is it worth the points to put this on a B Wing?

If so what is the best arrangement for the ship?

Any help GREATLY APPRECIATED........

And here gentleman is the Preybird. It really should have been called The Bird Of Prey".

Yes. B-Wings make one of the best platforms for it, since the small base combined with Barrel Roll means you can use it really frequently.

I frequently play either:

Blue Sqaudron w/HLC (29)

or

Dagger Squadron, FCS, HLC (33)

But there are a ton of really good builds using any of the B-Wing pilots, HLC, and usually some systems upgrade.

I would say no. But I am not super in love with the B-wing. They are pretty expensive and only have 1 agility dice. Putting a HLC on them just makes them more of a target. If I do take B-wings (an I do sometimes) I prefer to put the the Fire Control System on them. At 2 points it is pretty cheap, and it give you free target locks. 3 attack dice with a free target lock is better IMO that 4 attack dice that can't crit.

3 attack dice with a free target lock is better IMO that 4 attack dice that can't crit.

I'm sure someone could do the math and show one way or another. But you do seem to be missing two things...

One the HLC can in fact crit, if you use something like a TL to reroll the dice, you can keep any crits you score.

Two the HLC does 4 dice at range 2-3 and is a secondary weapon so the target doesn't get that extra defense die. I don't think there's any question that at range 3, 4 dice vs printed agi vs 3 dice at agi + 1 is a better deal. This of course requires that you stay at range 3, which is easier said then done.

That said, the HLC is not the only and perhaps even not the best use of the B-Wing, after this weekend I've become a huge fan of the AS upgrade. I read about it before and made a list with it, but this weekend was the first time I've really had the chance to use it.

First off, imo a naked B-Wing itself is a very good ship.

As for HLC's on them it depends on what ship you are using to upgrade and if you can add them on without costing yourself ships.

I have had some very good success using (2) Blue Squadron's each equipped with Heavy Laser Cannons plus (2) naked Rookie X-Wings. This list has been known as Blue Thunder. 100 points on the nose, PS2 across the board but you are flying 4 ships which is the key.

The advantage here is that you get 4 dice every time you attack with a B-Wing (HLC's at range 2 or 3 / Primary Weapon at range 1). As was stated they are a secondary weapon so at range 3 you not only do you get the bonus attack dice but your opponent doesn't get the bonus agility dice which is very nice and tends to happen frequently when I have used them.

The downside is that this particular build has a bad matchup with a similar list out there: Bloody Daggers. That list uses (2) Red Squadron X-Wings and (2) Dagger Squadron B-Wings each equipped w/ Advanced Sensors. This list is PS4 across the board which means that Bloody Daggers entire list gets to shoot before Blue Thunder and with concentrated fire you will quite possibly be down a ship before you shoot.

In the end I really like slapping an HLC on a Blue Squadron because at 29 points it's manageable with the rest of your build. I'm not keen on adding them to there costlier counterparts (generally speaking) because you will end up sticking too many points into a single ship.

As for Fire Control System, its good on a B-Wing but whenever I have used it I end up not being able to use it multiple times during a game because either my last target is now out of my arc or I prefer to attack a different ship. Situationally they can be fantastic but I normally don't get enough out of it and would prefer the additional point expenditure on the best B-Wing upgrade available: Advanced Sensors.

Advanced Sensors allows you to take an action BEFORE! moving. Barrel roll out of the way of an asteroid then fly yourself into perfect position. Take a focus or TL before you do a K-turn. It's hands down the best upgrade for that ship and I will use it almost every time instead of FCS.

In conclusion, HLC on a B-Wing = good but not excellent and depends on what you are doing with the rest of the list.

In conclusion, HLC on a B-Wing = good but not excellent and depends on what you are doing with the rest of the list.

Well put

The HLC like every other secondary weapon can be quite useful, but also requires that you plan on how to make it worth the points, and use it effectively. Often that can mean either other upgrades, given pilots or even other ships.

Be it a Proton Trop, Cluster Missile, Ion Turret or Heavy Laser Cannon... You can't just slap it on a ship and expect it to win you a fight, you have to have a plan for how to use it.

I say hell yes to HLC on b-wings, just maybe not Ten nunb, kinda conflicts with his ability. I often use a 3B squad with HLCs and I have really good results with it:

Blue squad + HLC + Sensor Jammer (33)

Blue squad + HLC + Sensor Jammer (33)

Blue squad + HLC + Sensor Jammer (33)

Sensor jammer makes sure your enemy takes focus every round, otherwise it substantially limits their damage output. Meanwhile you are rolling 12 attack dice every round as long as all your ships have a shot.

