I've been following the EoE and AoR forums for a short while now, and I've seen much that is positive about this game. Not that I want to focus on it (and there's no need to "win me over" because I'm sold on them), but the dice mechanics are interesting, intriguing, and compelling, but I have one or two players that are opposed to "fiddly" dice such as these. Obviously, that's my problem, not yours.

I would also like to take a brief moment to say the community among these (SW) forums is wonderful. Much of the content and discussion is engaging and keeps my interest piqued.

What I know of SW is the OT and the PT (to use the jargon), and I've watched about half the animated Clone Wars series, though the animation really wasn't to my personal taste (the story was fine). I also read a Timothy Zahn novel about fifteen (?) years ago, and it was pretty amazing, though the title escapes me (I'm old). Excellent author, and I'd have read more but for other interests at the time. Ah, and Splinter Of A Mind's Eye way back when it was first published (meh). Oh, and a comic from maybe 1979-ish that had a story line about a (the) "second" Death Star named The Tarkin. I refuse the watch The Battle For Endor (it's my hatred of Willow...).

I know I don't have to be completely steeped in SW lore to run a SW RPG.

I know jumping in to play is more than three tanks of gas (for me); the CRB and at least two sets of dice bang in right around $100.

If you could pinpoint one truly amazing and "Buy it now!" aspect of the game (not including the dice mechanic and its narrative value) what would it be?

If you could say only one thing to entice traditional d20 RPGers to this game, what would it be?

Please do not suggest I listen to the Order 66 podcast- the format, presentation, and content are great, but the racist and sexist undertones of the hosts' speech is off-putting and (personally) I cannot ignore it, and I've chosen to stay clear of it after just three episodes.

Thanks all for your input and insight.

If you could say only one thing to entice traditional d20 RPGers to this game, what would it be?

It's better than traditional d20 RPG's.

I'd skip the dice and get the app, cheaper. I bought it through Amazon and can load it onto 3 android devices. I have it on my phone and my KIndle HDX. Cheaper and works fine.

CRB is really all you need. The supplements are great but not necessary.

I listened to about 28 mins of the last podcast and I decided they are ok to skip, way too long winded for me.

The aspect I personally like the most is the careers and skill system and the way it establishes specializations that provide guidance and direction without locking one into a specific class.

Its a nice change of pace, its got great art, and it has Jawas.

I still prefer d20, but that doesn't mean its the only thing I should ever try.

If you could say only one thing to entice traditional d20 RPGers to this game, what would it be?

For the players: you can play the class you want, the mechanics won't punish you for not having the "right" combination of classes in the party.

For the gm: you can finally sleep in, prep time is dramatically shorter, and if things go nuts its a lot easier to just AdLib and go with it.

It plays with paper, and it has good community support.

I find that I can be really creative with adventure design. I find that d20 (Pathfinder) was very combat focused, while here, they just say 10XP per session + meeting goals.

I'm not noticing any game bog down as the players get more experience.

The premade adventures... suck. However, the one they sell (Beyond The Rim) has to be one of the best ever written. Everyone has a completely different story for how its playing out. Its fun, and it involves all the players in different ways.

I'm noticing my players are less concerned with counting squares for tactics (d20), and embracing cool for doing stuff (Can I jump on the skiff, power down its repulsors, and leap off?) It really is changing how my players play.

Best game I have ever played. Any system, and genre, and format. Ever.

Oh, you actually want reasons, hmmm...besides the dice and the setting, I'd say:

"Sandbox-style character creation and advancement allows complexity and nuance without becoming overwhelming, and scales gently in power."

One group I've GM'ed in several systems enjoyed Edge of the Empire so much they've asked to convert their 40K Dark Heresy characters into Edge rules and use those instead.

I highly recomend the beginner box - if you are unsure, it gives you a taste and includes a set of dice. The adventure is on the rails, but there is enough info to give divergent players enough to do. You also get maps and pogs to use.

I highly recomend the beginner box - if you are unsure, it gives you a taste and includes a set of dice. The adventure is on the rails, but there is enough info to give divergent players enough to do. You also get maps and pogs to use.

I suggest this as well. While playing you will see what the d20 system has done to our brains. Now that the group I run with has purged the mindset of d20, I can not see us ever going back. The d20 system not only plays in a box, but put my brain in a box as well. FREEDOM!

Best advice to give is...

Buy the Beginner box. It's only $40 (Canadian). You get dice, maps, tokens, rules AND an adventure. The rules are "lite" so you can absorb the core mechanic and get used to how the game goes without being forced to absorb the more esoteric aspects of the system like Obligation and the full Critical Hit system all in one go. If you don't like it, it's only a small investment down the drain, and hey, you tried.

