I'd think that it's more an issue of maintaining verisimilitude than anything.

Yep. Some players are more detail oriented. I know a pile of mathematicians who are quite into crunching numbers. Go figure. To each his own.

It sounds like some groups/GMs are too focused on the nuances of ship ownership and meta gaming a bit too much. This is Star Wars, not Sim Starship. It's probable your group would rather be out adventuring rather than calculating passenger rates and maintenance fee responsibilities. If these things were that important to the game then I'm confident that FFG would have put it in the book.

Each to their own! However why have FFG put in the costs of owning a starship in the rules, without putting in rules for how you earn those credits when you are not transporting mass murderers and proton torpedoes for Jabba the Hutt. FFG have only half done the job. If people do not want to number crunch then they do not have to, if they do thay should have the rules to do it. To only half do the job is half assed.

I love that. "If you don't want to use the rules then you don't have to, but FFG should have put them in." How about "If you want to use them make them up for yourself, because FFG felt it wasn't needed in a game focused on adventuring." Why waste time and effort on something very few people are interested in? That effort is better expended elsewhere.

I love that. "If you don't want to use the rules then you don't have to, but FFG should have put them in." How about "If you want to use them make them up for yourself, because FFG felt it wasn't needed in a game focused on adventuring." Why waste time and effort on something very few people are interested in? That effort is better expended elsewhere.

Then why put in the costs of running a ship?

Because the ship is commodity used by the characters like a blaster or a lightsaber and needs a value. But this is a game of adventure not of ship ownership. A ship is just another tool like blasters and lightsabers. If you want the tedium of player characters deciding who pays for the gas and such, feel free to incorporate such, but don't expect support for something that a majority of people gloss over in the narrative. And neither is FFG going to waste time and energy on something very few people want. Its a waste of pages better used elsewhere.

If you think it deserves more attention, why not create a fan-based document to share? Many others have done so to great effect.

Interestingly I find myself in just such a situation, an issue of ship ownership just a couple of weeks ago.

First, this isn't a case of a player whining about bad things happening to a character. If I were to tabulate the bad things I have perilously loaded my character(s) down with throughout my gaming history, I could write a freakin' book. So no, this isn't just sour grapes.

So my character stole her daddy mint, vintage, beautiful, cherry YT-1300, just before the start of the game. At the end of the first game, after all the characters are introduced and we're all teamed up, I hired them as crew, all profits are split 5 ways - four crew members and one to the ship for maintenance and fees and upgrades and whatnot. Pretty equitable arrangement, no issues there, and everything is cool.

But then last week, the ship got shot down - 0 hull, couple of serious crits, GM said the ship was more or less un-salvageable. However we managed to pinch another (more or less) comparable ship - so we're back to zero again. Everything good, right? Not really - now it's everyone's ship, since it was acquired during the course of play. Meanwhile while everyone's been buying guns and armor and cool toys, I've been sinking all my personal profit into sexy new ship toys, improved sensors, bits and pieces from the Galaxy Guide 6 soucebook,

And somehow - and I know this is just stupid because were talking about imaginary people in an imaginary setting, we're playing cops and robbers out behind the school - I cant help feeling just slightly put out that my ship has now become community property.

So I can kind of see where "The owner is the owner" is coming from. And no, I realize that the story should be served above all things, but there's just this stupid, nagging quiet voice in the back of my brain saying "Man, now I have to share my ship!" Petty, I know - and I know I'll get over it (and we're all good friends and I'll burn my core rule book to ashes before I let an imaginary spaceship get between real world friends), but it's still there.

I'd handle this out of game and then role-play it in game. Your character should approache the others and lets them know that they need to pay equally into the ship since it's communal property and they each owe you their fair share of the upgrades. If they don't have cash on hand, then any upcoming shares should go to you until everything is balanced out. Then if any repairs or modifications need to be done, everyone has to chip in equally.

Or, since you are putting money into the ship, it's now X% more yours based on what you are putting into it. i.e. It starts out as a 100k ship so each of you has 25k worth. Now it's a 150k ship. They have 25k worth and you have 75k worth. So if you sell it, you get half and they can split the rest.

I'd recomend the first option.

