I have been excited for every thing X-wing since the owner of my LGS showed me that it was coming. I love Star Wars, I love the game mechanics. X-wing is by far my favorite miniture game Ihave ever played, and I have played quite a few.

But I will admit that I am not super excited about Wave 4. Here's why

Z-95, E-Wing, and TIE Phantom are ulgy. Especially the E-wing. The figure just doesn't make my gut tingle the way just about every other miniture in this game does.

Z-95 as a swarm ship. I get that it adds an element to the rebelion play that wasn't there before, but I still have a couple of problems with that. First, game play wise, by adding swarms to the rebel list it makes the Rebels and The Imperials more alike. They lose a bit of their flavor. Second, is more thematic. The Rebelion just doesn't have as many people as the Empire. It also values the lives of its pilots. Both of these reasons make me think that the Rebellion would be reluctant to field swarms of cheap expendable ships.

I thought I wouldn't like the E-wing and the TIE-Defender, becasue they are super ships. Why would any one play a TIE Advancd if there was a TIE Defender. Well the answer is becasue the TIE Defender costs about 50% more points. I am actually kind of excited to see if a two ships squadron could be competative. The TIE Defender is also beautiful. I just wish the E-wing wasn't so ugly. I can't blame FFG for it since their E-wing looks the way an E-Wing is supposed to look. It's not that their model is ugly, it is that the E-wing is ugly.

Try to keep in mind, when judging the TIE Defender, that there's that speculation about 150 points being the new standard

personally I think the defender is ugly... Z-95 looks cool, phantom looks cool.. E wing is ok looking, would look better with the BIG third canon...

150pt would be cool, and a lot more tie fighters

i think the epic rules will be something like 150-200 pts. im not wanting too many ships in tournament play.

8v8 ships is going to be crazy - more than 8v8 is going to need a larger play mat.

I can agree with some of this, but here is something I was thinking of...

If you are playing rebels.. play them.. the Z95 is outdated and typically regulated to planetary defense units.. maybe they support a couple Y wings, or X wings... but they are not a main battle fighter.. they, in my thought, would be great for a campaign (maybe that cinematic play), or just some scenarios where the Imps attack a palnetary system, or something similar...

I won't be getting many, as I prefer Imperials, but I can see the sudden rush of rebel swarms... and they when they don't pan out well, they will fade out. The Z95 is no TIE fighter, I don't think it will work as a swarm craft.. maybe in a 150 point game.. but again.. I'm not buying more that 4.. if that..

Just my thoughts...

I see the Z-95's as more of a filler than a swarm ship. The only way I'd swarm them is if I had a ton of assault missiles.

I see the Z-95's as more of a filler than a swarm ship. The only way I'd swarm them is if I had a ton of assault missiles.

The Z-95 expansion includes an assault missile card. So start swarming them.

Fielding 6 Bandit Squadron Pilots, you can afford 5 assault missiles and an Ion Pulse missile.

Remember, that as PS 2 pilots, you'll be able to target lock the Tie Swarm easily.

They'll be evading, but if you stack your target locks on one or two ships, that'l be enough to deal significant splash damage.

As long as everyone is formation flying, I'll agree here. Admittedly I was forgetting about the splash, that is gonna change up some tactics I think.

That can introduce new ways to fly your swarms so you can't get wrecked by an alpha strike that dumps half your ships, making your next turn possibly your last. Short games can make tourneis go so much faster.. lol

I definitely think the Z95 will be strong in swarms but in a different type of swarm. they don't need the backup from Howlrunner because they have their own target lock. Let's say we have the assault missile alpha strike list that's been mentioned several times against a tie swarm. the Z95 is PS2, definitely an advantage over the academy because if the large number of ships. Assume only two of five connect. you have destroyed at least one if not two TIEs already, and can pick off the remainders with target locked shots. you only need one hit to go thru. Will take a few rounds and you'll lose some fighters, but definitely a competitive approach. And there is definitely potential here for squad filler, which is a weakness for academy pilots in my opinion, other than to spread out incoming shots.

Z-95 as a swarm ship. I get that it adds an element to the rebelion play that wasn't there before, but I still have a couple of problems with that. First, game play wise, by adding swarms to the rebel list it makes the Rebels and The Imperials more alike. They lose a bit of their flavor. Second, is more thematic. The Rebelion just doesn't have as many people as the Empire. It also values the lives of its pilots. Both of these reasons make me think that the Rebellion would be reluctant to field swarms of cheap expendable ships.

Believe it or not the Rebels have more infantry, ground vehicles, and cap ships than the Grand NAVY/ARMY of the Republic. The fighters are what is lacking. This is based on info in the Rebellion era source book and the atlas. This game isnt set in any one point in time. You are probably right that most the time you wont see cannon fodder units flying around but with the other types of combatants they very well could have cannon fodder troops.