I would say no. But I am not super in love with the B-wing. They are pretty expensive and only have 1 agility dice. Putting a HLC on them just makes them more of a target. If I do take B-wings (an I do sometimes) I prefer to put the the Fire Control System on them. At 2 points it is pretty cheap, and it give you free target locks. 3 attack dice with a free target lock is better IMO that 4 attack dice that can't crit.

You and I are on total separate sides of the aisle then. I am a huge fan of the B.

Your argument that the "free" lock is better than the HLC is a bit of a red herring though, since you can have both if you so desire. I would argue that if you are choosing to not put the HLC on (due to points or otherwise), you are better losing the FCS for Advanced Sensors for 1 more point. That upgrade is so strong in general.

Also, you neglected to mention that the HLC denies the bonus dice when fired at range 3, which can be very significant when one is firing 4 dice.

I had a discussion just this weekend where we were debating if the B-Wing was pound-for-pound as good or better than the X-Wing for Rebels. And that's saying a lot since the X is a great mainstay for Rebels. There are so many good configurations for the B IMO, and that even assumes you decide to not just take it naked, which is very valid.

Comparing to the X-Wing, they cost 1 more point (names aside), have -1 Agility, +3 Shields, trade the astromech slot for Secondary Systems (which are better IMO), a cannon slot, AND an extra Torp slot, have a slightly weaker dial, and add barrel roll to their action bar.

That's pretty much a wash at worst imo. The named Xs are probably better than the named Bs in general, but the B is a great ship. They have similar survivability but the B can have much more tricks/firepower than the X for a very reasonable amount of points.

They have similar survivability but the B can have much more tricks/firepower than the X for a very reasonable amount of points.

I can't find it now, but I remember seeing something on TC I think that did the math and found that the B-Wing was generally a bit more survivable then the X-Wing. IIRC they found out that the B-Wing will survive on avg one more attack then the X-Wing will.

You and I are on total separate sides of the aisle then. I am a huge fan of the B.

I would say no. But I am not super in love with the B-wing. They are pretty expensive and only have 1 agility dice. Putting a HLC on them just makes them more of a target. If I do take B-wings (an I do sometimes) I prefer to put the the Fire Control System on them. At 2 points it is pretty cheap, and it give you free target locks. 3 attack dice with a free target lock is better IMO that 4 attack dice that can't crit.

Your argument that the "free" lock is better than the HLC is a bit of a red herring though, since you can have both if you so desire. I would argue that if you are choosing to not put the HLC on (due to points or otherwise), you are better losing the FCS for Advanced Sensors for 1 more point. That upgrade is so strong in general.

Also, you neglected to mention that the HLC denies the bonus dice when fired at range 3, which can be very significant when one is firing 4 dice.

I had a discussion just this weekend where we were debating if the B-Wing was pound-for-pound as good or better than the X-Wing for Rebels. And that's saying a lot since the X is a great mainstay for Rebels. There are so many good configurations for the B IMO, and that even assumes you decide to not just take it naked, which is very valid.

Comparing to the X-Wing, they cost 1 more point (names aside), have -1 Agility, +3 Shields, trade the astromech slot for Secondary Systems (which are better IMO), a cannon slot, AND an extra Torp slot, have a slightly weaker dial, and add barrel roll to their action bar.

That's pretty much a wash at worst imo. The named Xs are probably better than the named Bs in general, but the B is a great ship. They have similar survivability but the B can have much more tricks/firepower than the X for a very reasonable amount of points.

I agree that the B-wing is probably better than my feelings for it warrant, And I did oversimplify the HLC vs FCS. So I will clarify my position.

Actually the HLC is not that bad, but it performs best at range 3. An extra dice plus denying the extra agility is really where the HLC shines. Unfortunatly as I look at the B-Wing's dial and its ability to barrel roll (as well as my experience playing with it) the B-wing excels at close quarters dog fighting. The Short K-turn and the red hard-1 come in real handy in a close quarts fight. I'm not actually sure what ship would be good at staying back at range 3, I think you could probably do it with a single ship flying way back from your other ships. (so a single B-wing keeping back would probably be an okay way to play it)

Yes you can put a HLC and a FCS on a B-wing, but then you are spending 9 points. making the cheapest B-wing 31 points, that is a lot for a pilot skill 2 ship with one agility. Anything that TIEs will be hitting consistently is likely to die really fast no matter how many HPs they have.

I am not say that there might not be better upgrades than the FCS, I haven't played with advanced sensors yet, but they sound awesome.

(Like I said I haven't tried it yet, but if I were to speculate) I would consider the best build for B-wings would be pretty naked, except for advanced sensors.

