I'm curious, how did a starting character begin with four Yellow dice in anything? As far as I understand it the max starting Skill is two ranks (pg 92, Table 2-4, and Obligation does not break this maximum) and Yellow dice are determined by the lowest characteristic so even if you have a five Brawn you still only get two Yellow dice. Then to get a skill to four would cost a minimum additional 35 EXP (15 for the 3rd + 20 for the 4th) which is at least two adventures, more likely three, and that means not buying anything else. Sure you can Min-Max but it's still going to take some time to get there and their going to have to sacrifice something along the way. Sure they can take on extra Obligation after the first adventure when they get their first EXP to spend but if you're allowing them to buff up on Obligation to Max out skills then you should really play that Obligation out and not hand wave it away.

So please explain how your player got these high skills to start because if you're not going to follow the rules of character creation and advancement then of course you're going to have balance issues.

I'm curious, how did a starting character begin with four Yellow dice in anything? As far as I understand it the max starting Skill is two ranks (pg 92, Table 2-4) and Yellow dice are determined by the lowest characteristic so even if you have a five Brawn you still only get two yellow dice. Then to get a skill to four would cost an additional 35 EXP (15 for the 3rd + 20 for the 4th) which is at least two adventures if not three, and that means not buying anything else. Sure you can Min-Max but it's still going to

Please explain because if you're not going to follow the rules of character creation then of course you're going to have balance issues.

Tru dat.

You can get 4 Yellows with Characteristic 4, Ability 2 and then rolling lots of Advantages/Triumphs to upgrade subsequent checks. I guess. But it won't be consistent.

these guys r very "my character would do this even if it kills him" playstyle

AKA "we actually don't know **** about psychology or the fight-or-flight response but we'll feel like we Lost The Game and/or will be emasculated if we flee rather than make a so-called heroic last stand."

You can get 4 Yellows with Characteristic 4, Ability 2 and then rolling lots of Advantages/Triumphs to upgrade subsequent checks. I guess. But it won't be consistent.

It seems kinda harsh giving them extra Obligation when the starter adventure is on-rails and they don't really have a lot of choice there.

On the other hand there is always a choice. That choice does not need to be violence.

At that point the crew had painted themselves into a corner after pretty much tearing **** up in Mos Shuuta; torching the customs office/warhouse, using an IED against Teemo's goons, using a Flame Projector against Imperial Stormtroopers ordering them to stand down in the name of the Emperor and generally doing everything but being sneaky and cunning.

They could easily have just run away with just covering fire and minimal real damage. The Tie fighters would have hit the Krayt Fang causing some superficial damage. They didn't Have to destroy them. Not to mention how they opened up at the Storm Troopers with the ship's guns as the took off.

That said I did push their Obligation a little because I wanted to try the mechanic but I was very upfront and transparent about it with the group. The player who got hit with the upped Obligation thought it made perfect sense.

And of course, the galaxy Is a harsh mistress...

Edit: it also help things a lot if the players trust the GM enough to know that standing down or being caught does not mean The End but rather a twist or new turn in the story. Not sure my crew is quite there yet but we keep an open discussion going and I rather tell them straight up why this or that happened than having them be unsure about the consequences of their actions.

It can't rain all the time.

Oh, so much this!

At it's core, SW is a fairly positive series, definitely not the 'grimdark' so beloved of 90's culture. Yes, it's possible to address more grown-up issues and make a game for adults, particularly in EoE, which is probably the most 'edgy' of all the games on offer here.

But it's still a setting where the heroes usually win, even if those victories come with sacrifice. I've never felt it's about playing the 'bad guys' or exploring the deepest, darkest reaches of human behavior. There are lots of other games that do that.

That's not to say I want a bowdlerised or kid's game, but the default of playing heroes (or raffish anti-heroes in EoE) is something that distinguishes SW for me from the plethora of other 'grimdark' sci-fi.

And yes, your main role as GM is to make the players feel awesome, but make them work for that!