After that, you can DL the "continuing adventure" free from the Beginner game web page and play a little longer while you and your group save for a Core Book ($60CDN if memory serves), and one more set of dice ($14CDN). I have found that 2 sets of dice is enough right now to accommodate an average group (4-6 persons). Also, the beginner box provides enough info to play a little while longer with adversaries and ships, gear etc. to create your own adventures. I should note that there are no character creation rules, and six available pre-generated characters (four in the set, and two more from the website).

By this time, passing around a book and piles of dice will be frustrating for a group of individuals who will be drooling for more SW. I found at first that I was the only one willing to make such a big investment (see above). However, after only a couple of months, four of my five players have their own CBs, and one of them added a set of dice to the mix. Myself and one other player are investing in the career books (Enter the Unknown so far, but Dangerous Covenants soon), and myself and two other players have eagerly purchased Suns of Fortune (we all agree it is one of the best "setting" books we've ever read).

Simply put, the beginner box is a gateway game that gives you plenty of buck bang, and leads to dangerous levels of fun and excitement if left unchecked.

Also of note is the release of the other upcoming games. If smugglers and bounty hunters aren't your thing, check out Age of Rebellion to join that fight, or wait til next year for Force and Destiny to play a Jedi. All systems are playable independently or together, and from the looks of things, will all have their own Beginner Boxes (more dice, more maps, more tokens!).

As far as converting d20 addicts, you can't sell the narrative dice mechanic without playing it, although it is fun trying to explain "you fail, but..." to persons for whom a binary check result is so ingrained). I would concentrate on selling the setting.

It's freaking STAR WARS. Sell that. Sell it as Firefly set in the Star Wars universe. Sell it as a nice change of pace from dungeon delving and rescuing noble-persons from whatever lich lord is trying to hide his precious phylactery this month.

Get an honest commitment from your group to try the Beginner Box plus "Long Arm of the Hutt" with open minds and hearts. By the time my group finished the first act of Long Arm... we all agreed the game was the cat's pyjamas, and immediately switched to the core system and dug our teeth in.

I hope this helps. Enjoy!

Gotta echo what everyone says. I'm a convert, after being initially skeptical.

Using the dice comes naturally in time, and ends up being a powerful narrative tool.

Like all games, it's possible to min/max, but unlike many games, it's not required to do so. Play what you want.

It brought me back to the SW fold after almost two decades away, and I'm loving the grown-up treatment of the SW concepts.

Here's something I like that I didn't see mentioned. The game mechanics are great for players who have never played d20 RPGs before. My wife will actually play this game because its easy to understand and the narrative style of play keeps her more interested then calculating all the modifiers in a d20 system.

Also, Star Wars is a familiar setting. It makes it easier for her to step into character.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One thing I have learned, as a brand spanking new GM, is I let the dice tell the story. I have had a player who was not even skilled in Gunnery, roll a fistful of dice because of "penalty dice" on during gameplay and still manage to succeed. Seeing the players whoop and cheer is music to a GMs ear and a key part of knowing it is a fun game.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

People do it all the time on these boards.

I'm not so sensitive as to be offended by it, but its a bad way to get people to try EotE out.

Also don't oversell it.

Saying something us the best game system ever is setting the players up to be dissapointed.

That's why I advised selling the setting. It's Star Wars. If you have to say any more than that, they won't like it no matter what the system is.

As far as d20 crapping, well you're going to get that no matter what. Frankly, I'm somewhat surprised (though pleasantly) that there aren't more Grognards condemning the new system in favour of WEG or WotC.

When I first started to sell it to my group, it was both easy and hard. "It's a NEW Star Wars RPG!"

"When do we Start?!" Done.

Then afterwards, it was, "Wait, How does it work?"

Well, blah blah blah-...-...You know what? We'll just have to wait and see..."

"OK..." *casting looks questioning my mental balance, but intrigued nonetheless*

The first session was slow, yet quick (compared to 4E). Half the group was instantly sold, but it took a couple more weeks to get the rest on board. And then as we started the Core system and made our own PCs, we had to start all over with the sales pitch, system comparisons and referencing, etc.

However, now that we are a couple of months in, I no longer have to reference other systems, and there are far fewer looks of panic when I don't run EVERY small combat encounter without a map (I still use them for the big, complex/climactic battles).

I think the main reason it's easy to criticize d20 is because of three factors. Firstly, whenever we get a new shiny that however subtly innovates our lives, we cast off the old and outdated. It's easiest to do this if we poke holes in it first.

"Old busted/New Hotness."

Secondly, the split between Paizo and WotC. This was a wedge that drove deep into the hearts of fans on both sides, and sadly, most of them haz interwebz and use it. Trolls love the bravery of being out of range.

Third, 4E. Everyone has reasons for loving/hating it, so it is so easy to start a fight by pointing at it and yelling "Eeeevviiillll!"

And claiming it to be the death of everything.

Without going to far into it or re-igniting a war, that's my .02. Not better, just different. As long as it's fun, give em yer money.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

People do it all the time on these boards.

I'm not so sensitive as to be offended by it, but its a bad way to get people to try EotE out.

