I've recently been contacted with a request for Dark Reign to create a forum for the active development of DH beta 1.0. I intend to oblige this request willingly and have created a seperate sub-forum for this intent on our boards at http://www.darkreign.org/forum/

If anyone would like to join our community and help build a continued iteration of DH Beta 1.0, I encourage you to join up. Dark Reign would love to host creative minds willing to forge an alternative to the current paradigm being worked on here on the FFG forums.

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I fully support this effort, I truly do, but I would like to advise all of you to be careful with this; I imagine that, if the stars are not in your favour, you can expect a Cease and Desist.

I wish you all the luck in the world, though, and if you do receive a Cease and Desist at any point, come talk to me and we'll talk about under-the-table ways of distribution and/or development.

Certainly not going to being doing anything to cross that legal quandar, just engaging in homebrew development. If any word comes from FFG (who may feel free to message me), I'll oblige of course. Too much of a supporter of this company to do otherwise.

I mean, otherwise I wouldn't run Dark Reign, I'd just make a bunch of torrents. XD lol

Certainly not going to being doing anything to cross that legal quandar, just engaging in homebrew development. If any word comes from FFG (who may feel free to message me), I'll oblige of course. Too much of a supporter of this company to do otherwise.

I mean, otherwise I wouldn't run Dark Reign, I'd just make a bunch of torrents. XD lol

I know, I know; but Games Workshop can be diiiiiiiicks.

I will support this.

If the hammer falls, and the homebrew work will be stopped, i will accept it. I will not cross the line to do illegal work

I've already been working on something like this myself actually. I stopped for a while to see if the new beta would be of any use, but it doesn't look like it will be.

Currently I've got a totally re-written wound system, and a whole armoury adjusted to work with that system. Might not be to most people's tastes because it **** with backwards compatibility pretty badly, but I'm sure we could at least exchange ideas.

I've already been working on something like this myself actually. I stopped for a while to see if the new beta would be of any use, but it doesn't look like it will be.

Currently I've got a totally re-written wound system, and a whole armoury adjusted to work with that system. Might not be to most people's tastes because it **** with backwards compatibility pretty badly, but I'm sure we could at least exchange ideas.

I do not think that the project will be limited by backward compatibility.

Well yeah, but the thing is with DH2e 1.0 as it was, most weapon statlines WERE backwards compatible in terms of damage ratings and the like. Under my system, they're really not, unless you like your lasgun blowing off limbs fairly often.

Anyway, I'll pastebin my more interesting ideas when I'm at home.

Well, i did develop a bit on the weapon/item status earlier.. I found the status thing "lost" in develop in beta 1.0.

Even my friend were surprised to see that "Best/good/poor" quality did nothing other than the difficulty in repairing and gather it.

TheBeanCounter would be correct. Tom, we'd welcome your input and material. =D

Well, i did develop a bit on the weapon/item status earlier.. I found the status thing "lost" in develop in beta 1.0.

Even my friend were surprised to see that "Best/good/poor" quality did nothing other than the difficulty in repairing and gather it.

This definitely struck me as unfinished and weird. Status is an interesting base mechanic, what with how it represents an item's state of repair as well as actual quality, but as it stands it's pointless because most equipment only really has two states; broken and not-broken.

I'd say it'd be worth adding in another level to the scale, and adding effects for each level. I wrote this up for armour a little while back.

The other thing needed would be more ways for items to degrade beyond being hit with power weapons. Maybe add in that tools degrade on a roll of 1-5 when they're used as part of a skill check? Armour could go down by one level when Pen exceeds the armour value.

@Tom Cruise

I did this work back in the beta 1.0 - it's a bit unfinished but i did desribe a bit more of the status of the equipment. You could always work out some benefits of some sort to the gear.

1 - Broken, need full repair, does not function.

2 - Badly, works but with a -30 to tests using this piece. Melee weapons like power and chain weapons will "jam" and stop working until fixed. A ranged weapon will have a larger % value for jamming.

3 - Lightly damaged, -10 to tests using this piece. Same as nr. 2, but with a lower risk.

4 - Normal durability, works fine.

5 - Works well, might be able to resist some damage before being reduced in durability.

6 - Works beyond normal.. Likely a "best craftmanship". This weapon requires a lot of damage before repair, except if directly hit by weapons with a pen of X (over 5 ex) or by other means.

7 - Likely some kind of relic or other unknown material, should rarely lose this quality. Always at "best craftmanship" or for other reasons.

Also did some work on the (un)sanctioned psyker part. You should be able to find it on page 1 or 2 on this forum

Well, i did develop a bit on the weapon/item status earlier.. I found the status thing "lost" in develop in beta 1.0.

