Would you go torpedo or concusion or mix ?

I think torps are better if you plan to fire them w/o focus, since they may produce a crit. With focus concussions are better.

So it depents on how you going to use them.

Thx

I'm going to necro this old thread because I'm going to run what I like to call "Jonus and friends" tomorrow.

Jonus, PTL, Assault Missiles

Scimitar Clusters

Tempest (adv) Clusters

Obsidian

Academy

It's got 5 ships, which I like, a decent punch up front, and uses the advanced. Wish me luck.

Necro? You sound like the last reply was been a year ... ^^

Well - good luck with THIS squad. Looks like you'll need it

lol. you don't like the list? lol. We'll see!

Well, I won. I played an XYBA with HLC on the B and some other stuff. I got all my ordinance off. It ended up being Jonus and the Adv versus the B and he conceded. Great match.

He thought the adv played very well. I'm a little mixed whether a bomber would be better. I think I need higher pilot skills too.

Well, I won. I played an XYBA with HLC on the B and some other stuff. I got all my ordinance off. It ended up being Jonus and the Adv versus the B and he conceded. Great match.

He thought the adv played very well. I'm a little mixed whether a bomber would be better. I think I need higher pilot skills too.

so what list did u go with?

I went with Jonus and Friends a few posts above

thx for the feedback

I went with Jonus and Friends a few posts above

nice, well done.

Yeah. It went well. He actually wasn't attacking the advanced because of the extra evasion and the shields which mitigate crit. However, the advanced did pay for that with a few extra points.

I really think that 5 ships helped a lot. The ties were a really big help in either creating targets away from the bombers, or plinking off damage. I'm not a huge fan of 3-4 ship builds.

I am so glad this thread is here. An online store had a special on Tie Bombers on Christmas day...... and I bought 4. Just got them in and a lot of very good ideas in here.

I'm dying to try this out once I get my hands on a few more bombers.

I ran that same Jonus, Adv, Bomber, 2 Tie setup today against a decked out Han and Tenn Nub. We're mid fight and it fared ok. The adv got blown up with its payload still onboard which sucks. I'm certainly not married to that list.

I went with:

Jonus + Proton Torp + Swarm Tactics

3 x Gamma + Proton Torp + Seismic Bomb

It worked out so far. The Alpha Strike is really strong. I only lost the final battle, while my opponent had a single A-Wing left with 1 hp left. So this really was a close one.

The Seismic Bombs performed crappy. In average I was able to make a single hit a battle ... and I managed hit my own bombers 2 times, so maybe take 1 cluster missles instead and stick a lonely Seismic on Jonus.

You may drop WE and SL and go like this:

Concussions instead of Protons, because if you have already a lock on your target (thats Jendon's job) and you are able to focus, you got better chances to score 4 hits.

A Problem you will encounter is to fly 3 Bombers in close formation with a shuttle.

I am not sold of Jendon because of his somewhat limited range 1 for his ability. The Hawks' abilities work up to range 3.

So at least Jendon should get a range 2 like Yorr.

I think the difficulty I've had when running the shuttle is that if I just get st321, then it'll pass out target locks and then not do a whole lot. I get once run and then can't turn around. Any 90 degree turn is red, so it's a disaster. You need other upgrades to make it viable at all in regular combat, and even then it's questionable. So it's a very expensive target lock imo.

I am amazed that nobody has yet suggested this for 100 points. I might have posted it in the A-Wing thread a while back. At a minimum, this squad should be able to kill at least 1 ship in the first round, and another ship in the second round. Then you mop up whatever is left with your bombers.

Jonus

Gamma + 2x Proton Torpedoes x3

No action stacking needed, just get a Target Lock and fire. Get 2 free rerolls on each torpedo. It is probably the best possible use of Jonus at 100 points, as long as you can keep him in the back so he stays alive for the 2nd round of firing.

