Ok, so I'm not the most knowledgeable in Warhammer Lore, so there may be some non-mechanic "rules" I'm unaware of, but I had an idea.
Is it possible to add the Storm quality to a sniper rifle? It seems like it would be VERY effective, 2 bullets at once with Accurate means lotsa damage!
Even Ingame somewhere someone else must have thought the same thing...I WANTZ IT!
There is no in-universe rationale as to why you would not be able to make a Storm-Sniper or a Combi-Sniper of some kind.
There might, however, be several reasons this has not happened, and might be some points a crafty GM would raise as a counterpoint. Maybe it becomes too heavy to aim properly, or cumbersome to move, maybe it throws off the aim at long ranges, etc, etc, etc.
Me, personally, I would remove the Accurate Special Quality from a Storm-Sniper of any kind, I think.
The Sniper Rifle is ment to be used as a precision weapon. A carefully lined up shot to take out a 'human' target from a great distance with one shot. In real life automatic sniper rifles like a Dragunov suffer a certain degree of inaccuracy compared to bolt-action sniper rifles since the recoil from the first shot will push the weapon away from it's previous line-up. You can shoot faster, but without careful re-aiming your second (and third) shot will deviate. You CAN fire faster, but not with the same precision.
That careful aiming is covered with the Accurate quality, if you use any other form of fire than single shot i as a GM would remove the quality, same as Fgdsfg.
You could try the following if you look for a Sniper Rifle with more punch: Transform an Autocannon into an Anti Material Rifle.
Reduce the fire-mode to S/-/-, the clip down to 5, the weight down to 15 kg, leave it as a Heavy SP weapon and add the Accurate Quality (and maybe Fell), That way you can deliver a powerful blow over a great distance but the weight, clip size and weapon category prevents it from outclassing the other sniper rifles. Oh, and don't even try to put a silencer on that.
For real live comparison:
That Autocannon is commonly used by the dreaded ogryn sniper corps.
Since Ogryns are close quarter fighters and no snipers i assume you make a joke?
Since Ogryns are close quarter fighters and no snipers i assume you make a joke?
That's what they want you to think... Accurate Autocannons can snipe vehicles in this game. Rather nasty. Not every Ogryn fitted with Bone'ead needs to command - some make awesome commandos!
Edited by HappyDazeSince Ogryns are close quarter fighters and no snipers i assume you make a joke?
I wish.
Ogryns have no de-merits with regards to shooting and indeed have BS aptitude.
Purely by numbers, they are comparable to heavies except auto-stabilised.
They start with weapon training talents to use auto cannons, which are ogryn proof.
It may not be the most fluffy thing out there, but ogryns make excellent auto-cannon platforms. And if said auto cannon is accurate, nothing stops them from sniping vehicles - rules wise that is.
Well it would always be nice to see some sort off Recoilless Rifle
Well it would always be nice to see some sort off Recoilless Rifle
A lot of rifles in WH40kRP are effectively recoilless - how would you differentiate between them?
Recoilless Rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoilless_rifle
for more info
What role would the RR fill?
The weapons are based off TT ones (mostly) which are based on fulfilling particular roles in a rock-paper-scissors wargame, each of which has an effective prefered target that it is meant to counter.
There is already a long-range, 1 RoF, high-damage, medium Pen heavy weapon with an anti-medium-vehicle focus..What does the RR do that the Lascannon doesn't already do?
Edited by bogi_khaosaThere is already a long-range, 1 RoF, high-damage, medium Pen heavy weapon with an anti-medium-vehicle focus..What does the RR do that the Lascannon doesn't already do?
Probably lighter?
But yeah, lascannon.
http://www.robertsarmory.com/rrifle.jpg
Recoilless Rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoilless_rifle for more info
Yeah, that.. that doesn't remotely answer my question.
I actually think the Lascannon should have the "accurate" quality!
I'm game.
Just give everything the Accurate Quality.
No don't. It's there (in its full-fledged Basic Weapons form) for a specific purpose -- to allow sniper weapons to function, to get one-shot kills without having the base damage be very high.
EDIT: or do you just mean give them an extra +10 with an Aim action, not the extra damage?
Edited by bogi_khaosaEDIT: or do you just mean give them an extra +10 with an Aim action, not the extra damage?
That's what it would do, really, since lascannons are Heavy
Just give everything the Accurate Quality.
No don't. It's there (in its full-fledged Basic Weapons form) for a specific purpose -- to allow sniper weapons to function, to get one-shot kills without having the base damage be very high.
EDIT: or do you just mean give them an extra +10 with an Aim action, not the extra damage?
