Haha, yup... I basically backed up that more often than not, you'll 1 shot a TIE, and more often than not, you'll strip the stealth of an interceptor =P. If you want, I can just give you the number next time instead of how the number is gotten.

As long as you're agreeing with me, go for it. In fact, show your work - maybe the people who are arguing with me will glaze over as much as I do, trying to follow along.

Haha, yup... I basically backed up that more often than not, you'll 1 shot a TIE, and more often than not, you'll strip the stealth of an interceptor =P. If you want, I can just give you the number next time instead of how the number is gotten.

"Never tell me the odds"... and certainly never give me all of the math behind the odds

Oh but the odds never lie! They tell you whether it's better to reroll Han's attack or leave it as is. They tell you whether you're better focusing or evading. Heck, yesterday I did the math here on the forum and discovered that a TIE is better to focus than evade if it is going head to head against a B wing. I've been thinking evade was always the better option when "running scared" at the end of the game.

Haha, yup... I basically backed up that more often than not, you'll 1 shot a TIE, and more often than not, you'll strip the stealth of an interceptor =P. If you want, I can just give you the number next time instead of how the number is gotten.

"Never tell me the odds"... and certainly never give me all of the math behind the odds

Oh but the odds never lie! They tell you whether it's better to reroll Han's attack or leave it as is. They tell you whether you're better focusing or evading. Heck, yesterday I did the math here on the forum and discovered that a TIE is better to focus than evade if it is going head to head against a B wing. I've been thinking evade was always the better option when "running scared" at the end of the game.

Han Solo doesn't need such nonsense and neither do I!

But seriously math is fun... as long as I don't have to do it

Love me some HLC. Always put that on the Z-ceptor.

3 daggers with Fire control and HLC puts you at 99. its solid

Change one Dagger for Luke +PTL+Stealth and you'll have my fav 3 ship build that has no Han on it

Actually the odds are abit better than 57.4% to one shot the Tie because 1 hit and 1 crit will kill a proportion of the time. Hence why you can one shot an X-wing, <Hit, Hit, Hit, Crit> would do it, same for Adv. HWK needs <Hit, Crit, Crit> or <Hit, Hit, Hit, Crit>. Not exactly high probability events, but can certainly do significant damage to the target.

Actually the odds are abit better than 57.4% to one shot the Tie because 1 hit and 1 crit will kill a proportion of the time. Hence why you can one shot an X-wing, <Hit, Hit, Hit, Crit> would do it, same for Adv. HWK needs <Hit, Crit, Crit> or <Hit, Hit, Hit, Crit>. Not exactly high probability events, but can certainly do significant damage to the target.

But since we are talking about HLC, crits don't happen unless you get them on a re-roll or modify with marksmanship. So the odds might be a little better, but not reliable enough to factor in I think

Basically, think of the HLC as being unlimited missiles for slightly less than the price of 2. If you shoot one twice, you've made a profit.

These missiles don't crit on their own, but they don't require you to have or spend a target lock either.

And, yes, on the Lambda, can have this AND 2 Merc Co-Pilots for 2 guaranteed crits a shot at R3!

Got nothing to add really just wanted to thank Khyros for doing the math.

Unlike some people... I like seeing the odds.

Summary at the top - there is a SLIGHT chance for the X wing and HWK to get one shotted. It's ~1%, assuming the attacker has F+TL+HLC, and the defender does not have any tokens or obstructions. For those that don't want to look through math, don't read the rest of the post =P

Edit: I didn't think of the Shuttle with Mercs... that would make this much more plausible.

Yup. I don't consider crits any different from hits when doing math anyways, but if you want to potentially discuss them, there are 9 crits that can do 2 damage - 7 direct hits, and 2 minor explosions. The ME does 2 damage 3/8 of the time.

So (2 * 3/8 + 7) / 33 = 23.48% that a crit does 2 damage. So, yes, it's possible to one shot an X wing or a HWK, it's unlikely. You'd have to roll 4 hits, at least 1 of which is a crit, which has to be a natural roll on a TL reroll. And then the opponent needs to roll all blanks (39% on a X / HWK) If we just take that crit and evade probabilities together, ignoring the chance of rolling a crit + 3 hits, you're already down to 9% chance.

Your overall chance of rolling a crit with the F+TL HLC (assuming you don't reroll the focuses) is 12%. So, lets factor that into our 9% chance already, and now we're down to 1% chance of one shotting an X wing. Technically, this is SLIGHTLY higher for the hwk, since you could get away from only rolling 3 hits total... so there's the 1% + <.01% (its already down to 2% to just draw 2 2 damage crits and rolling 0 evades before we calculate the chance of rolling 2 crits + 1 hit + 1 miss).

He's got a point, if shields get stripped, and you have a target lock, there is a chance you could land one of several critical hits which could land bonus damage and potentially kill a target with 5 health.

Or just ruin their day with a nasty crit!

And, yes, on the Lambda, can have this AND 2 Merc Co-Pilots for 2 guaranteed crits a shot at R3!

This got me thinking

Omicron Pilot, HLC, FCS, merc x2, Engine Upgrade (38)

Acamedy Tie (12) - does 1 hard turns in front of the Omicron at an angle to keep it mostly stationary.

2x Saber with PTL (Run into the enemy, be jerks, keep the fight where the Bison can see)

98 points.

And, yes, on the Lambda, can have this AND 2 Merc Co-Pilots for 2 guaranteed crits a shot at R3!

This got me thinking

Omicron Pilot, HLC, FCS, merc x2, Engine Upgrade (38)

Acamedy Tie (12) - does 1 hard turns in front of the Omicron at an angle to keep it mostly stationary.

