Earlier tonight, Wendy Adams was running around with an Elder Sign which - according to her game text - stops her from being Cursed while she has it. The Mythos card (whose name I can't remember) then came up and required the first player to choose one Investigator to be Cursed and one to be Blessed. So the immediate and obvious question is can Wendy Adams be chosen to be Cursed and just have the curse "bounce off" her, or some such. Or do you actually have to choose an Investigator who is physically capable of being Cursed?

I'm pretty sure the elder sign makes her an illegal target. Hehe reminds of MTG

It's a tricky one. I'm not so sure that it wouldn't work.

'Cannot be Cursed' is an ability which was presumably written on the assumption that the act of being 'Cursed' is caused by an encounter card effect that is targeted at the investigator having the encounter. The problem is that most AH cards don't distinguish between 'costs' and 'effects' very carefully. For example, what if Wendy got one of those encounters where you have the option of doing something (gaining an item or whatever) but if you do so, you are Cursed. Could Wendy take the item and just be 'immune' to the intended price?

Really it's a bit of a 'glitch' and we probably need a ruling on it from Kevin Wilson or H.P. Lovecraft or one of those fellers.

thecorinthian said:

For what it's worth, I'd say she can totally do that type of encounter.

If she takes the item, then she's cursed. You worry about the if first; the "then" later.

On the other hand, if you had to choose a character to be cursed, I don't think she counts, because she can't be cursed. But you could choose a character who was already cursed because that character can be cursed; s/he would discard his/her current curse and draw a new one (which means one more round without rolling to discard it).

Just my thoughts, anyway. A concise ruling would be peachy though.

Reminds me of a game vs Yig, where Sister Mary kept her Blessing the entire game AND got Father Iwanacki Ally as well. Being in final combat against Yig, Blessed, packing 2 .45s on a Nun, kick-ass !

While we're at it:

Does "can not be cursed" mean, that she can't gain a "cursed"-card, or does it make her immune to the process?
I.e., if Weny is blessed and an encounter tells her she "gets cursed", normally an investigator would have to discard his bless. What about Wendy (or any investigator with the "third eye")?

Does her elder sign save her blessing (for the "get cursed" encounter is blocked) or does she loose her bless, since the elder sign only protects her from "cursed"-cards, and as she loses her bless, she wouldn't gain a "cursed"-card anyway?

I'd say "cannot be cursed" means that "cannot have your blessed/normal/cursed status reduced below normal", so you could still lose blessings. I would allow encounters that have being cursed as a cost (in the same way that "lose 1 sanity" cost encounters can still be taken by Harvey Walters) but I think using the curse 1 and bless 1 card would be unfair (unless you only have two investigators, in which case blessing the one that isn't Wendy would be fine).

Being cursed is being cursed, no matter if you have a blessing already or not. It's like each investigator is on a ladder:

Blessed
Normal
Cursed

If an investigator has a curse inflicted on him, he just steps down the ladder by one rung (whether it's blessed to normal, or normal to cursed). If you can't be cursed, you can't step down the ladder. So a blessed Wendy with an Elder Sign can't lose her blessing by being cursed. But she can lose it by a bad upkeep roll.

kroen said:

ick, i couldn't disagree more. First, I'd say that weny w/ Elder Sign / anyone with 3rd Eye; *can* be "un-blessed" via cursing. You weren't cursed you were merely forced to discard the blessing you do not obtain the cursed status, so no immunity for you.

otoh, I also think that such characters are viable targets for that mythos card, and can effectively take the encounters where you would be cursed in exchange for something freely. That's one of the advantages your special immune status conveys to you.

awp832 said:

I agree.

The problem is, that the card text is ambiguous.

"Immun to being cursed " can either mean that you're immun to card text that tell you "you are cursed" or immun to having the card "cursed".

Using Tib's ladder,

Blessed
Normal
Cursed

it's not clear of immunity to being cursed prevents you from moving down the ladder or from hitting the bottom...

A very concise statement of the problem, Vitus.

Are there actually any official cards that make you immune to a curse, but which you could theoretically get while already cursed? If so, and we take the interpretation that you're immune to having a 'cursed' card, does that mean you discard the curse you've already got, or just that it does nothing while you've got it?

The 'ladder' idea isn't all that useful, because you're still using ambiguous terms. For example:

BLESSED - Moving 'up' from here is impossible. Moving down is called 'discarding your blessing' OR 'being cursed '.

NORMAL - Moving up from here is called 'being blessed ' OR 'gaining a blessing'. Moving down is called 'gaining a curse' OR 'being cursed '.

