All I want out of a starting ship (in a group of 5 players) are both dorsal and ventral, man-served gun turrets. So at least two players can be shooting things at all times.
This is purely due to maximum fun and participation in space combat, rather than any sort of mechanical reason.
Edited by CrunchyDemon
Idk, your suggestion would almost make me think "what's the point, the GM clearly doesn't want us to have this ship."
I hope that's not the case, to be sure. I think coming across an old derelict ship that can eventually be better than a YT has some real adventure potential. However, simply handing the players a fully-functional ship that is 80,000 credits more than the recommended top starting vessel is also a bit too generous. I would do this by showing the players what the ship currently is and what it looks like fully repaired and functional. As such, they'd be willing to try to work with a damaged ship, because the reward for fixing it is rather decent.
I think part of that depends how often the players might get spendable credits as job rewards, versus other benefits (Obligation reduction, contacts, gear that isn't readily fungible, etc)
Good thoughts.
I will take most of these onboard but I will leave hull threshold at full value, just with the ship starting at 30 damage (another 15,000 credits made up for!). And instead of -2 to handling, I will introduce 2 (maybe 3) set-back dice to any task using the ship that can be gradually repaired with time and money (and most likely story rewards as well). Oh, the primary hyperdrive will be offline as well and ship supplies will be short (adventure hook time!).
I know my group will relish the challenge as we did a similar thing in a Rogue Trader campaign with the party rediscovering a wrecked Chalice class BC, although admittedly the scale of that was a bit larger... 
edit: I failed my computer roll to include a quote. I was referring to Agatheron's suggestions in post no 22 above.
Edited by HygricThere's nothing wrong with the YT-1300. Heck it even has it's own Haynes Repair Manual. I'm surprised no has asked for the mini fighter rules or the shuttle specs.
The problem I have with the YT-1300 isn't mechanical, but rather that it gets overused in far too many groups. Too many "Han Solo wannabe knockoffs" for my liking.
Also, I frown very heavily upon "badgering" a GM; they're the ones running the game, and once they've made their call, that's it. To constantly second-guess them or hound them to change their minds on a decision is both incredibly rude and disrespectful to the person that's agreed to spend a chunk of their free time coming up with and then running a campaign for you.
The problem I have with the YT-1300 isn't mechanical, but rather that it gets overused in far too many groups.There's nothing wrong with the YT-1300. Heck it even has it's own Haynes Repair Manual. I'm surprised no has asked for the mini fighter rules or the shuttle specs.
How could that ever be a problem in YOUR game though?
The problem I have with the YT-1300 isn't mechanical, but rather that it gets overused in far too many groups.There's nothing wrong with the YT-1300. Heck it even has it's own Haynes Repair Manual. I'm surprised no has asked for the mini fighter rules or the shuttle specs.
How could that ever be a problem in YOUR game though?
In any games I run, it's not because I make frequent use of other ships, including the ones that I did unofficial stats for, be it this system or early Saga Edition.
Frankly, it just irritates the hell out of me that with so many options for ships out there, far too many players and GM's simply pick the YT-1300 because that's what the model name the EU gave to the Millennium Falcon, and in turn has lead to far too many Han Solo wannabes. It's a personal grudge, one built upon nearly two decades of playing Star Wars RPGs, and nothing anyone says is going to change that fact, so probably best to simply let the subject drop rather than derail the thread any further.
Sure, I keep forgetting some of us have the luxury of being in multiple games and having many people to play these games with!
In that aspect I am not one of us...
Edited by DanteRotterdamMy group uses a YT-1930, personally gifted toone of the PCs by a crime lord. I was hoping to have a story after they ditch him involving the PC he gave it to, but as of now the player's position in the groupis iffy (still hasn't showed up, even though he promised he would, and has had this issue for a while).
To fix this, I plan to have a soon-to-come adventure destroy their beloved ship, and require them to degrade to a new brand, either a custom ship (CF-2400, a 'C'ombat 'F'reighter by Gargogan Industries [also made up]), or something from Enter the Unknown. I'm curious as to how my players will react to seeing their beloved Nebula Chance get bombed and having to ditch it on a trash planet. I plan to let the new ship allow them to have more positions to play space combat in, since previous dogfights left the players out of the cockpit and gunnery deck getting bored, and I want to use apace combat more.
I too plan on giving my players the chance to acquire a new starship.
We've only just begun The Long Arm of the Hutt and the crew is about to set down in Nabat. I intend for B'ura B'an to have his men repair and refitt the Krayt Fang but then go on to urge the crew to consider getting a new ship, or a whole new identity for the Krayt Fang. At least if they ever want to get near a semi-civilized system again.
Of course a ship's operating license, a captain's accredited license, an arms loud-out permit all verifiable through the ship's transponder and secure datapad issued by BoSS, isn't going to be cheap. Luckily their good friend B'ura is there for them for the low low price of 5 - 15 Obligation. It'll be paid off in no time - just a few risk free Ryll runs....
I'll just hand the books to the players and let them shop around for a suitable ship, unless they want to keep the Fang. I assume there's a thriving second-hand market (Craigslist?) for old tramps.