2x Saber with PTL (Run into the enemy, be jerks, keep the fight where the Bison can see)

98 points.

If you're intending to have your shuttle collide most turns, go with Advanced Sensors instead, so you don't lose your action.

I had thought to get the TL repeatedly would be better, but I think you have a point, I'd rather be Focused than TL...

This got me thinking

Omicron Pilot, HLC, FCS, merc x2, Engine Upgrade (38)

Acamedy Tie (12) - does 1 hard turns in front of the Omicron at an angle to keep it mostly stationary.

2x Saber with PTL (Run into the enemy, be jerks, keep the fight where the Bison can see)

98 points.

If you're intending to have your shuttle collide most turns, go with Advanced Sensors instead, so you don't lose your action.

Or use Sensor Jammer to help survival or to entice them to take extra damage when being attacked by the Sabers in order to get their damage through to the shuttle.

I've been looking at verious b wing builds. I get the use of Adv Sensors and the other bits and pieces, but I don't get HLC?

It costs 7 points

Ranges 2-3

you get 4 attack dice

but it nerfs all criticle hits down to basic hits

It's the point cost vs lack of damage i dont get.

Or am i seeing this upgrade all wrong?

The biggest plus to having a Heavy Laser over any torp or missile is you dont throw the laser away after shooting it one time.

I've been looking at verious b wing builds. I get the use of Adv Sensors and the other bits and pieces, but I don't get HLC?

It costs 7 points

Ranges 2-3

you get 4 attack dice

but it nerfs all criticle hits down to basic hits

It's the point cost vs lack of damage i dont get.

Or am i seeing this upgrade all wrong?

The biggest plus to having a Heavy Laser over any torp or missile is you dont throw the laser away after shooting it one time.

Assuming of course you get to fire it a second time. I'd say that no needing a TL, much less spending a TL, to fire the HLC is at least as big as having it be reusable.

Still, that second shot will be cheaper than another missile/torp and if you make three or more all of those additional attacks are "free". With the HLC as a guideline I'm even in favor of some kind of "missile bank" type of missile upgrade that will give "unlimited" missiles for the battle; the problem with these would be they would require a TL to use them.

I've been looking at verious b wing builds. I get the use of Adv Sensors and the other bits and pieces, but I don't get HLC?

It costs 7 points

Ranges 2-3

you get 4 attack dice

but it nerfs all criticle hits down to basic hits

It's the point cost vs lack of damage i dont get.

Or am i seeing this upgrade all wrong?

The biggest plus to having a Heavy Laser over any torp or missile is you dont throw the laser away after shooting it one time.

Assuming of course you get to fire it a second time. I'd say that no needing a TL, much less spending a TL, to fire the HLC is at least as big as having it be reusable.

Still, that second shot will be cheaper than another missile/torp and if you make three or more all of those additional attacks are "free". With the HLC as a guideline I'm even in favor of some kind of "missile bank" type of missile upgrade that will give "unlimited" missiles for the battle; the problem with these would be they would require a TL to use them.

You are speaking of thiings to come cough Missile Boat cough

Still, that second shot will be cheaper than another missile/torp and if you make three or more all of those additional attacks are "free". With the HLC as a guideline I'm even in favor of some kind of "missile bank" type of missile upgrade that will give "unlimited" missiles for the battle; the problem with these would be they would require a TL to use them.

You are speaking of thiings to come cough Missile Boat cough

That would be my thought. I'd expect it with a missile boat although maybe some other gunboat would bring it. Depending on the cost I think such an upgrade could do wonders for the A-Wing or TIE-Advanced and give them conditional firepower to make them something more than an annoyance.

So I am now going to give HLC another go. Is having 2 too many?

Dagger +hlc+fcs=33×2

So with 34 points left Do go with a named Y or a named X?

So I am now going to give HLC another go. Is having 2 too many?

Dagger +hlc+fcs=33×2

So with 34 points left Do go with a named Y or a named X?

Personally I'd drop the FCS. I think with the HLC you do enough damage that the FCS won't help that much. I like Advance sensors on the B's to increase you mobility/make sure you always get your action to increase the odds of your damage, or sensor jammer to increase your defense (if you don't have 2 lambda's and don't use proxies try one of each AS and SJ and see which you like best for future reference). And I would say named X-Wing. Wedge with PTL scares people enough that he may get focused on a bit which allows your B's to stay alive long enough to use those HLC's.

You're mostly looking at it wrong.

It's an expensive upgrade, for sure, but a very powerful one. It's a blunt instrument, which is why it doesn't land critical hits by default. That said, there are two things you need to take into account:

1. It rolls 4 dice at range 3, and the defender doesn't get a bonus die (secondary weapon rules) at that range against it,

2. Like any weapon in the game it needs to be focused and/or (ideally and ) target-locked to really shine - the HLC more than most weapons, because any critical damage results that come up on a reroll COUNT.

It's only that initial roll that 'nerfs' the crits down to hits. So if you factor in a target lock, Marksmanship, any number of other ways to modify results in the game, it can be a very brutal weapon.

not true, the crits are still reduced after rerolls. changing dice results after rerolls due to special rules DO NOT count as additional rerolls, therefore the results still change. it is identical to the way a focus token functions after a target lock reroll. The crit results are still changed as stated on the HLC card.

Yes it is. This is covered in the FAQ.

the rule mentioned means the dice are changed immediately after they are rolled at any point, and that they are changed before Any further modification. if they are rolled again, they are changed again before further modification. doesn't say this is not the casecase so it is assumed card text prevails. however, other abilities such as marksmanship or mercenary copilot function as normal