I'm curious about the difference between the grades of plastic you can order models in on shapeways website. Not every model is offered in all the different grades, and there is a description of each but some seem kind of the same other than color. Has anyone ordered ships at different qualities that can shed some light on this. Some of the grades are only a couple bucks difference and others are considerably more, is the quality that different? Is there a best bet, price vs quality. I'm not really interested in the grainy feel grades unless it's not that big of a deal or it can be fixed easily.

Well. As one of the people who makes things for shapeways i can say that in many cases it depends on the model.(when marking up a model i keep the same markup on all the materials so i can remain unbiased, price difference is purely due to shapeways material costs). But in general frosted detail is in my opinion the best bet, the detail level is only a little less than frosted ultra detail but it is considerably cheaper and a fair bit sturdier.

Frosted ultra detail is the best for the purposes of detailing and if one can afford it and the miniature has no moving parts is a good choice. But for anything with hinged wings for instance it might be a little too fragile (still waiting for my Starwing to test that, but my Krayt Shuttle actually worked fine, though that may be because it had a bulker hinge system)

For strength and cost White strong and flexible is the best bet, but the detail level isnt nearly as high and the surface has a bit of that fuzzy thing that people dont like. Also if the print orientation isnt right layer lines can be a bit obvious.

I have seen good results in WSF and have had people who swear by it but the results are not assured and personally i dont like keeping it available as an option and am gradually phasing it out.

Capital ships can often come out quite well in WSF. Probably because the detail level doesnt have to be as high as it does for a fighter but for small craft i strongly advise against it. Though of course for this game at least capital ships are a moot point.

Hope that helps

Great Info Gosric..

Well. As one of the people who makes things for shapeways i can say that in many cases it depends on the model.(when marking up a model i keep the same markup on all the materials so i can remain unbiased, price difference is purely due to shapeways material costs). But in general frosted detail is in my opinion the best bet, the detail level is only a little less than frosted ultra detail but it is considerably cheaper and a fair bit sturdier.

Frosted ultra detail is the best for the purposes of detailing and if one can afford it and the miniature has no moving parts is a good choice. But for anything with hinged wings for instance it might be a little too fragile (still waiting for my Starwing to test that, but my Krayt Shuttle actually worked fine, though that may be because it had a bulker hinge system)

For strength and cost White strong and flexible is the best bet, but the detail level isnt nearly as high and the surface has a bit of that fuzzy thing that people dont like. Also if the print orientation isnt right layer lines can be a bit obvious.

I have seen good results in WSF and have had people who swear by it but the results are not assured and personally i dont like keeping it available as an option and am gradually phasing it out.

Capital ships can often come out quite well in WSF. Probably because the detail level doesnt have to be as high as it does for a fighter but for small craft i strongly advise against it. Though of course for this game at least capital ships are a moot point.

Hope that helps

Gosric,

I was looking at buying a couple of your Gunboat models. As you said, you only have them available in WSF. Should I wait til you come out with the FD version to get the best Combo of Quality and Cost or is the WSF Version good enough? Also, will you, like with the Tie Avenger, make them available in a pack of 3 at roughly the same cost?

Thank you!

Thanks that helps a lot. Great info.

I bought Gosrics Hex defender in both ultra detail and black platic detail. The ultra one was perfect both in details and - sofar - strength. The black plastic detail was close to horrific. First of all, it smells really strong, and not very nice. The surface is very grainy and you can clearly see the layers from the printer. Also it broke when I tried to paint it (which did work, but not as well as the ultra detail, because of the grainy surface.

You can clearly see it on the materials pages of shapeways:

https://static1.sw-cdn.net/rrstatic/img/materials/det-blackbunny.jpg

I believe that its less obvious on the other color plastic detail materials, but most likely the problem is still there.

Thank you Sig for the heads up...would you mind when you get a chance posting pictures?

I'll probably wait for his Gunboats to have the FD or FUD support then.

I will post a picture tomorrow of the detailed one, showing the black plastic one isn't really fair, since i held a lighter on the wings, drilled holes in the cockpit and wings and pretty much did everything to make it look like a wreck. Never finished it though and now it just lies in parts. But i just checked, the smell did wear off.

LOL, Yikes! But Hey, it doesn't smell anymore that's gotta make everyone feel good.

Thanks, I look forward to see your pics.

I will post a picture tomorrow of the detailed one, showing the black plastic one isn't really fair, since i held a lighter on the wings, drilled holes in the cockpit and wings and pretty much did everything to make it look like a wreck. Never finished it though and now it just lies in parts. But i just checked, the smell did wear off.

