The Jedi were patterned off of Samurai, and, in a great many ways, their legacy and reputation is the same. Samurai were normal men that dedicated their entire lives to an art, and that made them scary, scary, men. Jedi are the same, the reason they can wade through battle droids or take on a bajillion normal soldiers is that the normal soldier is no where near as experienced or dedicated as they are. Even if you look at Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, they've focused on their skills and trained to the exclusion of all else to achieve their prowess. Jango and Cad did the same - and for it they were feared just as a Jedi (why do you think Dooku hired them?).

This. Times ten.

Morning to everyone!

Any speculation about pages 220-221 that says "It is also rumored that some Jedi have mastered a technique that allows them to ignore the effects of strain, or ease the minds of others to help them recover more quickly".

Maybe a similar version that one one fom Donovan's blog? http://jedimorningfire.blogspot.com/

If the extent of force healing is recovering strain, I have no problem with it. If it becomes a regenerative power I will be disappointed. However, if the force healing talent (if there is one) augments the medical skills by allowing a character to spend pips, similar to existing powers, I would be okay with that - basicslly the force as a guiding factor.

Maybe just an interpretation but, it seems something really powerful. Probably just an interpretation but even "ignore the effects of strain" don't seem just a "simple" recover 2 strain.

At the wookie there were a description of a Force power called Battlemind (not sure if 100% canon or just an import from D20/Saga)

Battlemind was a Force power wherein one's morale and fighting spirit was augmented through sheer focus, giving a user the drive to fight though even the hardest of conflicts. One could overcome the disabilities of old age and even fading stamina. Users of Battlemind could find themselves fighting with a great deal more fiery and controlled passion, thus it was not common among the more orthodox fighting styles of the Jedi.

There are a few recovering techniques but this seems the only one that ignores the "fading strain-mina effects".

If the extent of force healing is recovering strain, I have no problem with it. If it becomes a regenerative power I will be disappointed. However, if the force healing talent (if there is one) augments the medical skills by allowing a character to spend pips, similar to existing powers, I would be okay with that - basicslly the force as a guiding factor.

My thought was an entirely separate power as far as healing goes. How exactly that power works has undergone some significant revisions since I published the initial version of it. This way, if a Force-user wants to focus on being the "party cleric" they can do so, but they're not forced into.

Then again, if the speculation that the Consular/Guardian/Sentinel split will be as careers, then there could be a Jedi Healer specialization that's tied to the Consular career, with talents that bolster healing via the Force much as the Doctor spec for the Colonist has talents that bolster healing via medical techniques.

In a way, Jedi already have an edge on recovering Strain as Discipline is going to be a key skill for them, along with a higher-than-average Willpower, both of which will come in handy after a combat to recover spent Strain. Even more so if Balance is an option (as it is for my Jedi Initiate universal spec), allowing for even more Strain Recovery.

As far as using Force powers go, the only Strain that a Force-user has to suffer when using them is by making the choice to convert Dark Side pips on the Force die to usable Light Side pips. As it's a purely voluntary choice, I feel that this is something that should be kept, even for PCs with a high Force Rating; if you want that extra bit of power, then you have to pay the piper to get it.

I just got a new idea for Force and Destiny...

Maybe FFG could expend on the current Force powers trees... add another row of upgrades for the Move, Influence, Sense, Enhance and Farsee force power trees. Maybe not huge upgrades but usefull ones... like for Sense, add a upgrade to activate the defense and offensive boost (commit one pip for each) has one action instead of 2.

This would open the way to more powerfull jedis, with the right XP.

What do you guys think ?

If its paralel to other new things, yep, why not But also I have to say that without considrering Expanded Universe, just in Movies and TV Shows (the strongest canon sources, not videogames, comics or books at least until Disney re-edit them) there aren't so much powers or Force skills in SW more than:

- Run, Jump, Push + Saber Throw, Pull, Move, Grip, Lightning, "Stabilize more than Heal" (Obi -> Luke/Padme), Mind Trick, Sense, Farseeing, Mind Reading/Telepathy and Dathomir Powers like Barriers, Materialize Objects (fold space?), Invisible/Illusions and maybe a few more like "Vodoo, Raise Undead" and Metamorphosis (Overlords).

We can (or not) like this powers or canon sources but personally are the best options for me to recreate the SW Universe without add anything else.

