So Carnor Jax caused quite a splash when Imperial Aces was first announced and it seems like Kir Kanos has been somewhat pushed to the side. Personally, I think automatic damage is a big deal so I'm dying to find an optimal way to run Kir Kanos.

So far, I'm thinking giving him a stealth device and that is it. With the stealth device, you end up with an agility 4/5 ship that ALSO has an evade token. My thinking here is both that that would be incredibly hard to hit and that most opponents will probably decide to shoot another target altogether; this presents the opponent with a decision:

"Do I try to strip the evade token from Kir Kanos and likely do little to no damage or do I ignore him, take an automatic damage from his ability, and try to shoot something else?"

I think that is a difficult decision.

Also, at first glance this kind of build on Kir Kanos would lend itself well to a list full of unappealing targets like Dark Curse, a Bounty Hunter, or a Sensor Jammer Lambda but I'm thinking that it would be hilarious to run him with a Vader/Gunner Omicron Lambda for 3 automatic damage per turn; silly and suicidal I know but you can really cut through someone quick with that much additional, hidden damage.

Anyways, what are all of your thoughts on Kir Kanos?

What is his ability, again?

I thought he sounded great at first, but without the ability to take push the limit he seems kind of underwhelming now. Not that you can't fly an interceptor without PtL, but at 24 points you could also be flying a Saber pilot with PtL (or royal guard pilot for just 1 point more) so the comparison has to be made.

I am curious how the math works out on 3/4 dice w/focus vs with no focus but an extra "guaranteed" hit icon. With push the limit he could have been rolling 3/4 dice with focus and the extra hit, plus focus+evade could option select to both offense and defense as needed. I can see why perhaps they designed him with no EPT slot for this very reason, I'm just not sure yet if he will end up worth it against the other options at his point level.

If you really need the extra action, fly something like howlrunner with squad leader. She can give her action to Kir to focus and evade, and let him reroll 1 die. Could be a pretty heavy hitter that way

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If only there were a ship that passed out Evade tokens.
I mean, there's a ship that passes out the rest of them, so it's probably not far off.

If you really need the extra action, fly something like howlrunner with squad leader. She can give her action to Kir to focus and evade, and let him reroll 1 die. Could be a pretty heavy hitter that way

An interesting idea actually

Howlrunner with squad leader and Kir Kanos make an interesting pair. Not only do you get Kanos firing with focus+evade, he also gets the Howlrunner reroll. They also play off each other a bit by giving the opponent two initial targets to choose between.

Looking at it this way, it kind of makes him the first swarm-oriented interceptor pilot in the game.

Huh.. i thought he had an ept.. i guess i missed it earlier. anyways there are a few other pilots that would be so much better with an ept like biggs for example. kanos is getting overlooked because of carnors area of effect buff ability. personally kanos has a decent ability and i would only put a stealth on him as well. he is good but i wouldnt want to dump to many points on him. you could use carnor to fly right up to your oppenents ships and use kanos at range 2 or 3 to snipe. throw in some bombers with torps for good measure.

Way I see it, Kir Kanos' ability is slightly better than Expose.

A: You get the extra damage guaranteed
B: It's an action either way
C: You maintain your defensive dice
D: If you wind up not needing it for the attack, you still have a very good defensive option.

Now, adding the ability to Focus from an ally with Squad Leader throws the following into play:
A: Each attack die will go from a 50% shot of being a hit/crit to a 75%
B: Focus is better for defense than Evade when you're dealing with 4 or more evasion dice. Both together are better still.

Add Howlrunner, and you've just hit stupid-good territory. However, Howlrunner will get focused anyway, so preventing her action AND her Elite Pilot spot for a larger target on her back is possibly not the best use.

I would see if I could have a different ship be Squad Leader, but keep Howlrunner in the fleet. This second mystery-ship would boost Howlrunner's survivability and Kir Kanos' survivability/damage. If you use Darth Vader, he does both simultaneously.

Using Kir Kanos, Howlrunner, and Darth Vader with Squad Leader leaves you at 73 points. Two academy pilots later, and you have enough points to give one ship a Stealth Device.

The Final List:

Darth Vader

-Squad Leader

-Stealth Device

[34]

Kir Kanos

[24]

Howlrunner

[18]

Academy Pilot

[12]

Academy Pilot

[12]

You can always sack an Academy Pilot to give you 4 ships with more upgrades, but the more ships you have, the better Howlrunner is. You could also drop Vader in favor of Soontir Fel to buy 2 points elsewhere, probably Elusiveness on Howlrunner.

*Insert my usual question about whether Kir is worth 2 Academy Ties*

He's got the survivability of 1 Academy Tie, with the firepower of 2, and a significantly better pilot skill value. Considering he doesn't have to choose between making a defensive or offensive ability until the token(s) is(are) used, his survivability is considerably higher than a single Academy Tie. Factor in the occasional Boost out-of or into a firing range, and I'd say he's better. Barely.