CURSED - Moving up from here is called 'being blessed ' OR 'discarding your curse'. Moving down is impossible.

Obviously several things there appear twice. Most of the time that doesn't matter, but it does if you gain curse-immunity (or bless-immunity, I suppose) while you're already in that state .

So in summary, I...have no idea.

thecorinthian said:

The 3rd Eye card states:

" You may not be Cursed. (If you are already Cursed, this card does not change that.)"

I'm still not sure if this is an argument for the "falling down"- or the "bottom of the ladder" theory....

I'd rule it that if you are cursed and you can't and you have a blessing you don't lose it.

"Be cursed" doesn't mean "become the status of cursed," it means "receive a curse card." If you receive a curse card when you're blessed, they cancel out and both are discarded. If Wendy is blessed and she has an elder sign, and some encounter or something says she is cursed, then she does not lose her blessing (nothing happens).

In other words, any effect that would attempt to curse Wendy instead becomes "nothing."

"Lose 1 sanity and you are cursed" becomes "Lose 1 sanity" against Wendy in this case. The fact that she could already be blessed or cursed doesn't change that.

I think Tibs has it right: being cursed means to "receive a curse card." If an investigator cannot take a curse card for some reason, then nothing changes as far as that investigator's cursed/blessed status. From a thematic sense, this may not be very satisfying, but mechanically it's easy to manage and resolve (which is good). I also believe that when an investigator is told to choose someone to be cursed, that curse cannot be delivered to an investigator who is blocked from receiving a curse card, so someone else (if possible) must be chosen.

Makes sense to me to have the person who can't be cursed cursed ie nothing happens then bless someone else but it's all up to the first player to decide the order of events.

mmk, you have convinced me about the whole blessed characters who become 'cursed' get to stay blessed. I still think 3rd eye people/ wendy are viable targets for that mythos card (and encounters which curse you for a reward) though.

First lets remind everyone of the Guideline set down by Kevin Wilson: "If something can't be done, it is not an option." (the example in the "Official Answers from Kevin" Thread is trying to shop while having $0)

By following that guideline, this is how I play it:

1. If someone is Blessed and can't be Cursed, and receives a Curse result, they lose their Blessing as per the rules because they don't actually gain a Curse.
2. If someone is neither Blessed or Cursed and can't be Cursed, and receives a Curse result as part of an Encounter/Ancient One Ability/Etc., they do not receive the Curse Card.
3. If a card is drawn that says "Curse an Investigator," all Investigators that can't be Cursed and are not Blessed are not allowed to be targeted by the card effect.

If I remember correctly, the rules say that if someone is Blessed and is supposed to be Cursed they just discard the Blessing instead of receiving a Cursed card, and vice versa.

Looks like under that interpretation it doesn't really matter if you can't be cursed...of course you never actually receive the curse!

I don't think a blessed person who can't be cursed will loss their blessing if they where suppose to be cursed, because they where not actually cursed...

Plus encouters that have you become cursed for a positive would still work I think...

I sort of confussed myself now lol so just let the first player decide is my vote.

You can't shop with zero dollars there for you still loss your blessing when you can't be cursed?

dkw, that seems a little silly to me. So if I have 3rd eye and a blessing, I can be selected as a target for that card, but not if I have 3rd eye and no blessing? That just seems wrong, since it's not the *blessing* that has the special effect at all. I don't see why that should matter.

Incidentally, at least in AH, DH, BGoTW and KiY, there aren ' t any unique items that cost $1 or less. Does that mean you have to have at least $2 to shop at the curiositie shop? That also seems stupid and arbitrary.

To shop you need to have at least $1, official rule. Same applies to anything that requires you to spend Trophies or any other card.

The game rules state that when Blessed, if you get a Curse result, you discard the Blessing instead, and vice versa. You aren't actually Cursed, instead some force interferes with and negates whatever force was Blessing you. The same goes with being Cursed and becoming Blessed.

Wait, WHAT? You're Blessed, and you cannot be Cursed. Something tries to Curse you, and you LOSE your Blessing??? So I've got TWO things that block a Curse: why the heck should I be forced to pick BOTH of them???

Yikes. I prefer the Monster Limit-Outskirts approach: you place a monster on the Location it's supposed to go, but the Monster Limit is reached, so you move it to the Outskirts. You can choose any Investigator to get a Curse card, so they take the Curse card and look at their status. If they see any reason not to keep it, Curse discarded.

But I got no proof. It is to be a FAQ question then.

I think I'm more confused now than I was when the thread started.