...and I also think that I need a geek girlfriend XD

Remember, that video way back said that you were gonna be able to make your force sensitive character in EotE, carry it onward into AoR, and then finally into FaD. There should be no starting career as a jedi, or sith, etc. Assuming jedi would require at least FR 3 to buy into. There doesn't need to be a bunch of different core specializations either. Your "consular, guardian, sentinel" so many seem insistent on, is very easily represented in how the character itself has been built. The stats you started with, and the skills you've bought determine the "type" of jedi you are more than anything.

Look at Luke in the original trilogy, it wasn't till the end of the third movie he passed his final test and become a true jedi.

Except that it is to be a game unto itself. So there needs to be starting characters. What the designers were referring to was the fact that you could start a character in EotE with FSEx, progress through AoR taking FSEm, and finally with F&D take actual Jedi specs. They were promoting three games which can be played separately or together and that can integrate with each other.

Except that it is to be a game unto itself. So there needs to be starting characters. What the designers were referring to was the fact that you could start a character in EotE with FSEx, progress through AoR taking FSEm, and finally with F&D take actual Jedi specs. They were promoting three games which can be played separately or together and that can integrate with each other.

Sure, but that doesn't mean that they can't do it both ways.

Have a starting force sensitive apprentice with FR 1, and have jedi specs that can be taken at higher FRs.

You can't have just one starting career for Force and Destiny...

That would mean that every new F&D character would be the same career... there will be 6 starting careers like the other 2 books... how many will be Force Users... at least 4, if not all 6.

You can't have just one starting career for Force and Destiny...

That would mean that every new F&D character would be the same career... there will be 6 starting careers like the other 2 books... how many will be Force Users... at least 4, if not all 6.

We may just have one force career and the rest something else. This book may not be solely about force users. Or it could have six force careers. I have no idea, but I don't think force careers would be different enough to justify more than a few.

My point is more that it could be a hybrid concept rather than an either/or.

FangGrip,

I don't think we'll see a hybrid concept. The mundanes already have 12 careers to choose from between EotE and AoR, so my gut feeling is that the new careers we do get (which may not even be a full six; could just be a single Jedi career and a couple of more generic Force careers for all anyone knows) will all be for Force-users. In the prior two corebooks, Force-users were a side item, something included for the sake of this being a Star Wars RPG (a number of folks were outraged that Jedi weren't an option from Day 1, but imagine how bad the stink would have been if there were zero rules for Force-users in either book), but F&D will most likely be the book where Force-users get to step into the lime light.

Donavan you are forgetting that each game is supposed to be seperate and compatable, you are assuming that everyone will buy all three books, while I agree that most people will buy it, but i feel the rpg will have to a less 'this is a Jedi career' and have force traditions not spelled out, formulaic way. Ive posted my ideas above, which I know you disagree with. No my ideas are not perfect, but with refinement they could represent all and every force tradition that exists or someone wishes to create and then FFG can sell a splat book with nothing but Jedi, Sith, Nightsisters, etc.

FangGrip,

I don't think we'll see a hybrid concept. The mundanes already have 12 careers to choose from between EotE and AoR, so my gut feeling is that the new careers we do get (which may not even be a full six; could just be a single Jedi career and a couple of more generic Force careers for all anyone knows) will all be for Force-users. In the prior two corebooks, Force-users were a side item, something included for the sake of this being a Star Wars RPG (a number of folks were outraged that Jedi weren't an option from Day 1, but imagine how bad the stink would have been if there were zero rules for Force-users in either book), but F&D will most likely be the book where Force-users get to step into the lime light.

Maybe I am showing a lack of creativity, but I don't see how you could make 6 entire and distinctive careers (each with three specializations) for force sensitives and jedi characters. I agree that they are likely to mimic the other two books in the number of careers and specializations. I also think they are likely to use universal specializations in a similar way to what they have done with EotE and AoR. Something that will likely throw us for a loop. That is why I am leaning towards a hybrid system.

I also have to agree with Samoflange about it needing to cover all the bases of character roles (face, security, investigator, medic, etc) in order to be a stand alone game. The two come together to make me think that the hybrid system that is already in play with the rest of the games will be the case. I just don't see that many force specific careers in the way they built it up. And to top it off, I keep wondering about the "Destiny" part and what careers will reflect it, if any.

I agree that I find 6 careers with 3 specs each unlikely for Jedi. By the same token with 2 books already going to be published and the supplement books for each career adding more specs, I'm not sure there is enough unique ideas left to do another 6/18 split regardless of Jedi or not. Hopefully we will get some beta news in a few months.

From a purely business point of view, every career is another book they can sell (along with more races and force powers). I'm sure that they will find a way to split them all up.

I also think this is a good thing. I have never liked having all Jedi lumped together in a generic class. Having variety is good for us as well as them.