Glue the parts to a lava rock and use it for space debis or an asteroid.. I am gonna shred a model of the falcon to do the same.. lol and it is not a waste of money, but a new and fun peice of space terrain for your games..

It's only a waste if you just throw the Mini's away.

Has anyone gotten the E-Wing in UItra detail? Pics?

I wonder if using some Mr. Surfacer mixed with some leveling thinner would smooth it out. I'd just be afraid that it would take too much detail away.

I've ordered ships in white flexible, black flexible, and frosted detail. I think a lot depends on the artist. The first model I ordered, senator's shuttle, had lots of print lines in white flexible. I ordered some turrets in white flexible and there were no visible print lines at all! I ordered three defenders in black flexible. One fo the panels broke when I dropped the model from my stool onto a carpeted floor. Those also had print lines, but I gently washed the minis with water and a soft brush. Most of the print lines vanished. I can't explain it. I also ordered a tye wing in frosted detail. It is a very nice model.

I also ordered an R2 Astromech ring for the wifey in polished white and flexible. There were no print lines, but the edges were sharp. The plastic is soft enough to sand down.

Have a big order from Gosric coming my way soon. Can't wait for Voidrunner to be my next ORS.

JC - "I was looking at buying a couple of your Gunboat models. As you said, you only have them available in WSF."

I think my ramblings tend to be confusing *L* I have them available already in FD and FUD but am waiting for one in FUD to test the strength of the folding wing hinge.

I will try to get a three pask of it as soon as i can.but the conversion from 3d model to a printable format takes a while on my awful computer with the more detailed models, im still waiting for the three pack of my TIE Defenders to convert. Every time i try to convert them after several hours the computer locks up *L* but i should be gettiong a new comp soon which will help.

Sig. Im sorry to hear about that, i think i have already taken the BSF/WSF option off of those.

An example might help. Here is my TIE in White strong and flexible (just a coat of grey to minimize glare)

Here is the TIE/D in Frosted detail (fully and nicely painted but the point should still be clear. i would have used a regular TIE but i dont make them available since FFG already has them)

If you look at the render here

you can see how the details on the TIE blur or vanish in WSF but the Frosted detail TIE/D doesnt look much different at all from the render

.

For capital ships WSF can work as my Praetor and Relentless show. But that is because of the relatively smooth surfaces and comparative lack of detail and even they would have been better in FD

Im looking forward to the larger ship rules if for no other reason that i would love to build destroyers and corvettes, maybe even cruisers in a large enough scale to go nuts on the detail *L*

I do have a picture of the E Wing in Frosted, i will just have to find it. it is on this forum somewhere actually i think

Gosric,

Thank you so much. I'm definitely buying FD or FUD depending on price for the smaller ships. You're right with the larger ships it appears from your pictures that WSF isn't too bad.

Thank you for going through all the trouble to show us the differences. I hope my investments now and later will get you a kick ass enough computer to render your 3D models Quicker and Without Locking Up!

Thank you. WSF does seem to work well with ISD styled ships.But i would stick with FD for the gunboats just because of the wing joints. unless you do not care if the wings move in which case FUD would be fine

As promised, some photo's of the defender. Now I'm not a really good painter, to be honest this is the first thing I have painted since my childhood, so don't let that take away of the amount of detail on the model.

And Gosric, really no problem at all. The good thing about the black plastic is that it's fairly cheap, and I could use the model to practice painting on. I just took a shot to see how it would turn out, since it was also my first Shapeway order. I absolutely love the detail on the ultra one and am very thankful you have made all those models available. I do a little 3D modelling myself and know it is a lot of work to get it done right.

Actually that looks very very nice. Im proud of how the model came out to be sure but you have done a great job of giving it depth and character without obscuring detail. TIEs, at least to me, shouldnt be overly heavily weathered or anything of that sort.which make them a bit problematical for painting but that looks great. Would you have any aversion to me posting them on BBG or a fewmaneuvers? It is always nice to be able to show what they look like painted

Oh, and here is the E Wing in frosted, Keep in mind that after this one was made i had a file crash and had to remake it almost from scratch and the new one while the same size and shape has much better and more refined detailing.

http://lorelei-shipyards.tumblr.com/post/70522661302/my-e-wing-next-to-the-official-ffg-x-wing-the-new

Wow Sig, that looks amazing! Nice work for the first time in ages...hopefully I can do half as good on my future Tie Avengers

Can't wait to see your updated E-wings Gosric!

I have seen good results in WSF and have had people who swear by it but the results are not assured and personally i dont like keeping it available as an option and am gradually phasing it out.