In any games I run, it's not because I make frequent use of other ships, including the ones that I did unofficial stats for, be it this system or early Saga Edition.
Frankly, it just irritates the hell out of me that with so many options for ships out there, far too many players and GM's simply pick the YT-1300 because that's what the model name the EU gave to the Millennium Falcon, and in turn has lead to far too many Han Solo wannabes. It's a personal grudge, one built upon nearly two decades of playing Star Wars RPGs, and nothing anyone says is going to change that fact, so probably best to simply let the subject drop rather than derail the thread any further.
You've hit on an important issue for all groups. It's a question of what style of play is desired, and I guess, adherence to the original story elements which admittedly is pretty key to a game based on Star Wars. (I'm not a Star Wars fan boy, I just like the movies.)
Your view is also pretty clearly the source of many issues other groups are talking about, like, how come I can't put a star fighter in my freighter?
Maybe 'badger' isn't a good choice of word. Perhaps you could talk your group into a different ship. (Make it an adventure and order a custom ship, or steal one.)
My group uses a YT-1930, personally gifted toone of the PCs by a crime lord. I was hoping to have a story after they ditch him involving the PC he gave it to, but as of now the player's position in the groupis iffy (still hasn't showed up, even though he promised he would, and has had this issue for a while).
To fix this, I plan to have a soon-to-come adventure destroy their beloved ship, and require them to degrade to a new brand, either a custom ship (CF-2400, a 'C'ombat 'F'reighter by Gargogan Industries [also made up]), or something from Enter the Unknown. I'm curious as to how my players will react to seeing their beloved Nebula Chance get bombed and having to ditch it on a trash planet. I plan to let the new ship allow them to have more positions to play space combat in, since previous dogfights left the players out of the cockpit and gunnery deck getting bored, and I want to use apace combat more.
Right! I've planned it out more. Sorry for quoting myself.
My plan was to have the very guy that lent them the ship come in and say, "Considering I gave this ship to one of you, then you ran away, and now you work for me again, I want it back." Being as they are under his control with him being their boss and leaving him meaning death not only to them but also for their entire affiliation, they will be obligated to hand it over. However, since he's a 'good' crime lord, he'll look out for them by telling them that he's recently won a heavily modified luxury GHTROC from an associate in a high stakes gambling game, and he'll let them buy it from him if they want. Out of kindness, he'll give them a ticket to the ship for it's last flight, ending at the crime lord's planet, so they can see what it is in schematics, first.
Of course, it just wouldn't be an adventure without a treacherous crew mixed with pirates, rebellious droids, and a noble's rabid pet 'cat' on the loose, which I will be using to spice things up.
Upon arriving, after hearing about the events the crime lord shall be (somewhat) grateful for them saving his ship, and will lower the price, as well as offer to let the PCs use another ship for a while until they can build the funds to purchase it.
The problem I have with the YT-1300 isn't mechanical, but rather that it gets overused in far too many groups. Too many "Han Solo wannabe knockoffs" for my liking.
I went 1300 not because my character is a Han Solo knockoff (In fact she barely knows which way of a a gun to point at the enemy), but because I love the hell out of the ship make. Star Destroyers, TIE fighters, X-Wings and the Falcon are the iconic ships from the series for me. When I think Star Wars, I'm thinking one of those, hands down. So the idea of running around in a non-off kilter version, one that's in great shape, doesn't break down, isn't slap-dashed together and is kind of sexy tickled me.
Actually, thinking about it - in the 20 or so years (and seven campaigns) I've ever been in, we've only ever had a 1300 be the primary ship twice.
I just started session 0 of "Beyond the Rim" an introductory session for my PCs to learn the major players of the campaign.
For this adventure, I am giving my players a Loronar E-9 Explorer-class vessel from Enter the Unknown and described it as a pristine, top-of-the-line exploration ship. Medically white interior with plenty of lens flares going on. I think they really loved the ship, especially when they realized the engineering access bonus feature.
We started with a Wayfarer from the CRB, unfortunately none of us read the piloting rules to learn that you really can't do much of anything in the way of maneuvers with a silhouette 5 ship.
All I want out of a starting ship (in a group of 5 players) are both dorsal and ventral, man-served gun turrets. So at least two players can be shooting things at all times.
This is purely due to maximum fun and participation in space combat, rather than any sort of mechanical reason.
Any other potential issues I should tell my crew to keep a weathered eye out for?
Edited by bladerunner_35At some point, your players are going to have ground-based adventures and they'll probably want a speeder craft to get around with. The group is probably going to want to take their ground transport on their ship with them, that requires cargo space.
Now the speeder type that Luke had in a New Hope, rules as written, is only supposed to fit a driver and a single passenger (although they did fit the droids in there too). That might be sufficient. I don't think anyone would fault most GMs for fitting a 4 passenger version of that speeder into your game with the same or similar stats. I don't think that I speak for only myself when I say that something so insignificant to gameplay as number of passenger seats could be fudged for the sake of keeping the group together and making the story flow better.
We almost stuck with the Wayfarer because it looked like it would fit one of the cooler group ground vehicles in the game, inside the cargo bay, an armored personnel carrier, with a ramp for off and onloading the thing too.
