So me and a X-wing Buddy of mine got into a discussion about the YT-1300 last night.

We were playing a 200 point game because we haven't done one in a while and wanted to give ourselves chances to use ships we would normally not use in a 100 point match.

As much as I wanted to I could not find myself spending the points to run a YT, even at 200 points. Chewy with no upgrades is 42 and its a 3/1 with 13 hit points. I rather run a Bounty hunter with HLC for 40 points and have a 4/2 with 10 hit points. My friend ended up running 3 Firesprays all with HLC with 4 random ties and pretty much smokes me. He still had 4 ships left on the board.

I rather run 2 X-wings which gives me 6 attack dice, 4 evade dice, 10 damage between the 2 over running a YT.

No matter how you look at it. 4 attack going against 1 evade is not going to be pretty. Even when you can take 13 hit points. But have a bunch of ties going against Falcon is probably fine.

Ive always felt that the firesprays were overpowered and the YTs were underpowered. And the group of people I play with pretty much all agree. So we were thinking of reworking the YT for our friendly games so we can start using it more. Because come on, who doesn't want to be rocking the Falcon more often!

So a few ideas we were thinking of trying.

Option 1

Give it 2 evades. So its the same stats as the Firespray, but still costs more. With 2 evades its worth spending 50 points on. Plus the Firesprays still get the advantage of using the HLC.

Option 2

Give it 2 evades but then drop hull/shields to 6/4 like the firespray. Thinking of running it this way because will the YT be too strong with 2 evades and 13 hit points? Even though its the most expensive ship out there?

Option 3

Keep all of the stats the same, But drop the price on it. Make the Outer Rim smuggler have the same stats are the other YTs. Chewy 35, Lando, 37, Han 40, Those extra 6-7 points could go a long way in either using them on upgrade or working in an extra ship.

Thoughts on any of this? Anyone try something like this and how did it work?

I don't think I've ever seen someone claim they were UNDERpowered before… And I can't really agree with you. You're just not tricking it out right. Yes, it may eat a 3rd of your points in one ship or more, but they can be devastating. Put Luke Skywalker on one and between that and target locks or focus tokens you're pretty much guaranteed to land a good hit every turn. Especially coupled with a capable X-wing wingman like Garven, who could theoretically increase it's attack potential further or give it some chance to evade (depending on your YT's pilot skill). Additionally, with it's high Hull it would normally be susceptible to critical hits (I've had 3 piled on against my friend's Lando in one game). Chewbacca sees nicely to that problem though, and he's actually less points than Lando or Han. Not to mention taking the (cheap) MF title gives you an evade action. Pair that with Garven's focus tokens and that gives you a good chance to negate at least 2 damage from one attack and keep flying. Not to mention you can pretty much fly anywhere and not care where you land unless it's off the map.

And while it indeed occurred to me that you might be a troll, i like to think the denizens of this forum are above such behaviors.

Have you run HSF list? 2 Rookie X-wings with Han (or Chewie or Lando) with some upgrades? 100 point list. It's an extremely reliable and potent list that's not easy to beat.

The YT can fly like an A-wing, shoot better than any other ship, built in turret (HUGE), and has some excellent pilots…I just can't...

Have you ever run one?

its 360 firing arc its amazing and thats why its worth the pts imo.

i was disappointed the smuggler had reduced attack. a tank with no guns? no other big base ship has a reduced stat-line (other than upgrade icons). Why did they nueter it to 2 attack dice?

i dont have a real issue with the other falcon pilots - theyr all decent.

i was disappointed the smuggler had reduced attack. a tank with no guns? no other big base ship has a reduced stat-line (other than upgrade icons). Why did they nueter it to 2 attack dice?

Interesting. I'm always disappointed that the upgraded stats weren't attached to the MF title card.

The Millennium Falcon is a souped-up, customized platform, superior to the stock YT. (More than just adding an evade, in my opinion.) But the way they have it set up, Lando and/or Chewy could ALSO be flying (essentially) the same ship simultaneously. (As points allow, of course.)

That just... bugs me.

If anything I here people talk about how the YT is TOO good. It literally has everything going for it. It's large base and low defense are the only liabilities I can think of. And it has so much hull and shields the low agility doesn't really matter too much. The points you spend on it it are WELL worth it. I'm really confused why you think otherwise.

The value of everything in this game is affected by the point totals you choose to play with. At 200 points, I can kind of see why someone might say the YT-1300 isn't worth the points, just as some ships become more or less valuable when you play a 60 points, or 75 points.

But generally, that 360 degree fire arc combined with its endurance is worth what you pay for it.

When i first started playing this game I was almost always running the YT. Usually the YT with 2 x-wings and just didn't have too much luck with it. I seem to always do better not doing the YT and running 4 ships. Yeah it hits hard but it only fires once.