I can agree with some of this, but here is something I was thinking of...

If you are playing rebels.. play them.. the Z95 is outdated and typically regulated to planetary defense units.. maybe they support a couple Y wings, or X wings... but they are not a main battle fighter.. they, in my thought, would be great for a campaign (maybe that cinematic play), or just some scenarios where the Imps attack a palnetary system, or something similar...

I won't be getting many, as I prefer Imperials, but I can see the sudden rush of rebel swarms... and they when they don't pan out well, they will fade out. The Z95 is no TIE fighter, I don't think it will work as a swarm craft.. maybe in a 150 point game.. but again.. I'm not buying more that 4.. if that..

Just my thoughts...

I do remember a elite Head Hunter Wing or Squadron tasked with supporting Solos strike team during Endor. I think they where called Tannb...?

The era makes a big diffrence what fighters you will see the Rebels using. At the start their main fighters were the Head Hunters, ARC-170s, and BLT-B Y-Wings. They kept the Head Hunters scrapped the 170s because they required to much maintance and tomany opperators per ship, and chopped up the BLT-Bs and used their turrets and armor on bases and Cap ships.

Next they used the Head Hunters, BLT-A4 Y-Wings, and Star Chasers. Head Hunters were still mainline fighters but were replaced by A4 for more important missions. Star Chasers went bye bye, in SWTFU2 they looked to do a terrible job agianst TIE Fighters.

These are just the fighters they used during the Dark Times =)

I can agree with some of this, but here is something I was thinking of...

If you are playing rebels.. play them.. the Z95 is outdated and typically regulated to planetary defense units.. maybe they support a couple Y wings, or X wings... but they are not a main battle fighter.. they, in my thought, would be great for a campaign (maybe that cinematic play), or just some scenarios where the Imps attack a palnetary system, or something similar...

I won't be getting many, as I prefer Imperials, but I can see the sudden rush of rebel swarms... and they when they don't pan out well, they will fade out. The Z95 is no TIE fighter, I don't think it will work as a swarm craft.. maybe in a 150 point game.. but again.. I'm not buying more that 4.. if that..

Just my thoughts...

I do remember a elite Head Hunter Wing or Squadron tasked with supporting Solos strike team during Endor. I think they where called Tannb...?

The era makes a big diffrence what fighters you will see the Rebels using. At the start their main fighters were the Head Hunters, ARC-170s, and BLT-B Y-Wings. They kept the Head Hunters scrapped the 170s because they required to much maintance and tomany opperators per ship, and chopped up the BLT-Bs and used their turrets and armor on bases and Cap ships.

Next they used the Head Hunters, BLT-A4 Y-Wings, and Star Chasers. Head Hunters were still mainline fighters but were replaced by A4 for more important missions. Star Chasers went bye bye, in SWTFU2 they looked to do a terrible job agianst TIE Fighters.

These are just the fighters they used during the Dark Times =)

Cool, something I didn't know.. and I'm always happy to learn new things about my favorite sci fi series..

The history of headhunters is very cool, and they were a well used ship in their hayday, I agree very much that the eranis an important factor. This game really doesn't seem to care much for that aspect, as I've seen it.. there are many pilots that died in either if the death star battles, and if you use an era to define your campaign, or just your concept of game play, then you disqualify some of the pilots.

There is also some concern that if you go too early that some pilots are in the Imperial forces and still inelgible for use. Biggs Darklighter is really only in the rebel forces for a relatively short time before dieing in the trench of the first death star..

But all that really only happens if you use any concept that makes use of era and the pilots elgibility...

personally I think the defender is ugly... Z-95 looks cool, phantom looks cool.. E wing is ok looking, would look better with the BIG third canon...

This. I completely agree. The hard part is that the competitive / completionist part of me will want to have like 4 Defenders, and yet the aesthetic / casual player in me cannot stand the way the Defender looks.

It probably doesnt help that I'm a core guy (read that as Original Trilogy) at heart, and do not have much exposure to the EU. Of course, the HWK looked stupid - for lack of a better word - to me when it was first released and I bought none of them at Gencon. Now, it has totally grown on me to the point where, not only do I have 3 of them, but if it had a better dial, I'd probably put at least one of them in every rebel build I come up with.

Haha.. we all gravitate to what we like.. I think the Defender is gorgeous.. and that Phantom is pretty cool as well..

I'll add in to say that all the ships except for the E-wing look great! The E-wing IMO...really? I thought the HWK was bad but this model, accurate yes but ugly enough for me not to buy it.

The headhunter however will be brought in multibles!