Even my friend were surprised to see that "Best/good/poor" quality did nothing other than the difficulty in repairing and gather it.

This definitely struck me as unfinished and weird. Status is an interesting base mechanic, what with how it represents an item's state of repair as well as actual quality, but as it stands it's pointless because most equipment only really has two states; broken and not-broken.

I'd say it'd be worth adding in another level to the scale, and adding effects for each level. I wrote this up for armour a little while back.

0 (Wrecked): Reduce Armour value to one on all locations. Maximum agility while wearing the armour is halved (round up).

1 (Poor): Reduce Armour value by one on all locations (to a minimum of one), and reduce maximum agility by 10.

2 (Average): Armour behaves as usual.

3 (Good): Increase the Armour value of the armour on all locations by one point, and increase maximum agility by five.

4 (Best): Increase Armour value of the armour on the chest by two points, and all other locations by one. Maximum agility increases by ten.

The other thing needed would be more ways for items to degrade beyond being hit with power weapons. Maybe add in that tools degrade on a roll of 1-5 when they're used as part of a skill check? Armour could go down by one level when Pen exceeds the armour value.

@Tom Cruise

I did this work back in the beta 1.0 - it's a bit unfinished but i did desribe a bit more of the status of the equipment. You could always work out some benefits of some sort to the gear.

1 - Broken, need full repair, does not function.

2 - Badly, works but with a -30 to tests using this piece. Melee weapons like power and chain weapons will "jam" and stop working until fixed. A ranged weapon will have a larger % value for jamming.

3 - Lightly damaged, -10 to tests using this piece. Same as nr. 2, but with a lower risk.

4 - Normal durability, works fine.

5 - Works well, might be able to resist some damage before being reduced in durability.

6 - Works beyond normal.. Likely a "best craftmanship". This weapon requires a lot of damage before repair, except if directly hit by weapons with a pen of X (over 5 ex) or by other means.

7 - Likely some kind of relic or other unknown material, should rarely lose this quality. Always at "best craftmanship" or for other reasons.

Also did some work on the (un)sanctioned psyker part. You should be able to find it on page 1 or 2 on this forum

I really like these ideas - what if a "gun jam" reduced quality by one on a scale from 1-10ish? Each level of the scale has different game implications, and "repairing" your gear can increase its quality by a certain amount.

I've always found it kinda silly that acolytes can run around with the same equipment they have had for years, decades even, without having to do any maintenance whatsoever.

I can, however, see this becoming an anti-fun mechanic ("YOU FOR GOT TO SAY YOU REPAIRED YOUR ****! SUCKS TO BE YOU!"), but I think if handled appropriately it could be very cool.

Might also be a good way to make "crafting" skills relevant.

...what if a "gun jam" reduced quality by one on a scale from 1-10ish? Each level of the scale has different game implications, and "repairing" your gear can increase its quality by a certain amount.

I've always found it kinda silly that acolytes can run around with the same equipment they have had for years, decades even, without having to do any maintenance whatsoever.

Might also be a good way to make "crafting" skills relevant.

Where's my muse...? I know I left it here, somewhere.

Of course this is just for homebrew.

A solution for those who wanna go with the first draft (which still is kind of official).

Just another Update 1.4, which makes it more playable.

Hey guys. I just tried to figure out some stuff on the health damage/damage table system.

This idea strucked me just for a few moments back. I saw some posts about making "tough (n)pc's scale" with the damage tables, which will lead to orks, marines ect, feel strong and tough as they are.

I will try to explain at my best:

Whenever you get struck by a hit, you will figure out how "deadly" it is.

When you get wounded, if the shot/strike deals more damage than your toughness bonus (after armour and toughness reduction) it will give an "additional effect". This "additional effect" is like the known in the old beta, being +5/+10 (we can try and modify this).

There will be some "stages" of this wound.

1. If the wound pass your toughness bonus once, it's a light wound.
2. If the wound pass your toughness bonus twice, it's a heavy wound.
3. If the wound pass your toughness bonus trippled, it's a grevious wound (correctly noted?).

4. If the wound pass your toughness bonus quadrupled, it's a mortal wound.

Every time you pass the toughness bonus, it gives a bonus on the damage table (+5/+10/+15/+20).
Let me try to describe a situation:

Guardsman Timmy is running away from the Slugga Ork.

The ork is right behind him and tries to stop him with his axe.

The ork hits him in the leg, dealing a whole 15 damage on Timmy.

Timmy is lucky, cause he wears his flak armour. Timmy has a toughness of 43, giving him 4 TB.