The times that ive done the best with it was when I was putting on Push the limit, nien numb and MF which on Chewy makes it 47. And I normally like doing alteast gunner which pushes it to 52. Would push the limit and give me a evade everytime which for sure helped. But then i just can't get around paying that much for a ship.

And for whatever reason I feel like they just go down so fast.

The reason I say its underpowered is I try to compare it with the Firespray. And I usually find that the Firespray is way better and cheaper.

Like I said in the first post.

42 for chewy by itself. 3/1 with 13 hit points

or I can do bounty with HLC - 40 points 4/2 with 10 hit points.

Put those 2 up against each and Im putting my money on the firespray every time.

and @That One Guy why would you think im a troll?

When i first started playing this game I was almost always running the TY. Usually the TY with 2 x-wings and just didn't have too much luck with it. I seem to always do better not doing the TY and running 4 ships. Yeah it hits hard but it only fires once.

The times that ive done the best with it was when I was putting on Push the limit, nien numb and MF which on Chewy makes it 47. And I normally like doing alteast gunner which pushes it to 52. Would push the limit and give me a evade everytime which for sure helped. But then i just can't get around paying that much for a ship.

And for whatever reason I feel like they just go down so fast.

The reason I say its underpowered is I try to compare it with the Firespray. And I usually find that the Firespray is way better and cheaper.

Like I said in the first post.

42 for chewy by itself. 3/1 with 13 hit points

or I can do bounty with HLC - 40 points 4/2 with 10 hit points.

Put those 2 up against each and Im putting my money on the firespray every time.

You aren't taking everything into account here.

Chewbacca is 42 points for a 3/1 with 13 HP that treats all crits as regular hits with a 360* firing arc as a Level 5 pilot.

Bounty Hunter with an HLC is 40 points for a 4/2 with 10 hp with a 90* firing arc, with an additional firing arc of 90* as a 3/2, as a Level 3 pilot.

The question is whether the extra 1 evasion die and the occasional extra Attack Die on the Firespray will be enough to counteract Chewbacca's extra HP, Crit resistance, and the times that Chewbacca can shoot from out of either Firespray arc.

Also when flying the YT you don't have to worry about getting ships in arc. All you have to worry about is maneuvering around asteroids. And the YT has an incredible dial for a large base so that isn't too much of a problem either with some experience. I'd say that's definitively worth paying extra points for. The Firespray still has to line up shots.

At the same time I am not too fond of dual Falcon lists. Dual Firespray lists however I do like. Both ships have their advantages and disadvantages. And their points reflect that. I would never agree though that the YT needs a buff or improvement.

i was disappointed the smuggler had reduced attack. a tank with no guns? no other big base ship has a reduced stat-line (other than upgrade icons). Why did they nueter it to 2 attack dice?

Interesting. I'm always disappointed that the upgraded stats weren't attached to the MF title card.

The Millennium Falcon is a souped-up, customized platform, superior to the stock YT. (More than just adding an evade, in my opinion.) But the way they have it set up, Lando and/or Chewy could ALSO be flying (essentially) the same ship simultaneously. (As points allow, of course.)

That just... bugs me.

Don't think of the stats as specifically reflecting the Falcon's upgrades, but as representing a YT-1300 with military-grade equipment, so that it can be used as a gunboat instead of a freighter. I.e. a stock YT-1300's turrets are only single laser cannons, not quads.

Oh, I see the problem. Chewie's special ability is nearly worthless when facing a HLC that doesn't normally cause criticals. Maybe this is the problem. end-sarcasm

I'll admit most of us aren't too impressed by the ORS but is the basic BH really what you want to compare to Chewbacca? Ok, maybe the BH w/ HLC can land a few more hits on Chewie but then Chewie is beside the BH still firing or maybe behind the BH firing where the BH is only responding in kind. After a few hits the BH's shields are gone and a crit or two land on it, one of which could completely mess with it and perhaps cost it that HLC.

Anyone want to try a "level" playing field?

Chewbacca + Falcon title vs. BH + HLC + Hull Upgrade

Both get the same action bar. Chewie is 8/5 vs. BH 7/4 when it comes to hull/shield. PS 5 vs PS 3. Agility 1 vs 2. 360 degree primary attack vs. HLC + front/rear arc.

Now Chewie has the advantage in hull, shield, pilot skill, and attack positioning. The BH gets an edge in agility and a slight edge in attack PROVIDED Chewie stays in the front arc at range 2-3. I guess I'm an idiot because I can't see where the BH is so superior there except because Chewie is paying points for an ability that the HLC really doesn't care about.

The YT1300 is by no means overcosted, and is actually quite competitive. In a 200 point game it might be less optimal, because it can get focus fired down quickly, and its 360 arc isn't as big of a deal since there are so many ships to shoot at anyway.

I believe that three of the top 16-20 squads at Worlds had a named YT-1300, and one squad had two Outer Rim Smugglers.