Gosric,

please do not eliminate a WSF option. Your stuff is awesome and of course, looks better in the "Detail" materials (FD, FUD) but that puts some of the larger models WAY out of some peoples budget for "toys". I have about a hundred Shapeways models (mostly WWI aircraft in 1/144 scale or 1/3900 scale spaceships) and almost all of those are in WSF. If you know how to prepare and paint it, you can get excellent results. It may not work for all your models but in general, that decision should be left to the purchaser (with strong recommendations from you, the designer). Currently looking to pick up more of your designs (in WSF where possible). In the more expensive materials I may only be able to afford one, whereas withWSF I can get three (just an example).

Chris

I suppose you are right. I do strongly suggest the right materials in the descriptions so should leave the option open for those who choose it. But i will probably still eliminate WSF Polished as an option on any of the ships with spindly bits. The 'Why didnt the E Wing guns print in WSF-P" question has gotten old *L*.

My own experience with WSF-Polished has not been good. Yes, the surface is a bit smoother... but... that is because the surface detail has been melted by the polishing wheel. Small details and spindly (and sometimes not so spindly) parts perish under the process. Basically, they just take a Dremmel tool with a polishing wheel to the model, it is no wonder that that sort of thing happens. Better to just learn how to properly seal and prepare your WSF model for painting. The SECRET is Layering... ssssshhhhhh.

Chris

I have seen good results in WSF and have had people who swear by it but the results are not assured and personally i dont like keeping it available as an option and am gradually phasing it out.

Gosric,

please do not eliminate a WSF option. Your stuff is awesome and of course, looks better in the "Detail" materials (FD, FUD) but that puts some of the larger models WAY out of some peoples budget for "toys". I have about a hundred Shapeways models (mostly WWI aircraft in 1/144 scale or 1/3900 scale spaceships) and almost all of those are in WSF. If you know how to prepare and paint it, you can get excellent results. It may not work for all your models but in general, that decision should be left to the purchaser (with strong recommendations from you, the designer). Currently looking to pick up more of your designs (in WSF where possible). In the more expensive materials I may only be able to afford one, whereas withWSF I can get three (just an example).

Chris

Chris, what do you use (method and materials) to smooth them out before you paint?

Chris, what do you use (method and materials) to smooth them out before you paint?

I'm sure this has been discussed on this forum before. Maybe not... maybe on Starship Combat News forums. Anyways...

Getting decent results with WSF is all about prep and layering. Here goes-

1. Wash the model in WARM water, towel it off and let dry completely. *I use warm water because that will help reset any bends the model may have incurred during shipping.

2. Sealer- I have read about several methods and tried most of them. I am not sure which gives the best results as the "layering" steps make up for a lot.

a) Paint model with several layers of undiluted "Future" (or other) acrylic floor polish. *WSF is porus and will absorb the first layer(s) rather quickly; let it dry before moving on.

b) Give it a coat of your favorite "rattle can" primer.

c) Paint it with 1-2 coats of diluted PVA ("Elmers") white glue. * About 1:1 Glue /H2O.

d) 1-2 coats of Clear Gloss spray sealer. * I like Krylon Crystal Clear.

3. Primer (if you have not already done that in step 2)

4. Base Color

5. Wash. * I use the "Magic Wash" method- "Magic Wash" is composed of 1 part Future floor polish to 4 parts water. I usually mix a small bottle for future use. Pour a small amount into a bottle cap (or other small vessel) and mix it with a small drop of whatever color paint/ink you like. Make it as thick or thin as you want. Let it dry completely before moving on.

6. Drybrush with primary color.

7. Paint secondary colors and details.

8. Pin-wash to bring out more detail. Pin-washing is done with the same "magic wash" method but using a fine-point brush and just edging details and recesses, rather than applying it overall.

9. Weathering. * Optional.

10. Touch-up and highlight details.

11. Clear Coat. * Apply one or more coats of clear gloss sealer.

12. Apply decals. * Optional (gloss coat again if you do).

13. Panel Lines- go over them with a very fine point drafting pen to further darken/define them. * Optional

14. Top Coat- I prefer Testors Dullcote or Krylon Clear Matte Finish. * Unless you want a high gloss finish.

15. Glass Canopies, etc... I like to go back over my canopies to give them a bit of a glass-like shine by painting them with a coat of undiluted Future floor polish. * Do this quickly as the polish will start to dry and thicken quickly and that will lead to visible brush strokes.

The fact that I use multiple coats of "Magic Wash" is one reason I am able to get a (relatively) smooth finish as each layer contains the floor polish. The Clear Gloss top coat(s) really finish it off. Dullcote/Matte finish reduces the shine and also makes any remaining "roughness" less obvious. When you are done, you should have a model that is unique, attractive and durable.

Happy painting!

Chris