Also don't oversell it.

Saying something us the best game system ever is setting the players up to be dissapointed.

I have been on these boards for months and not once did I see anyone "crapping all over D20". But hey there is a way to prove me wrong since apparently it happens "all the time" it shouldn't be hard to do so. I'll wait.

I stated it is better than d20, because in my opinion it is. No crapping or whatever since I also play a lot of d20.

"It's a Star Wars game where you get bonuses for descriptions and awesome ideas, and no more fiddly +1's running around to keep track of!"

I said the equivalent of this phrase to my gaming group. The d20 players are now hooked. Then again, some of them have problems with math from time to time, and when you have an entire sheet dedicated to the various bonuses you have due to feats, equipment and the like, it can get out of hand. . .

I should also note that I ran the Star Wars d20 edition (pre-Saga) for the better part of six years before getting into the d6 version for allowing more "leniency" regarding character types. I liked it for being functional, but to me, it just wasn't my bag.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

People do it all the time on these boards.

I'm not so sensitive as to be offended by it, but its a bad way to get people to try EotE out.

Also don't oversell it.

Saying something us the best game system ever is setting the players up to be dissapointed.

I have been on these boards for months and not once did I see anyone "crapping all over D20". But hey there is a way to prove me wrong since apparently it happens "all the time" it shouldn't be hard to do so. I'll wait.

I stated it is better than d20, because in my opinion it is. No crapping or whatever since I also play a lot of d20.

Wow, someone's Sarlacc Pit seems a little sore.

"It's a Star Wars game where you get bonuses for descriptions and awesome ideas, and no more fiddly +1's running around to keep track of!"

I said the equivalent of this phrase to my gaming group. The d20 players are now hooked. Then again, some of them have problems with math from time to time, and when you have an entire sheet dedicated to the various bonuses you have due to feats, equipment and the like, it can get out of hand. . .

I should also note that I ran the Star Wars d20 edition (pre-Saga) for the better part of six years before getting into the d6 version for allowing more "leniency" regarding character types. I liked it for being functional, but to me, it just wasn't my bag.

IMO, there are FAR more fiddly bits (looking at Talents here) than in D6. D6 was pretty straightforward in what you rolled for what and what you needed for success. Edge sometimes has players combing their Talent list to see if something modifies it, and GMs looking to set a Difficulty and then decide if it's Upgraded/Downgraded or Boosted/Setback.

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

People do it all the time on these boards.

I'm not so sensitive as to be offended by it, but its a bad way to get people to try EotE out.

Also don't oversell it.

Saying something us the best game system ever is setting the players up to be dissapointed.

I have been on these boards for months and not once did I see anyone "crapping all over D20". But hey there is a way to prove me wrong since apparently it happens "all the time" it shouldn't be hard to do so. I'll wait.

I stated it is better than d20, because in my opinion it is. No crapping or whatever since I also play a lot of d20.

Wow, someone's Sarlacc Pit seems a little sore.

Anyway, that was a weird reply to get to a decent post. But I guess that is what people do when you ask them to give examples and they have none. Then they just attack the person and ignore the content. Congrats!

Double

I would suggest not crapping all over d20 like a lot of EotE players seem to do is probably a good idea.

One person in this thread did that. Don't exagerate so much.

People do it all the time on these boards.

I'm not so sensitive as to be offended by it, but its a bad way to get people to try EotE out.

Also don't oversell it.

Saying something us the best game system ever is setting the players up to be dissapointed.

I have been on these boards for months and not once did I see anyone "crapping all over D20". But hey there is a way to prove me wrong since apparently it happens "all the time" it shouldn't be hard to do so. I'll wait.

I stated it is better than d20, because in my opinion it is. No crapping or whatever since I also play a lot of d20.

Wow, someone's Sarlacc Pit seems a little sore.

Must be all the sand.

Anyway, that was a weird reply to get to a decent post. But I guess that is what people do when you ask them to give examples and they have none. Then they just attack the person and ignore the content. Congrats!

I mean, I've been looking at these boards for about 3 months.

And I've seen plenty of comments ragging on d20 think (whatever that is) and the d20 SW games and d20 "murder hobo" roll players not role players.

I could spend 3 hours of my Sunday pouring over threads and quoting them and yadda yadda yadda to prove my opinion to a stranger on the internet.

But that sounds horrible, and I'm sure you would disagree that most of it was "crapping on d20" and wed be right back to where we started.

So we could save both if ourselves some time, and agree to disagree.

Overall I think this is a good board, and most people are nice and respectful.

D20 Think as I understand it, isn't inherently bad, just a detriment to playing this version. I tend to agree, but most of my players haven't played much d20, so it's not a problem for me. It's just advocating a change in approach, and certainly not shitting on the game for being different, it's simply pointing out that the game is different and some haven't shifted.

I personally can't say I've seen a pattern of negativity towards d20 on these boards myself.