I seem to remember a list like this on the old boards, back when the idea of a Martell expansion was but a fond dream...

But now that it seems more like a probability, I'm curious as to which cards you'd like to see return. What are the house-defining cards Martell can't live without? Which cards are needed to make Martell's best or most beloved mechanics make a comeback or be viable?

well. the question, i think, gets answered more on play style then it does on what martell did/does well.

They had the ability more then any other house to be rock, paper, or scissors. I don't think they have enough room in the expansions to make them that chemleon-esq in lcg right now.

What i would like is to see some more summer, they have some summer synergy but nothing that really blows my mind and this from a house that has used the desert to remain Unbowed, Unbent, and Unbroken!

For control elements i wouldn't mind seeing The Scourge comeback (and NOT broken arm) I also wouldn't mind seeing Desert Stocks, but at a cheaper cost. Chronicler at the Tor would be a good one as well (especially to allow you to use A. Dayne/nuetrals).

As for a character base I think the following would be ok to pick from (*denotes should add, if summer to the text box):

Harmen Uller* A Song of Night

Darkstar 5kings (or Legacy Pack Reveal star w/ *)

Areo Hotah ITE (with as much win by 4STR as there is right now)

Arianne Martell [lower the cost by 1 w/ *]Crown of Suns

Champion of Starfall A Tourney of Swords

The Red Viper Valyrian Edition

Nymeria Sand Valyrian Edition

Ellaria Sand Valyrian Edition

Host of Sunspear Crown of Suns

House Dayne Knight Crown of Suns

Knight of Starfall Valyrian Edition

Oberyn's Spears Valyrian Edition

Septon of Dorne* Valyrion Edition

I'd like to see Harmen Uller reprinted, and with a Noble crest.

Song of Twilight Darkstar. This is still the best Darkstar ever. Now imagine him with the War crest and Dawn.

Five Kings Red Viper. With the game's semi-emphasis on melee, this is one of the best melee cards of all time. It's the Martell Greatjon.

I'd like to see an all new Arianne Martell, not a reprint. And new version of the Sand Snakes, with some sort of synergy between them.

I doubt that we'll see Martell copy effects, so with that in mind I'd like to see them return to Icon Manipulation. Bring back Student of Subtelty, Orphan of the Greenblood(?) and a few other cards that worked off of icon manip. We don't need to see Broken Arm come back, but I could see something similar where you pay either gold or influence to remove (or add?) an icon to a character.

Why no copy effects? I love copy effects!

Host of Sunspear is exactly the card we need right now. There are just too many saves out there!

Also I liked the old Revenge - Copy effects..you know the balanced (or weak) ones, ike Ghaston Grey.

Cancels would be good - Viper's Bite would be great.

Drawstar for sure, Myrcella for sure....

VED Viper sounds right, though I like the 5K one as well.

Not a huge fan of the House - those are the obvious needs. The strength of this House has never been its charcter base (with one infamous exception) it has always been mroe baut effects and sicne we don't wnat too much reveal back, I suggest cancels.

Thougyh icon manipulation will probably get some play as well. sigh. i guess I can live with Broken Arm - but i better never see Scorpion's Sting or its like again.

I always liked Dornish Law. I think I've only pulled it off to great effect once, but its still a great idea, and a card with great potential.

They need to bring back/keep the Revenge theme going (Cards like Nymeria Sand's Entourage).

Also, I know people hate it, but Locked in the Tower needs to come back. They can offset any NPE, by not reprinting the ITE Arianne. I'd reprint the ACoS Arianne, just add the noble Crest - that will also fit in with claim raising/the LCG Areo Hotah.

They should also focus on the Learned crest in this House. I would suggest that whichever version of the Viper they reprint, they give him the Learned crest - not the Noble crest (reserve the Noble crest for Doran, Arianne, and Quentyn)

You know what needs to come back if the game is to survive?

You Murdered Her Children.

Kennon said:

On a related note, at what point did The Red Viper change from looking like an African tribal warrior to the white man seen in ITE and 5KE? Does GRRM ever say what his skin color is? I think I prefer the African tribal warrior look for the desert folk.

Kennon said:

Your goading me on purpose.

Its like waving Lorch at madkasel was, back in the day.

That was one of the worst conceived cards to ever slip past R&D - and that it never got banned or errate'd galls me to this day - years after rotation solved the problem.

jmccarthy said:

I've always seen the Dornish as closer to Mediteranian or Middle Eastern types, while the summer islanders (Jalabar, Chataya, the crew of the Cinnamon Wind) were African-ish. I don't really have the 5KE version in front of me, but in my mind I see him as darker (but not dark) skinned. Perhaps that's why I prefer the WED to present versions of the Red Viper over the earlier ones.

JerusalemJones said:

Yeah, that was always my impression too. Dorne to me has always been largely a greco-roman inspired civilization, which touches of desert arabian/middle eastern influence. So dark and olive skinned people are what I always envisioned. But not to the degree of "African tribal warriors" and the likes of Jhabalar, et al.

I think the 5KE artwork by Henning Ludvigsen is an almost perfect rendition of Oberyn as I would envision him. Maybe a touch more olive skinned, but otherwise spot on.

Weren't there three different kinds of Dornishmen all with different skin tone/ hair color/ eye color? Sandy, Stony and Salty if I recall. Though I don't recall what kind the Martells themselves were.

And I actually really liked YMHC, Stags, but I was joking there. Still, it almost lead me to a win versus the Circle of Spies.

Well, here's a card on my 'wish list':

... ...

I'd rather see Henning Ludwigsen's artwork if we get a reprinted/updated version of anything though. It's my personal favorite as I mentioned earlier.

This is an update of the Winter Edition version obviously. Ditched the Doomed, made his ability season specific and once per phase to tone it down a little bit. Even without the ability 4G for a 4 strength tricon with Renown and a Noble crest is awesome.

YMHC was brutal... it was also one of the few revenge effects that actually put you ahead of your opponent. Which of course has always been my biggest problem with the revenge mechanic, I have to lose a challenge to activate it, but my effects are 60% of what the other Houses abilities are regarding effectiveness, efficiancy, and card advantage. If I have to lose a challenge to get it to go off it should hit you as hard as that lost challenge hit me, with a couple of cards that are even worse.

Revenge effects should punish your opponent, not just be a slight inconvenience.

dormouse said:

Very true. Where's the lose a challenge/revenge effect akin to Lannister Pays His Debts+ for Martell? That's what I think we need.

I agree here as well. If revenege effects triggered at say a two for one rate - they would be mcuh more imapctful and i woudl be Ok with that in principle. A calculus of "I lose a card, you lose two" would be fine for me given that there were sufficient cancels and that strong tactical play could overcome it.

My issue with YMHV was always the deck search effect. I detest the idea of my opponent so easily being abel to see the whoel of my staregic approach, the potetnial to break any combos set up and the possibility of stalling. I didn't liek Jester's Cap in MtG and I will nevber like this card.