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

However, the Wookie is absolutely useless in all other arenas. He reads these forums. "You hear me Paradoxicus!? You're USELESS!" I mean, I'm never going into melee against him, but seriously, he's useless.

If your max-Brawn PC is hurting your butt, put him on a space ship. You really don't even need Rival or Nemesis-difficulty NPCs there. A minion pilot is threat enough.

The ground game is a big part of EotE, sure, but rather than penalize them, put them in cicrumstances where they aren't at the advantage. Put them into unbreakable binders, force them into conflicts of wits.

At the end of the day, Hulk is going to do what he does best, smash. That's what it sounds like that PC is built for. Your player wants to excel whilst smashing. Either throw something of equal smashiness at them, (our GM used cybernetics on a Trandoshan), or put them into conflicts they can't smash out of.

If your max-Brawn PC is hurting your butt, put him on a space ship.

Or even better - a tuxedo. "Wait - what do you mean we have to go to a dinner party or the deal is off. What the hell are all these forks for? Christ, why are the portions so small! How come everyone at the table is laughing at me? Hah! The snooty noble just challenged me to a duel. . . in chess."

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

Why is it that I've seen in print, at least once, that FFG needs to clarify "Stun damage does not bypass soak". Like why is that even a thing? Is there some type of rule somewhere that would allow Stun to bypass soak under certain circumstances?

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

Why is it that I've seen in print, at least once, that FFG needs to clarify "Stun damage does not bypass soak". Like why is that even a thing? Is there some type of rule somewhere that would allow Stun to bypass soak under certain circumstances?

Doctor specialization, Pressure Point talent.

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

Why is it that I've seen in print, at least once, that FFG needs to clarify "Stun damage does not bypass soak". Like why is that even a thing? Is there some type of rule somewhere that would allow Stun to bypass soak under certain circumstances?

I would almost think "soaking" Stun should be based on Willpower, not Brawn.

Anyway, net/bola him, then lol.

As said above, use situations that can't be settled by Brawn and the Melee skill. Social functions, investigations, etc. If you're worried about letting him off a major NPC early, have said NPC on a high catwalk or aboard a hovering speeder, so this PC can chew through all the minions he wants without derailing your storyline via early Nemesis death.

If the PC is a "turn every encounter into a combat encounter" type of person, the authorities will probably catch on pretty quick, and Obligation and opposition will both increase. Don't be afraid to have more powerful enemies focus on him either, as he will likely stand out as a threat. Actually, he will stand out entirely, making it very difficult for the group to do anything undetected.

As for the yellow dice, is he using Destiny Points constantly? If so, be more stingy with them. Personally, I don't make flipped Destiny Points available until after the end of the current encounter, so they're not used on every roll.

And most importantly, talk about it. I'm currently running a 8-player Black Crusade game involving two Traitor Legionnaires. We are all aware of just how powerful they are, but the group needs to stay hidden as long as they can, and they know that they'll have to take a back seat during most of the skullduggery.

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

Why is it that I've seen in print, at least once, that FFG needs to clarify "Stun damage does not bypass soak". Like why is that even a thing? Is there some type of rule somewhere that would allow Stun to bypass soak under certain circumstances?

Normally, strain damage bypasses soak. For proof, see the description of soak on page 207, which states, "soak does not reduce strain inflicted on a target, except in specific instances (such as with weapons with the Stun Damage quality)." This is important because some talents, such as the Politico's Scathing Tirade and the Force Sensitive's Influence Basic Power, would be almost useless if they were subject to soak.

I'm a player in my current group. Our Wookie Hired Gun Marauder has max'd out Brawn and you simply cannot kill him by conventional means in the ground game. He's an unstoppable juggernaut of melee distruction, and you can't stop the Juggernaut, b*tch!

Shoot him with blasters on stun ro shock gloves if you must melee. I seriously doubt that he has much in the way of a Strain Threshold. Beyond that, he has no particular resistance to Critical Hits (other than Heroic Fortitude, but that won't keep him alive), so any shot has the potential of ruining his day.