Could go either way. The Idea would be for a Lascannon to be able to reliably disable a Tank like it can in TT. In that role it's still not guaranteed WITH the damage bonus!
EDIT: or do you just mean give them an extra +10 with an Aim action, not the extra damage?
That's what it would do, really, since lascannons are Heavy
IIRC, Hammer of the Emperor gives us a way to have an Accurate Lascannon (or Autocannon) and a way to get the damage bonus out of it like it's a Basic weapon.
Is it not as reliable as in TT? As fas as i know the Lascannon has S9 and needs a 5+ to crack a Leman Russ from the front, and mostly a 4+ from the side. A 5d10+10 Weapon has about the same chance to do that in OW.
Is it not as reliable as in TT? As fas as i know the Lascannon has S9 and needs a 5+ to crack a Leman Russ from the front, and mostly a 4+ from the side. A 5d10+10 Weapon has about the same chance to do that in OW.
Nothing is as reliable as in TT.
The time scale is shorter in the RPGs also I think.
We could also change its range to match TT too.
Actually the real point is weapon roles (leaving outside that an RR should not do more damage than a lascannon -- it would be a Tau railgun in that case). The weapons have particular purposes that they are intended for and that they excel at (which carries over from the wargame and its rock/paper/scissors design philosophy) while being inferior against other targets..
For instance
bolters and lasguns are anti-light infantry
plasma is anti-heavy infantry
melta is anti-heavy vehicle
lascannon is anti-medium vehicle
autocannon anti-light vehicle
missile launcher is odd because its distinction is versatility -- it is either anti-light infantry or anti-medium vehicle
As a weapon's prefered targets move up the ladder from light to heavy, it acquires various disadvantages that make it inferior against lighter targets. Specifically, rate of fire goes down, making it less likely to hit and less able to affect large groups, as sometimes does range (as with melta, which is pretty much useless against anything except its prefered target).
With the lascannon we already have a high-range direct-fire non-burst-effect anti-medium-vehicle weapon with the disadvantage of low rate of fire. The RR would simply be the same as a lascannon, only with slightly different stats. It fills no role.
Edited by bogi_khaosaWe could also change its range to match TT too.
What, to 48 inches?! That's ... a novel idea
Nothing is as reliable as in TT.
The time scale is shorter in the RPGs also I think.
I rather get the feeling that a single round in the TT is represented as several rounds of combat in the RPG.
Thus eg. a lascannon should be less able to pop a tank in a single shot, because it should be able to pop the same number of tanks in the same timeframe, yes?
We could also change its range to match TT too.
What, to 48 inches?! That's ... a novel idea
Nothing is as reliable as in TT.
The time scale is shorter in the RPGs also I think.
I rather get the feeling that a single round in the TT is represented as several rounds of combat in the RPG.
Thus eg. a lascannon should be less able to pop a tank in a single shot, because it should be able to pop the same number of tanks in the same timeframe, yes?
I get this feeling too, but it's futile to translate TT into reality, because otherwise these people are slooooow
Yeah I don't get the idea that a lascannon is supposed to be able to destroy or cripple a Land Raider in one hit.
I would just like to point out in the argument for Lascannons that they might be heavy but compared to similar role weaponry you do not need to carry around boxes of ammo for it. The Lascannon (depending on the pattern) uses larger charge packs that hold a large number of shots and can be recharged, though it is heavy and complex it is lighter than lugging around boxes of ammo for something like an autocannon or large caliber AT weaponry. Also the Lascannon fires lasers which means it has no recoil.
Referencing about how a Lascannon probably wouldn't kill a LR in 1 shot, your probably right unless it is a very lucky shot. The Lascannon basically cuts a hole in the side of the vehicle (or through it depending on the armor). If it is able to pierce something like the fuel tank or ammo locker it is possible that it can cause a chain reaction in the vehicle. It has been established in the background that Las technology isn't as effective against Astartes armor and equivalent materials is that it's reflectivity allows the armor to absorb or reflect some of the beam (which makes sense when you look at some of the bright armor that many people in the WH40k universe wear). Since Las technology is so prevalent in the galaxy most forces look at it when designing armor and vehicles.
In short when fighting against Las weapons all guardsmen must be issued mirrors.
You know, in thinking of this, I have come to the conclusion that the weapons in the armoury are quite well balanced against each other.
Except for the multilaser, which is a heavy bolter, but better. And the heavy bolter, which is a heavy stubber, but better.*
*not quite: in TT the HS is a Defensive weapon (not translated into 40KRP), and if OW used Horde mechanics the varying RoF of the three weapons would have a greater effect.
Edited by bogi_khaosa