What level you shoot for with a mob's PS is all determined by the metagame. In some ways it is rock-paper-scissors with the simple idea that a higher PS win until it no longer does and you go pack to as many low PS ships as you can get.

If you face a lot of PS 1/2 ships then you may want to go with PS 4 ships so you can shoot first to and hope to thin the ranks. Of course if PS 4 is common then you may see PS 6 to do the same to the PS 4 who hopefully have discouraged the PS 1/2s from showing up. Of course those PS 6 ships then run into more of those Aces where their normal "advantage" is completely worthless leaving them wishing they had more ships because a 12 point Academy TIE is just as good against Wedge as that 15 point BSP except you paid 20% less for it. This is the dilemma you face when trying to use higher PS ships.

good points. i am noticing a lot more PS4 squads about in this current meta. im also seeing a few (or even one) high PS pilot accompanied by mid PS and low PS pilots (Dagger Squadron, Blue Squadron Pilots would be the main repeat offenders but Black Squadron Pilots are popping up in my local playgroup as well).

I can see HWK-290 name pilots getting more play in the future as their pilot abilities are very good - these guys are just looking for a home to settle in (For rebels im really liking Kyle Katarn especially).

If your PS 6 TIEs are shooting the enemy's PS 6 pilots (and there are a lot of those) instead of just getting blown up before they can act I'll say your investment is paying off. I mean we see the Ace + 3 "mooks" and this high PS squad may not get a shot at the ace but it does get to shoot at the mooks before they can shoot at it. We also may see some mid-level builds that try utilizing unique pilot functions but do not have the PS that others do. We could note that the 8,6,6,6,6,6 only shoots behind 8 of the 26 possible Rebel Pilots (granted VI could push three more above them) and 11-14 of 36 Imperial ships.

I've been running:

Howl with Stealth and PTL
Backstabber
4X Black with VI

It's pretty killer against most squads, especially B-wings.

After my last post I got thinking a little more. The chances of seeing a squad that will fire most of its weapons before you do at PS 6 is low. By that I simply mean it is nearly impossible for you to face FOUR ships that are over PS 6 and just one or two is far more likely. The thing is that if you're facing a squad full of high PS ships there aren't going to be many of them giving you the numbers advantage anyway which is what they HATE to begin with. They may like you better than the seven ship swarms but you're still a swarm that they can't eliminate that quickly.

We didn't have howlrunner for awhile so I ran a lot of 6 named tie swarms. High but not too high pS is very nice as you are not spending sooo many points on PS.

PS is the one stat in the game that kinda has diminishing returns. The jump from 1-3 feels big but from 3 to 5 is much bigger. 5 to is less important except when it is vital. 6-7 is the same. And above 7 is pretty trivial until its not. And hen Roark shows up and a PS 2 Bwing with TL and Focus at range 1 blows Vader up before be gets to shoot. Vader's points toward PS are suddenly wasted (and I expect Roark with auto blaster and recon to start popping up all over).

I've been running:

Howl with Stealth and PTL

Backstabber

4X Black with VI

It's pretty killer against most squads, especially B-wings.

awesome. what do u find u use most with PTL? depends on situation right? evade+focus or evade+barrel roll

shedding stress hasnt been an issue? i guess if u barrel roll away (as ur extra action) you will be out of the furnace for a turn or two allowing you to recover stress eh?

imo having as many ships as possible at 6PS exactly will make this squad easier to pilot with less timing issues for movement but also more movement options with ships crossing vectors and avoiding overlaps with ur own ships more easily or even blocking a high PS pilot enemy with multiple 6PS ships of ur own.

Usually evade and focus, but sometimes you need to flip a crit card or barrel roll. And since howl is targeted early, you usually won't worry about her positioning after turn 4 anyway, so stress isn't much of an issue.