I would say that the B-Wing is arguably the best HLC platform, ignoring specific pilot abilities (Krassis, Jonus, and also ignoring Jan Ors who makes it better!). It is the second-cheapest option for it, by far the most mobile, the only one to come in at a small-base, the only option available to the Rebellion, and the only option to come with a Barrel-Roll on board. You can even crab-walk (a 1 maneuver with a barrel-roll back, turning into a 1/2 forward with a lateral slide) to improve the length of time you get to snipe at things from a distance.

The HLC is also an incredible upgrade in its own right, and is generally considered worth its cost.

HOWEVER: I do no think that the HLC is the best upgrade combo for the B-Wing!

I am personally in love with the "Hypermobile" B-Wing. This requires Advanced Sensors (3) and an Engine Upgrade (4). It's benefits include:

1. Having 10 different starting positions for every maneuver, including the red ones
2. Being able to change your angling and positioning prior to making your maneuver, allowing you to avoid collisions and obstacles
3. Never having to lose an action to stress or collision
4. Being able to position yourself consistently out-of-arc and/or in Range 1 of your opponents, for increased defense AND offense.
5. Movement-based shenanigans, like performing a boosted-bank before a koiogran, giving you an angled U-turn

In a game where positioning so often determines at whom you may shoot, and how hard you shoot them, the Hypermobile B-Wing is very difficult to top.

That being said, I am in absolute awe of how they designed the B-Wing's abilities. In Star Wars lore, the B-Wing is known as a superior long-range platform, but also as a monster at dogfighting. Fantasy Flight's given us the option to do both exceedingly viably!

Actually the HLC is not that bad, but it performs best at range 3. An extra dice plus denying the extra agility is really where the HLC shines. Unfortunatly as I look at the B-Wing's dial and its ability to barrel roll (as well as my experience playing with it) the B-wing excels at close quarters dog fighting. The Short K-turn and the red hard-1 come in real handy in a close quarts fight. I'm not actually sure what ship would be good at staying back at range 3.......

I don't want to nitpick your post here but felt some additional comments would be appropriate.

Are HLC's "best at range 3"? Sure. Just don't underestimate the strong benefit they give you at Range 2 as well. Adding HLC's allows you to roll 4 dice every time you attack.

If you have a strategy in mind where you are specifically trying to stay at Range 3 that's fine but in most cases unnecessary. Yes the B-Wing has only 1 agility dice and can be susceptible to multiple attackers throwing a lot of dice at it but it has enough hit points between Shields and Hull to stick around long enough to cause plenty of havoc.

Your goal with this setup is to do a lot of damage as quickly as possible. I find playing them aggressively to be a good strategy. Pick your target and pummel them. Granted you can move in slow initially to maximize those opening salvos at Range 3 but when that opportunity closes they are a great ship to be able to pounce on your opponent.

Something in this thread that I find off putting is someone saying the HLC can't do crits and is useless because of this. This is wrong. It can do crits. If you follow the turn order you will find that you roll the four red dice, (crit, focus, hit hit) you immediately change the crit to a hit because of the card text meeting that requirement. Your opponent has a chance to modify your dice, sensor jammer for example, so now let's say you have crit, focus, focus, hit. Now it is your turn to modify dice. You could use Marksmanship to get that crit, if you were on a shuttle or a firespray with a Merc copilot and met the requirements you could sneak out a hit, or you could use a target lock pick up your dice roll them and let that result stand.

I hope this clears that up.

Something in this thread that I find off putting is someone saying the HLC can't do crits and is useless because of this. This is wrong. It can do crits. If you follow the turn order you will find that you roll the four red dice, (crit, focus, hit hit) you immediately change the crit to a hit because of the card text meeting that requirement. Your opponent has a chance to modify your dice, sensor jammer for example, so now let's say you have crit, focus, focus, hit. Now it is your turn to modify dice. You could use Marksmanship to get that crit, if you were on a shuttle or a firespray with a Merc copilot and met the requirements you could sneak out a hit, or you could use a target lock pick up your dice roll them and let that result stand.

I hope this clears that up.

I'm tempted to run a mystical star bison with HLC and TWO merc copilots. At range 3, it would be... unpleasant to get hit by it.

Depends on what you're facing, too. Nothing likes getting hit with an HLC, but it is an absolute terror for agility 3, or agility 4 relying on stealth. Denying that range 3 bonus is brutal, and the odds of landing at least ONE hit on a PTL Saber trying to turtle up and protect stealth aren't bad at all, at which point things can go downhill for them quickly.

For me, in most squads, the cost isn't worth giving up the benefit of Advanced Sensors or the price of taking both (although as was said, I think Blues w/HLC and naked Rookies is a fun, pretty solid little squad), but it can also ruin your day pretty quick and is fun to take sometimes.