I think there are things we all like and don't like about the new ships whenever they are first revealed. I remember when people didn't think the Firespray would be that great compared to the YT. And people thought the Lambda would be incredible. Then they said it was terrible. And now people are finally figuring out where it fits (mostly thanks to Sable).

I thought the HWK was going to be crap when it's stats were first revealed. It is now one of my favorite ships.

I have my fare share of reservations/concerns about this wave, but I also am very excited. Because I know how we feel now will most likely change after we actually play with the ships for a couple of months. Everything will start to make sense I am sure.

In the meantime I know we will all do the calculate, theorize and predict what will suck and what will be good until they are released! Cheers!

I think there are things we all like and don't like about the new ships whenever they are first revealed. I remember when people didn't think the Firespray would be that great compared to the YT. And people thought the Lambda would be incredible. Then they said it was terrible. And now people are finally figuring out where it fits (mostly thanks to Sable).

I thought the HWK was going to be crap when it's stats were first revealed. It is now one of my favorite ships.

I have my fare share of reservations/concerns about this wave, but I also am very excited. Because I know how we feel now will most likely change after we actually play with the ships for a couple of months. Everything will start to make sense I am sure.

In the meantime I know we will all do the calculate, theorize and predict what will suck and what will be good until they are released! Cheers!

My issues have very little to do with whether or not these ships will be good in the game. There is already speculation that the TIE Defender is over priced. I agree that we should wait and see before any discussion about "how good" they are. My worries are more primal than that. Like how cheap ships effect the over-all rebel play style and how ugly these ships are, especially the E-wing.

The E wing, to me, looks aggressive.. like a puma with its shoulder hunched over slowly stalking its prey... the headhunter has a X wing feel and hence.. not ugly.. lol..

I think they all look great and I'm looking forward to them. I've really enjoyed how FFG has put this game together.

I think there are things we all like and don't like about the new ships whenever they are first revealed. I remember when people didn't think the Firespray would be that great compared to the YT. And people thought the Lambda would be incredible. Then they said it was terrible. And now people are finally figuring out where it fits (mostly thanks to Sable).

I thought the HWK was going to be crap when it's stats were first revealed. It is now one of my favorite ships.

I have my fare share of reservations/concerns about this wave, but I also am very excited. Because I know how we feel now will most likely change after we actually play with the ships for a couple of months. Everything will start to make sense I am sure.

In the meantime I know we will all do the calculate, theorize and predict what will suck and what will be good until they are released! Cheers!

My issues have very little to do with whether or not these ships will be good in the game. There is already speculation that the TIE Defender is over priced. I agree that we should wait and see before any discussion about "how good" they are. My worries are more primal than that. Like how cheap ships effect the over-all rebel play style and how ugly these ships are, especially the E-wing.

I agree with you. Rebel swarms were something I was sure FFG wouldn't do because it blends the line between the factions. I was just offering a hopeful thought that things will all fall into place (fingers crossed).

As for the LOOK of the ships. It seams a lot of people really like the designs, and others can't stand them.

For me personally, the Defender gives me a headache just looking at it. I think it's very ugly looking. As for the rest I actually like them! The E-Wing looks fine to me, and the Phantom looks pretty neat. But yeah these are definitely the least attractive miniatures in the game thus far.

yeah I am all ready planning on buying 4 each of the new ships, except the z-95s if I can swing it I will be getting 8 of those!.. I do think the HWK is still the ugliest ship so far... just dont like the odd angle the way the wings sweep and the Anhedral of them. to me the HWK looks like a bad copy that a 6 year old created.. However I know its actually designed to look that way..lol BTW I have 4 of those ugly ships..lol

The only reason I would get 8 Z95s is if I was gonna repaint 4 of em.. lol..

Personally I think all of these ships look awesome. I think they add variety in both build options and aesthetics. But to each his own right?

I don't think the Z95 will make a very good swarm ship. 8 Z's won't be as effective as 8 ties for the simple reason that when fighting Empire builds it doesn't bring enough firepower to be effective against 3 agility ships. That is one of the main reason's I don't use A's, lack of firepower. I think they will primarily serve as cheap filler in a build. When you have 25 points left in you build, you can go for 1 x-wing/b-wing or 2 Z's. That is variety that I'm going to enjoy. But I don't think I will ever run more than 2-3 of them.

I think Etahn becomes kind of the Rebel version of Howl. Use him with 2-3 Z's and try to rain some crits on your unshielded opponents. But you don't have to fly him in formation with any of your other ships in order for it to work! I'm gonna like that combo

http://www.justanothersnakecult.com/x-wing-wave-4/

great info here if u havent already read it.

how do people feel about the costs of these new ships? balanced? too early to say for sure? i guess the movement dials will be the deciding factor in the end.