Why is it that I've seen in print, at least once, that FFG needs to clarify "Stun damage does not bypass soak". Like why is that even a thing? Is there some type of rule somewhere that would allow Stun to bypass soak under certain circumstances?

Normally, strain damage bypasses soak. For proof, see the description of soak on page 207, which states, "soak does not reduce strain inflicted on a target, except in specific instances (such as with weapons with the Stun Damage quality)." This is important because some talents, such as the Politico's Scathing Tirade and the Force Sensitive's Influence Basic Power, would be almost useless if they were subject to soak.

I believe that weapons that have the <Stun x> quality bypasses soak, which is different from weapons that deal stun damage via the "Stun Damage" quality or "Stun Setting". It's very confusing.

Meh, not really. All you need to remember that weapons marked "Stun 3" are different than weapons marked "Stun Damage" or "Stun Setting".

Soak has been an "issue" since I played Warhammer first edition. They did not quite solve it in Warhammer second edition, and got it worst in Warhammer third edition. Not to mention that there is nothing in "real live" as toughness derived soak; you get hit by a bullet, no matter how tough you are, you are going to be wounded (we could argue as much as for then wounds concept, but this is another topic). Imagine if you are hit by plasma!. In EotE the problems deriving from high Brawn and Soak persist. That is in EotE there can be PCs that do not fear to stand against 20 stormtoopers because they can simple soak the damage. Into my eyes it does not feel Star Wars, and for me this is an issue to be corrected, for other players and GMs it may be not.

What it has worked for me is to remove Brawn from the Soak equation (for PCs and NPCs alike). That is, Soak = armour + ranks in Enduring talent.

To balance the game mechanics I have reduced all weapons damage by 2 points. It works for me and my players.

Cheers,

Yepes

Remember though: Wounds don't kill PCs, Critical Hits kill PCs. A character can be brought down with a shot that only scores 1 Wound if it gets a Critical and the d% roll is high enough.

Disruptor weapons can really ruin his day.

I think part of the problem is the idea that a success on the die is necessarily a physical "hit" to the body. Strain can be mental or physical. Stun is most likely always physical. "Damage" from weapons etc. can be near misses or grazes or very minor injuries that weaken the PC with only Criticals being actual "hits". Even then some criticals can be from things other than an actual hit by say a blaster but rather damage taken avoiding the actual bolt, such as hitting your head hard enough to ring your bell while dodging.

The point being that "damage" is just a term used to determin how long a PC lasts in a fight and only Criticals are lasting injury.

Start thinking of the numbers like this and it's easer to understand how the syster makes sense.

Good thought FG.

OP, I occassionally play a Wookie Marauder, so I'm probably your problem player. Let me impart some ideas on how to slow my character type down.

1. STRAIN. I don't have my sheet handy, but I'm sitting on a paltry amount of Strain. Wound Threshold is through the roof at like 20+, but Strain Threshold is way down at like 10. If I have to double move to get to Engaged, I'm already starting to feel it. Am I using Frenzied Attack? I'm half way to passed out after an encounter. Sure, I've generally ripped bad guys apart, but it's not something I can do for long.

Along with that:

2.Range. Those guys with blasters are how far away? Two moves and it's moving through difficult terrain? They are on a balcony or overhang and I need an Athletics check to get there? Bonus for separating groups. Minion Group 1 is at Short, Group 2 is at Medium and there is also a Rival at Medium, but he's over here on his own; at least one move away from Group 2, but he might back up once he sees me chop up Group 1.

3. Instead of using Triumphs and Advantage to upgrade the next roll (increasing the chance of more Triumphs/Advantage for a loop effect) just GM that **** down to a Boost die. I'm AFB so I don't know what it says on adjudication of Triumphs via upgrading/Boost dice on the next roll so maybe the upgrade is correct, but we usually just give Boosts.

4. Upgrage your own pools. Either with Adversary ranks or with Destiny Points. Red dice = Despair = my ax broke

Just some ideas anyway.