I am far more interested in Dangerous Covenants than anything else. /sadface at their release dates.

I find it weird that people seem to think that Armor doesn't have a place in Star Wars. I know the movies don't emphasize on it, but was that a budget concern or a canon concern?

What what? Every storm trooper and clone trooper was wearing laminate armor. Darth Vader wore armor. Boba Fett wore armor. It's right there, in the face of the doubters!

My 2 cents: armor is inconvenient and uncomfortable, so unless you're planning to be in a fight you're probably not wearing it.

Armor definitely has a place, but its a tool that gets used for certain jobs. Obviously some characters or groups will be armed to the teeth, some missions warrant that. Other times its a jacket, a hidden blaster...and a 7 foot wookie.

It's 2 points of soak, possibly some defense to boot, at the cost of negligible encumberance. What's not to like?

I find it weird that people seem to think that Armor doesn't have a place in Star Wars. I know the movies don't emphasize on it, but was that a budget concern or a canon concern?

What what? Every storm trooper and clone trooper was wearing laminate armor. Darth Vader wore armor. Boba Fett wore armor. It's right there, in the face of the doubters!

My 2 cents: armor is inconvenient and uncomfortable, so unless you're planning to be in a fight you're probably not wearing it.

I think it's more the fact that the heroes of the films are the ones not wearing (noticeable) armor, and that only the bad guys (or soon-to-be bad guys) are wearing obvious armor. So for those folks, having their PCs, who are the heroes of their own stories, being required by the system to wear at least some kind of armor just feels off to them.

Prior editions of Star Wars RPG had an interesting relationship with the whole "PCs wearing armor" bit; for WEG, it was helpful but not necessary (especially for species like the Wookiee or the Barabel who could soak up blaster rifle damage with near impunity). The RCR version of WotC's d20 Star Wars made armor almost vital to protect against critical hits, as a crit from even a measly blaster pistol could take down a PC in one shot, resulting in many PCs wearing at least a blast vest if they had the option. Saga Edition made it so that armor might help at lower levels, but unless you specialized in wearing armor, you were better off without it by the time you became eligible for prestige classes as your class defense bonus quite often surpassed the defense bonus that all but the heaviest (and expensive) of armors offered.

I think it's more the fact that the heroes of the films are the ones not wearing (noticeable) armor, and that only the bad guys (or soon-to-be bad guys) are wearing obvious armor. So for those folks, having their PCs, who are the heroes of their own stories, being required by the system to wear at least some kind of armor just feels off to them.

I'm not sure where you're finding a requirement to wear armor; half my heroes don't wear armor and consequently, when the blasters come out they duck for cover. Blasters be deadly, yo.

[edit] I was going to ignore the treatise on previous systems because they're about as apt as D&D to this conversation, but for the sake of argument, let's look at some 100% unarguably canon instances of blasters versus soft fleshies:

1. Han shot Greedo. One shot and he was DEAD.

2. A stormtropper shot Leia in presumably armored clothes, on Endor. She was down and not getting up - certainly not dead but certainly not springing back to action after she'd ben shot.

Those are just two obvious examples, I'm sure you all can come up with dozens more. In my mind the issue here is just a play style difference and managing your players' expectations.

I'm not sure where you're finding a requirement to wear armor; half my heroes don't wear armor and consequently, when the blasters come out they duck for cover. Blasters be deadly, yo.

It's more the fact that every bit of boost you can add to your Soak Value helps. And even if it's called "heavy clothing," for some folks it still counts as armor. For those folks, it's an issue as the "lethality" of the system punishes a player if they opt not to wear some kind of protective gear.

It's more the fact that every bit of boost you can add to your Soak Value helps. And even if it's called "heavy clothing," for some folks it still counts as armor. For those folks, it's an issue as the "lethality" of the system punishes a player if they opt not to wear some kind of protective gear.

I won't argue the system is lethal, but that sits right for me. I'm not sure it's punishing a player for not wearing armor, though - more of an encouragement to not get shot?

Different strokes and all....

I won't argue the system is lethal, but that sits right for me. I'm not sure it's punishing a player for not wearing armor, though - more of an encouragement to not get shot?

Different strokes and all....

Except there's also the issue that if you haven't taken taken a combat-focused specialization that offers defensive talents, the ability to avoid getting shot in the first place is fairly limited, with Cover really being the only viable option, and all that does is incur a setback die to the shooter, which more often than not isn't going to do very much to keep you from getting blasted. Obviously for you it's no big deal, but others folks (such as Maelora's group) it is a point of concern, as the system does punish the player for not wearing protective gear simply by means of when you get shot (and it will happen far more often than not), it's going to hurt more, which also leads some groups to have the PCs strolling around in at least Padded Armor if not Heavy Combat Armor for the best Soak Value they can get, as every point of Soak Value means less damage per hit, and thus lengthens the PC's survival time in a firefight.

Except there's also the issue that if you haven't taken taken a combat-focused specialization that offers defensive talents, the ability to avoid getting shot in the first place is fairly limited, with Cover really being the only viable option, and all that does is incur a setback die to the shooter, which more often than not isn't going to do very much to keep you from getting blasted. Obviously for you it's no big deal, but others folks (such as Maelora's group) it is a point of concern, as the system does punish the player for not wearing protective gear simply by means of when you get shot (and it will happen far more often than not), it's going to hurt more, which also leads some groups to have the PCs strolling around in at least Padded Armor if not Heavy Combat Armor for the best Soak Value they can get, as every point of Soak Value means less damage per hit, and thus lengthens the PC's survival time in a firefight.

I guess I don't see why there needs to be a mechanic to prevent getting shot when roleplaying could solve the problem. I would certainly expect a politico not only not to take any sort of combat training that would incur a defensive bonus, but I would also expect the character to try to talk their way out of a fight. I would also expect that playing said character in a combat-heavy group is going to lead to a bad time, and I tie it again back to managing expectations before the dice pool's ever built.

You've mentioned that the system punishes players for not wearing armor, I guess that nomenclature is where I take issue; In my mind, the system punishes players for doing dumb things, but you still need to roll a ridiculously high crit roll to actually kill a PC. That's the safety net.

Of course I'm not condemning anyone's style of play! If your group's having fun, you're doing it right.

[edit] Hey, how about that Suns of Fortune release date!

No as a guy that played many a FFG board game we called it FFeees, being able to understand the layout and system for how they do their rules. Very cold in Minnesota, might affect their mode of thinking.

But by god they make quality good looking stuff.

One game never in the rules said if you rolled one dice two but in the game component breakdown, 2 dice, to be rolled to check for success or failure. Yeah, that was a lot of fun to find.

We are only talking about 1 or 2 points here though in Armor.

I don't think it is all that punishing to not wear armor (since all characters soak lethal attacks with their brawn), but of course every point does help in a firefight.