But even after she's gone, the rest of the squad is still shooting first, so its still brutal. Getting blocked I don't worry too much about,or higher PS. It all works itsef out. You just have to fly it well, and I've taken a few pointers from Dom and Sozin about alternate takes on swarm flying. Keep in mind, range. 1 is a circle (well, amost), so there is a big area you can be in and still be range 1 of howl.

Think I'd rather go with all the named pilots. Sure 2 would only be PS5 but you'd have to be fairly unlucky for that to matter, and then you get an ability (I particularly like Nightbeast's double action potential). Put SD on howl and its a nice round 100.

If you want to flank with Backstabber, try giving him engine upgrade.

If he boosts down one side away from your tight formation, your opponent will have to decide what to do about him. If they ignore him then his engine upgrade will really help him close in and flank. If they send some ships off to kill him then you win, since your formation will only have to face part of his force at a time.

There is a youtube video that talks about using Vader as a flanker. It is really interesting.

backstabber + engine = 20pts and a PS 6 interceptor with a worse dial... not bad but kinda rough on points.

Starting horizontal with your initial force and then turning 1 round 1 while he just blasts down the side 3-5 has the same result but costs less. Also, If they do turn on him you don't want to not have an evade token...otherwise you really just wasted 20pts.

If you want to flank with Backstabber, try giving him engine upgrade.

If he boosts down one side away from your tight formation, your opponent will have to decide what to do about him. If they ignore him then his engine upgrade will really help him close in and flank. If they send some ships off to kill him then you win, since your formation will only have to face part of his force at a time.

There is a youtube video that talks about using Vader as a flanker. It is really interesting.

hmm, i was thinking about PTL and engine upgrade on howlrunner - its just a lot of points to invest in a ship that is already a HUGE target. the theory here is you could potentially barel and boost into and out of arcs much like vader does. i think it would work well against rebels although B-Wings would cause u problems with their K-Turning barrel roll tricks.

Usually evade and focus, but sometimes you need to flip a crit card or barrel roll. And since howl is targeted early, you usually won't worry about her positioning after turn 4 anyway, so stress isn't much of an issue.

But even after she's gone, the rest of the squad is still shooting first, so its still brutal. Getting blocked I don't worry too much about,or higher PS. It all works itsef out. You just have to fly it well, and I've taken a few pointers from Dom and Sozin about alternate takes on swarm flying. Keep in mind, range. 1 is a circle (well, amost), so there is a big area you can be in and still be range 1 of howl.

Thanks Hothie - appreciate the insights. I recently got smashed by a swarm that started spreadout at the start but then converged in a ring of death with howlrunner placed near the centre and all of the ties getting howls rerolls

I find the trick with any list is time in the saddle and getting familiar with how it plays. One of the best things about X-Wing as a game is that u can customize squads to your play style. We are starting up a an x-wing league at my LGS in a few months and id really like to give a veteran swarm a try, to me its more interesting than playing a load of academies with howlrunner - i know when i am the rebel player facing down multiple 6PS ties is scary.

@The Brown Bomber

The problem with PTL and Engine upgrade on Howelrunner is that you don't want her to be a flanker, you want her in the center (and a little behind) your main formation.

@Rakky Wistol

Yeah, Backstabber is not the best flanker in the game, that honor goes to either Fell+PTL or Vader+Engine Upgrade. But if you weer going for a themed list of only TIEs then I think you might be willing to forgive a little less optimization.

I think he is one of the best flankers in the game... I just don't think 4 more points on him for engine upgrade is the way to go.

_{I RECENTLY RAN WITH ALL 6 UNIQUE TIE PILOTS AND ONLY LOST 2 SHIPS}

_{NO UPGRADES, JUST RAN THEM PLAN}

_{I RECENTLY RAN WITH ALL 6 UNIQUE TIE PILOTS AND ONLY LOST 2 SHIPS}

_{NO UPGRADES, JUST RAN THEM PLAN}

Forgive me, but could you please not shout? Thank you.

Congrats on your victory. I ran against that list with my shuttles. Came down to the last couple die rolls. Had I rolled better I would have won, but it was a fun game regardless.