That's two rounds of three attacks that will do an average of 3.3806 hits each attack. The exact hit distribution is:

Proton Torpedo with just Target Lock + 2 free rerolls = 3.3806 average hits

0 hits 1+ hit 2+ hits 3+ hits 4 hits

0.0244% 99.9756% 98.1445% 87.5977% 52.3438%

Concussion Missiles and Proton Torpedoes have the same exact hit distribution if you don't focus, so I used Torpedoes to get the chance for a crit (1 focus to crit) instead of a hit (1 blank to a hit). If you think you have a way of action stacking, and spreading your attacks over 3+ rounds, then you can throw some Concussion Missiles in there too, for example:

Jonus

Gamma + Proton Torpedo + Concussion Missile x3

In this case, shoot the Torpedoes when you only have TL, and shoot the Missiles when you also have a focus. I prefer the 1st list because I don't see how its practical to action stack with this list, but the Concussion Missile with Focus + Jonus reroll has the highest damage output in the game short of APT w/ focus + TL:

Proton Torpedo with just Target Lock = 2.6836 average hits

0 hits 1+ hit 2+ hits 3+ hits 4 hits

0.3906% 99.6094% 90.625% 59.375% 18.75%

So, lets compare the alpha strike of 4x bombers vs 3x bombers with Jonus rerolls. We get:

4*2.6836 = 10.7344

3*3.3806 = 10.1418

So 3 bombers supported by Jonus get almost as many hits as 4 bombers by themselves. But, you have to also remember:

1. When you factor in the defender's agility, the three bombers will actually do more average damage than the 4 bombers.
2. Those 3 bombers get TWO rounds of Torpedo strikes.
3. Jonus adds his attack as well (2 dice is worth 1.5 hits with a focus), so his attack is then bonus. You can even save his focus to use defensively and you're still ahead.

This list also has the the benefit of making it not obvious which ship of yours to attack. If they kill Jonus, then your average hits are:

3*2.6836 = 8.0508

If they kill a Gamma, then your hits are:

1*1.5 + 2*3.3806 = 8.26

Jonus will be in the back, so he will be a harder target. And if a PS1/2/3 ship kills Jonus, then the Gammas have already gotten their rerolls from him that round.

Finally, lets look at average hits with the defender's agility in mind:

0 agility 1 agility 2 agility 3 agility 4 agility

Concussion 2.6836 2.3101 1.9492 1.6126 1.3097

Concussion w/ 2 rerolls 3.3806 3.0057 2.6334 2.2682 1.918

Concussion w/ 2 rerolls + focus 3.918 3.543 3.168 2.7933 2.4203

And again if the defender has a focus token:

0 agility 1 agility 2 agility 3 agility 4 agility

Concussion 2.6836 2.0610 1.4736 0.9756 0.6017

Concussion w/ 2 rerolls 3.3806 2.7558 2.1381 1.5488 1.0337

Concussion w/ 2 rerolls + focus 3.918 3.293 2.6681 2.0443 1.4324

So, going back to our earlier comparison of 3 bombers supported by Jonus vs 4 bombers without Jonus, the average damage done against, say, 2 agility ships without focus is:

4*1.9492 = 7.7966

3*2.6334 + (Jonus attack) = 7.9001 + (Jonus attack)

So, even on the first round of attacks, the Jonus squad does more damage than the unsupported bombers. But the Jonus squad gets a 2nd round of attacks with Torpedoes.

I have nothing but respect for people that can do that kind of number magic. Interesting and very helpful.

Thanks. I wrote my own MATLAB scripts to do the calculations.

Yeah, that 4 bomber squad looks like a ton of fun, doesn't it.

Yeah, if I was running a 3-ship rebel build against it, I would be pretty terrified. Your best bet would be keeping Biggs out of the Gamma's TL range after they move, but then moving into their range and forcing them to take pot shots at you without missiles.

My problem with some of these bomber lists is that the initial moves are tricky when you have a PS of 4. you move into their upcoming range, but can't get target lock if they're higher than you because they move afterwards. Gets tricky.

I need 2 more bombers to pull this off. I have 1 more coming which will make 3, but I need that 4th to try this. I think a bomber group may be my future bread and butter. I love the boiling down of the strategy.

My problem with some of these bomber lists is that the initial moves are tricky when you have a PS of 4. you move into their upcoming range, but can't get target lock if they're higher than you because they move afterwards. Gets tricky.

I need 2 more bombers to pull this off. I have 1 more coming which will make 3, but I need that 4th to try this. I think a bomber group may be my future bread and butter. I love the boiling down of the strategy.

Yeah, the Pilot Skill bid to get to 4s rather than 2s is obviously meant to get better target lock positioning against the PS1/2 ships that are prevalent in the meta game, and possibly against PS4 ships. Against higher PS ships, it's a little trickier.

I'm going to try that 4 bomber list tonight on vassal to see what happens.

I've all but given up on the lamda with bomber lists. I just can't get any consistency out of them. I'd be more inclined to try a firespray frankly, but it looks like those new interceptors could be slick.