He reduce the damage by 4 from his toughness, and 4 from his armour, making it 8. He will get 7 points of damage on the table.

We will then calculate how bad his leg is.

The table says, he get's a 7 on the table. BUT the hit did pass his toughness once ( 7 / 4 = 1,75 times ), which means we will had a +5 modifier to his wound, making at whole 12 on the table.

His Sergeant Hannuk is far more unlucky, being hit by a Zzap gun right in the chest.

Hannuk is a hardened sergeant, having a whole toughness of 51, a TB of 5.

The hit by the Zzap gun dealt a whole 26 points of damage, with a penetration of 6.

Hannuk is very unlucky, his armour is not going to protect him from the detructive blow.

Calculated, Hannuk does only reduce the 26 damage to 21.

He will normally be on the table with the result of 21, BUT because of the wound were so destructive, it passed his toughness by 4 times ( 21 / 5 = 4,25 times ), giving the shot mortal wound, which increases the the tables result to 41 (21 + 20 bonus modifier) and kills Hannuk right out.

I hope you understand how my system works

Oh, by the way, this is the wound system I mentioned. It refers to Only War crit tables, so I guess the new beta ones would also work fine.

• Toughness does not reduce damage. Armour acts as usual.
• Each character has 6 hit points. Upon losing all six, the character passes out. Any wounds received while the character is passed out in this manner cause instant death.
• Righteous Fury upgrades the severity of the wound dealt by one level. Fatigue becomes a Minor Wound, a Minor Wound becomes a Major Wound, etc. If the attack did not manage to break through the target's armour, a point of fatigue is dealt.

The following effects refer to the amount of damage dealt AFTER Armour and AP calculations.

Damage equal to or below Toughness Bonus

Take 1 fatigue damage.

Damage exceeding Toughness Bonus.

Take a Minor Wound. One Hit Point lost, and roll 1d5-1 (minimum of one) on the appropriate critical effects table.

Damage exceeding Toughness Bonus multiplied by two.

Take a Major Wound. Two Hit Points lost, and roll 1d5+2 on the appropriate critical effects table.

Damage exceeding Toughness Bonus mutliplied by three.

Take a Greivous Wound. Three Hit Points lost. Character gains Lost Leg, Lost Arm, Lost Eye, Lost Hearing or Lost Organ depending on location damaged.

Damage exceeding Toughness Bonus multiplied by four.

The character is instantly killed.

I will just say another thing. I don't know if the old beta were like this, but i were thinking this way:

Every time you get strucked by something, and you will take damage on the table, register where-ever the hit felt.

If another body got struck, note it down, the amount of damage it took.

So you would basicly have 3-5(7 if take for each arm/leg) different levels of damage all over the body, but you will survive for a bit longer. This will only count for pc's (and maybe elite+masters).

Of course, this will require your players to write a bit more, but they will atleast have the feeling of body parts getting worse, than the just 1-2 areas hit a few times and suddenly dead.

I can give a better explaination, if wanted

I definitely get what you mean, but I find it's not worth the extra book keeping. DH is pretty bad with book keeping as is, really.

I definitely get what you mean, but I find it's not worth the extra book keeping. DH is pretty bad with book keeping as is, really.

I understand your point. What about the earlier wall of words ?

This is what I did, though I had but 6 layers of Quality. The problem I'm still working through is a consistent and (relatively) simple trigger for reducing melee weapon Quality. Jams works fine, but you have advanced-tech weaponry that may be less inclined to "jam", so which weapons get the 91+ and which get the 96+? Are normal swords 91+ and power swords 96+? Where, then, is the chainsword, or the shock maul? And that's before you consider a weapon's Quality into the equation. Which means the system I had worked out for ranged weapons needs work...and I'm currently stumped on it.

Where's my muse...? I know I left it here, somewhere.

Could always make it like psychers.... roll doubles and a tooth from your chainsword breaks off, etc.

This is what I did, though I had but 6 layers of Quality. The problem I'm still working through is a consistent and (relatively) simple trigger for reducing melee weapon Quality. Jams works fine, but you have advanced-tech weaponry that may be less inclined to "jam", so which weapons get the 91+ and which get the 96+? Are normal swords 91+ and power swords 96+? Where, then, is the chainsword, or the shock maul? And that's before you consider a weapon's Quality into the equation. Which means the system I had worked out for ranged weapons needs work...and I'm currently stumped on it.

Where's my muse...? I know I left it here, somewhere.

Could always make it like psychers.... roll doubles and a tooth from your chainsword breaks off, etc.

That is also a way to work it out.