The wave 3 version of Han Shoots First is slightly better than the variants that made it at Worlds:

Han Solo + Push the Limit + Recon Specialist + Gunner + Millennium Falcon (58)

Rookie x2 (42)

I'm guessing the Original Poster will need this explained.

The wave 3 version of Han Shoots First is slightly better than the variants that made it at Worlds:

Han Solo + Push the Limit + Recon Specialist + Gunner + Millennium Falcon (58)

Rookie x2 (42)

Han Shoots First lists are one of the iconic builds of this game, right up there with Tie Fighter Swarms. It builds primarily off of the interaction of Han Solo's pilot ability and the Gunner crew-member card, though it is still a heavy hitter when using Lando or Chewbacca as the pilot.

With this particular flavour, your turn looks like this, mechanically.

Rookies move

1. Rookies do actions
2. Han does a Green Maneuver
3. Han receives a Stress Token (from Push the Limit) to do 2 actions. They are Focus and Evade (from Millennium Falcon)
4. This left him with a Stress Token, 2 Focus Tokens (Recon Spec!) and an Evade token.

Combat (assuming Range 2-3)

1. Han shoots at something
2. If spending a focus would result in 3 hits, spend it and proceed to Step 6
3. If you have 2 Hit or Crit results showing, proceed to Step 6
4. If you have 1 or fewer Hit or Crit results showing, activate Han Solo's ability.
5. Then, if spending a focus would result in 2 or more hits, spend it.
6. Defender rolls
7. If Gunner has not yet triggered, and the Defender takes no Damage, repeat steps 1-5
8. Han spends remaining Focus and Evade Tokens to bolster defense when not attacking
9. Rookie pilots attack, cleaning up any ship wounded by Han

Long story short, regardless of the evade dice of the enemy ship, you are practically guaranteed to deal damage every turn, and often in massive amounts.

The 360* Arc means that if you can shoot at Han, he can shoot at you first, potentially before you get your shots off (thus the name of the build.) Your best hope is to simply overwhelm him with numbers, and take down the MASSIVE amounts of HP before he takes down yours.

i was disappointed the smuggler had reduced attack. a tank with no guns? no other big base ship has a reduced stat-line (other than upgrade icons). Why did they nueter it to 2 attack dice?

Interesting. I'm always disappointed that the upgraded stats weren't attached to the MF title card.

The Millennium Falcon is a souped-up, customized platform, superior to the stock YT. (More than just adding an evade, in my opinion.) But the way they have it set up, Lando and/or Chewy could ALSO be flying (essentially) the same ship simultaneously. (As points allow, of course.)

That just... bugs me.

Dear god do I wish the title accounted for the extra stats. I have two falcons, but it anyone tries to put any mix of Han, Chewie, and lando on the table at the same time. I promptly let that individual know that our friendship is over and we can no longer be in the same room.

i played against a version of Chewies 'Epic Chewie' list the other day. the standard build uses 2 B-Wings but he was using a rookie pilot with R2D2. i cut down his support ships as fast as i could and then sent all my ships to attack chewie. it worked and i had chewie on 4 hull after losing just a single Academy PIlot b4 he conceded the game by flying off his end of the board.

Why are half of you guys saying the TY1300? It's the YT-1300.

Why are half of you guys saying the TY1300? It's the YT-1300.

DylexiaSWgeeksightedness?

The YT is fine by itself. The named pilots are very well balanced against the firespray. Firespray + HLC would not be my chosen load out but the points work. Against an HLC BH chewie should chew him up. Against other load outs probably more even. But this is a squad based game not 1:1.

Why are half of you guys saying the TY1300? It's the YT-1300.

That "half of you guys" looks to me like one person making the same mistake over and over again. I guess there really could be issues with the TY-1300 as none of us know which ship that is so we are thinking it must be the YT-1300.

Maybe that is one of the reasons someone asked if the OP was trolling. That and the little problem with this being the first time anyone has ever come around saying the named YT-1300s need a big boost to even be playable much less the tournament staple they are.

Why are half of you guys saying the TY1300? It's the YT-1300.

That "half of you guys" looks to me like one person making the same mistake over and over again. I guess there really could be issues with the TY-1300 as none of us know which ship that is so we are thinking it must be the YT-1300.

Maybe that is one of the reasons someone asked if the OP was trolling. That and the little problem with this being the first time anyone has ever come around saying the named YT-1300s need a big boost to even be playable much less the tournament staple they are.

Your right it's just the topic-creator, my bad

I guess the OP probably hasn't had many lucky dice rolls yet. I haven't played very many games but browsing the forums awhile before getting into the game made me wonder about this crazy HSF list that everyone seemed to think was so unfair. I've never heard anything but good things about the YT-1300.

I don't know how this thread has lasted this long. There's nothing wrong with the YT, the end.