In the game I'm in our group is a company. Half of all profits go to the company and the rest gets split by the party. We use that half for all repairs, upgrades, etc. Or we will once we get a chance to. It's still early in the game.

I'd handle this out of game and then role-play it in game.

Well, my first rule, of any game and not just EotE, is talk about things first. So everything is cool now, with some hand waving and some creative storytelling.

Remember kids, always talk to the GM first! (:

I love that. "If you don't want to use the rules then you don't have to, but FFG should have put them in." How about "If you want to use them make them up for yourself, because FFG felt it wasn't needed in a game focused on adventuring." Why waste time and effort on something very few people are interested in? That effort is better expended elsewhere.

I was looking for advice on this thread not sarcasm and backbiting. Ragnar had a perfectly valid point. It is obvious that you only like playing one way and are intolerant of other differing styles of play. If you have some advice for the original question, other than don't be a metagamer, then give it. Otherwise get off the thread and plague a different one.

Advice has been given by many people, including myself way back in the beginning. Ultimately what it boils down to is that as a group you should decide this stuff on your own. A majority of gamers are not jerks and it really shouldn't be an issue to do so. Whether you are giving out shares or have a communal pot or whatever floats your fancy, there are many forms it can take and will vary with each group. No two groups are going to be the same, so there is no way to have rules on this.

Indeed! The only limits are your imagination! Believe in yourself! If that doesn't work then don't believe in yourself, believe in me as I believe in you!

*borrows line from classic 80s song* "Don't believe the church and state and everything they tell you./Believe in me -- I'm with the High Command."

Indeed! The only limits are your imagination! Believe in yourself! If that doesn't work then don't believe in yourself, believe in me as I believe in you!

*borrows line from classic 80s song* "Don't believe the church and state and everything they tell you./Believe in me -- I'm with the High Command."

This song is further off the beaten path; (Angelspit 100%)

"Bathing in your arrogance

Dining will ensue

God made me a cannibal

To fix problems like you"

Would people in the real world charge their associates for transportation when undertaking a mutual venture?

Would people in the real world charge their associates for transportation when undertaking a mutual venture?

Hey, everybody need needs to chip in for gas, tolls, and (if applicable) parking. If I'm driving around for months on end, they're chipping in for maintenance costs too.

I thought I would drop in my 2 credits. As a GM, it's boring to stop the action every time there's some minor (under 100 cred) payment that needs to be made. I note that stuff down ("leaving Formos, customs fees on c600 cargo", etc.) and then when I distribute xp and creds later, the minor payments come out first. That way ship maintenance, docking fees, customs, licenses, etc. are all handled after the session and not in the middle. This works for both SW games that I've GMed (different systems) where the party is/is becoming a mutually-dependent group and is not one with a history of working together.

If the payments come up in game for whatever reason, the players can RP that stuff out in game. "What do you mean you need creds for a drink?" "I used my last 15 yesterday to pay your stupid docking fee. It was my turn, remember?" Whether the captain is charging the crew for each hop, giving them a total bill at the end, they take turns paying, whatever; it's not necessary for us to track all those details in game unless it comes up. This also gives the players more freedom to RP without trying to remember who has paid for what. I use a similar system for misc. credits - if you are searching an Imperial official's office for loot, you may find "assorted small tech items worth around 50 credits" and I note that, and once your character has a chance to visit a merchant/marketplace/fence I will award you the credits. There's no need to track this 5 credit datapad, and a 12 credit hyperspanner, etc.

As far as ship upgrades and crew payments go - I definitely leave that up to each group at any given point. I have several suggestions on this thread, and they all work for different groups. Personally, I prefer an approach that puts the focus on the characters and narratives and not so much on their pocketbooks and character sheets. :-)

Would people in the real world charge their associates for transportation when undertaking a mutual venture?

Hey, everybody need needs to chip in for gas, tolls, and (if applicable) parking. If I'm driving around for months on end, they're chipping in for maintenance costs too.

Gas, Grass or Ass, man! The hippie code!

This song is further off the beaten path; (Angelspit 100%)

"Bathing in your arrogance

Dining will ensue

God made me a cannibal

To fix problems like you"

Off the beaten path, but not unknown.