As for the six careers, it's not that difficult, as has been discussed earlier in the thread.

Firstly, you'd have the Jedi broken out into a Consular career, a Guardian career, and a Sentinel career, each with attendent specializations. For non-Jedi Force-users, break them out into a "warrior" career with specs that focus on combat, a "mystic" that focuses on the more esoteric aspects of the Force. For the non-Jedi specs, FFG could easily pull from the EU for Force traditions in addition to creating something of a generalist spec for each non-Jedi career. For instance, Zeison Sha and Jensaarai for the "warrior" career, Dathomir Witch and Baron Do Sage for the "mystic," As for the Jedi, there's a fair number of 'branches' that can be used to establish three specs per career, with a few folks (self included) making stabs at what they might be.

So that alone is five careers right there.

As for the six careers, it's not that difficult, as has been discussed earlier in the thread.

Firstly, you'd have the Jedi broken out into a Consular career, a Guardian career, and a Sentinel career, each with attendent specializations. For non-Jedi Force-users, break them out into a "warrior" career with specs that focus on combat, a "mystic" that focuses on the more esoteric aspects of the Force. For the non-Jedi specs, FFG could easily pull from the EU for Force traditions in addition to creating something of a generalist spec for each non-Jedi career. For instance, Zeison Sha and Jensaarai for the "warrior" career, Dathomir Witch and Baron Do Sage for the "mystic," As for the Jedi, there's a fair number of 'branches' that can be used to establish three specs per career, with a few folks (self included) making stabs at what they might be.

So that alone is five careers right there.

Not really, it's 3 and 2 that you more or less can already do. Someone can be a soldier or merc or any gunslinger and gain access to Force powers now. Someone could be a scholar and cast themselves (no pun) as some sage of ancient Force lore now.

We all know the 'class' names for Jedi that exist in the EU but FFG is just as likely to use career names like Padawan, Jedi Knight, and Jedi Master, as any of the stuff from the games. With the crack down on canon more likely I would imagine.

They've done a pretty outstanding job thus far, so I have faith in however they execute F&D it will be a lot of fun to add to my game.

A sixth career could be one which was for non-Force users. Or they could include a Sith career. I think the latter is less likely. But otherwise I don't see any issue continuing the six career setup for characters.

I would love a large section of the book to be dedicated to the dark side; and I'd love a Sith career, too.

I would prefer more high canon focused carriers and specializations but, I'm not closed to other possibilities.

I just want to be surprised

Donovan (and everyone of course ) what do you think about some kind of talent like: Commit 3 and consider that you have 1 Pip every turn to fuel powers?

A player of mine rolls up to 7 Force dices and he uses to get NO light side pips... a couple of times XD He have bad Karma or just its pretty difficult.

The reason is because I don't use to see Jedis failing so often 1 PiP fuel basic powers.

I really want to see the whole guardian/consular/sentinel thing die in a fire. Guardian and consular are baggage from Wizards, who made the two separate in hopes of making Jedi more notable in the game. Sentinel is baggage from Knights of the Old Republic (via Wizards), and was only included as a statistical middle ground so that players didn't have to choose from only 2 classes.

I highly doubt that FFG is going to keep with this baggage. Why? Look at the canon. To my knowledge, nowhere outside of Wizards' influence are guardians, consulars, or sentinels mentioned. No where is there a formal separation of Jedi "classes." You see as much variation in Jedi as you see in bounty hunters and smugglers, and this variation does not need to be quantified like this.

With that said, I do expect to see different aspects of the Jedi explored through specializations. I expect that different talent combinations will compliment different things like lightsaber forms and "the Force as my ally" types. But since you can pick up and move through other specializations easily, I expect that these will be more about color and flavor than separation and specialty.

As for the careers themselves? Who knows. Given that FFG is very deliberately following the original movies (EoE representing the raw space adventure of New Hope and AoR representing the formalization of the Rebellion in Empire), and given how small a role Jedi specifically play in the original movies and the original EU material, I would expect to see a number of non-force using careers. The supporting characters all took roles of leadership while Luke was off going woosh woosh and playing with puppets, so I imagine that the mundane careers will be more about leadership and transition (that whole Destiny part of the name). I see the careers being more about power and destiny as a whole, where as the EoE careers are about adventure and the AoR careers are about strength and opposition.

Edit: I also kind of expect to see Ewoks as a playable species. Just saying.

I believe best way to different the different "type" of jedi is best shown in their particular combnation of specializations, talents, powers, and skills. The jedi you've grown to become is the jedi you are.