Anyway, sorry, tangent. Basically all I'm saying is that the group will probably want something with the cargo space to move their ground transportation from place to place with them.
At some point, your players are going to have ground-based adventures and they'll probably want a speeder craft to get around with. The group is probably going to want to take their ground transport on their ship with them, that requires cargo space.
Now the speeder type that Luke had in a New Hope, rules as written, is only supposed to fit a driver and a single passenger (although they did fit the droids in there too). That might be sufficient. I don't think anyone would fault most GMs for fitting a 4 passenger version of that speeder into your game with the same or similar stats. I don't think that I speak for only myself when I say that something so insignificant to gameplay as number of passenger seats could be fudged for the sake of keeping the group together and making the story flow better.
We almost stuck with the Wayfarer because it looked like it would fit one of the cooler group ground vehicles in the game, inside the cargo bay, an armored personnel carrier, with a ramp for off and onloading the thing too.
Anyway, sorry, tangent. Basically all I'm saying is that the group will probably want something with the cargo space to move their ground transportation from place to place with them.
So far, my group is fine with just walking, but I'm usually loose with the rules, and now that I have Beyond the Rim, I plan to have my players take strain and such from walking long distances.
Transportation, however, requires the GM to decide whether the group can just walk all over the place or if they need a car. My group has a base, and they use a hover truck to get to town and to go about on the planet, but they spend most of their time travelling around in their ship. Luckily, they don't just use the ship.
Here's the ship my group is currently using;
http://www.rpgnow.com/product/121739/0-hr-Venture-Poster-Images
All of this guy's ship layouts are great. His cargo pod layouts are only available with the Sherpa with the Misfortune. But they are awesome. Some of the larger ships were almost chosen. There are also capital ship layouts in case you need an 'escape from slightly less epic situation than a Death Star' scenario. Carriers might be fun... Get to the launch bays and fight your way out. There are many small party sized ships to choose from.
Some folks prefer ships that they can find deck plans for: myth-weavers.com, is one such location, they at the very least have a YT-2400 and a Loronar E-9 Explorer there which are well done (can't hit it from my work).
Some folks prefer ships that they can find deck plans for: myth-weavers.com, is one such location, they at the very least have a YT-2400 and a Loronar E-9 Explorer there which are well done (can't hit it from my work).
where would someone find them? That site's not terribly helpful with searching.
Found it, disregard.
Edited by 2P51I haven`t gotten to play it but I like the mechanics and look of the wayfarer. Two things I was going to give my players as options to make it more of a "everybody" friendly ship.
1) I was going to have them have the option to drop the cargo container (and loose a few SS and/or WT) to drop the ship from sihoulette 5 to 4. This would also decrease the penalty for piloting by one. Then they could just pick it up later.
2) The second would be to make it more symetrical with a second cargo pod (expensive to custom build and hard to find) but it would nearly double the cargo space. I was going to add WT and SS but reduce handling by one or two. I figured any hard point lost for adding this on would be compensated by the extra space on the cargo container and frame.
Then the wayfarer becomes a beast of a ship, especially for a diverse party who wants a little of everything. I`m sure there are better base ships in the further books but as far as core book ships go it was the one that perked my interest.
I have a deeply rooted hate for the Ghtroc 720, seemed to be the only starter ship and GM would give for the longest time and I crashed more of those on purpose than I`d care to admit.
I always liked the stats for the YT-1300 but never the layouts, none of them ever made a lick of sense to me. It has these two massive "docking" pylons but never uses em, cargo space that doesn`t look like you could fit half a hutt in. Corellians must belive that a long walk will make you live longer cause you had to run around in a circle to get to the other side of the ship.
I like the 1930. Especially the knockoff verson "Future Armada: Venture" or something like that.
Liberiton,
As far as providing your players with a "Wayfayer Lite", you may want to consider this as an option:
It's may take on an EotE version of the Nova Eclipse starship that Christopher West (the guy that created the Wayfayer in the first place) created. At it's heart, it's what you described, a Wayfayer-type ship that's at Silhouette 4 and isn't as tough, but does have a bit more firepower to start with.
I too liked the Ghtroc 720 ("Space Turtle!") and while I don't entirely agree with the official stats, it's still nice to see it listed as an option for PC groups.
My players are currently drooling over Future Armada's 'Wolves' or the 'Lakota'. I'm wanting to upgrade them in due time so they have some fighters to play with. All are great layouts, and all are what I would call size 5 or could pass for 4. Mourning Wolf is the biggest and clearly has room for a few fighters or ground assault vehicles. I plan to stat them based on what they choose... Bigger ships=whale performance.
The Renegade is also pretty awesome. It has a launch bay on top and a vehicle bay on the bottom.
What I just gave my players tonight for services rendered to Doc.
I am in the same boat of Donovan too many groups and even taking a small look at the list of what people have ship wise in this discussion most people have a yt-1300 or 2400 or a YT of the sort which have very similar looks. I don't have any complaints on stats just ass tired of it. In my own groups I've suggested a Loronar e-9 and with a new layout that i adjusted to meet the desires of my group so enjoy the layout if you wish to take it.