I think he can be better. Auto damage is auto damage. How much damage do you get out of your 2 academy pilots usually? I bet it's somewhere between 6-8 before getting blown up and he'll definitely cover that and probably be around longer. PTL on him would have been great, for now we'll have to find a way to pair a viable squad leader with him, or fly him like an alpha who happens to have a higher PS and will almost always do an extra 2-3 damage a game. I think he's going to be like backstabber and mauler; sometimes they are way better than the standard ship, sometimes they get one shot.

If your only action is to make an Evade on a Range 2-3 attack, you've got:
1/8 chance of producing 4 hits/crits
3/8 chance of 3 hits/crits

3/8 chance of 2 hits/crits

1/8 chance of only the one hit.

That is to say, 7/8s of the time, you will match or surpass the best damage a regular Tie Fighter could hope to do.

At a Range 1 attack, you have
1/16 chance of producing 5 hits/crits
1/4 chance or producing 4 hits/crits

3/8 chance of producing 3 hits/crits

1/4 chance of producing 2 hits/crits
and 1/16 chance of only the one hit.

That is to say, 11/16ths of the time, you will match or surpass the best damage a regular Tie Fighter could hope to do.

WIth a Focus and No Evade at Range 2-3, you have

0/64 of producing 4 hits/crits
27/64 of producing 3 hits/crits

27/64 of producing 2 hits/crits
9/64 of producing 1 hit/crit
and 1/64 of producing no hits at all

With a Focus and No Evade at Range 1, you have

0/256 of producing 5 hits/crits

81/256 of producing 4 hits/crits
27/64 of producing 3 hits/crits

54/256 of producing 2 hits/crits

3/64 of producing 1 hit/crit

and 1/256 of producing no hits at all.


For both, just add 1 Hit to the Focused odds.
For a Howlrunner Re-roll, add 1/2 the difference between one tier and its lower neighbor for Evade, or 3/4 that difference for Focused. (E.G., for rolling 4 hits when Evading but not focusing, you have 1/8+(3/8-1/8)/2=1/4. For rolling 4 hits when Focusing at Range 1, you have 81/256+3(108/256-81/256)/4 =405/1024, which are also the odds for rolling 5 hits when Focused and Evading at Range 1)

He's comparing him to 2 Academy ties, not 1. There is no doubt he is better than 1, he's an interceptor!

Ah, but the true trick is that 4 damage from 1 attack will deal a lot more damage than 4 damage spread over 2, because you encounter half the resistance. It's the difference between Cluster Missiles and Advanced Proton Torpedoes, assuming you didn't have a focus token.

I still agree that he can be better but just how much better has more variables.

Deacon,he can't use his ability at range 1.

I've been thinking about a Kanos build and I had the idea for a silly squadron involving that suicide Lambda from the first post.

The "Who the heck do I shoot?!?" Squadron

Kir Kanos + Stealth - 27

Omicron + Gunner + Vader - 29

Howlrunner + Squad Leader + Stealth - 23

Alpha + Stealth - 21

This is pretty straightforward and not very well thought out but would be fun to play. The idea is to make the opponent have really no worthwhile targets. Shoot the TIEs? Good luck as that is 4/5 evade and usually with an action (Howlrunner is the exception and is something I'm not totally sold on) like focus or evade to make defense even stronger. Shoot the Lambda? Sure, okay.

My favorite part about that list is admittedly the suicide Lambda. "But a Lambda only gets one pass before being useless!" I only need one pass to destroy myself and bring the critical pain!

Well, too bad that for Squad leader you need a ship with higher pilot skill, or you would just throw in a Black Squadron for this...

A (relatively) cheap way to get squad leader for Kanos without using up Howlrunner's action would be Mauler Mithel. 17 points + 2 for squad leader.

Something like:

Kir Kanos — TIE Interceptor 24

"Howlrunner" — TIE Fighter 18

"Mauler Mithel" — TIE Fighter 17
Squad Leader 2

Academy Pilot — TIE Fighter 12

Academy Pilot — TIE Fighter 12

Academy Pilot — TIE Fighter 12

=97 points. A stealth device or push the limit on Howlrunner brings it to an even 100

Handing him an extra action would be nice but his pilot skill is just high enough. Until we get other options I just don't see that option as super viable:

Howlrunner wants to be with the swarm at range 1

Mauler wants to be in the mix at range 1

Soontir/ Turr don't want to be tied down to another ship

Vader... Not bad but expensive.

Maybe one of the unspoiled 181st pilots will give us something special at PS 7 and 8?

To be honest, I don't think Squad Leader on Howlrunner would be that bad of an option. Yes, she is likely to get shot. But every shot sent her way is a shot that could have been aimed at one of your even higher cost Interceptors. For 20 points, she will have the best defense to points value in your list, so you WANT her to be target number 1. Since her ability requires Range 1, she is already going to be in position to hand out Squad Leader. And finally, all of your Interceptors have a high enough PS that they can complete their shooting before your opponent fires off his generics and finishes off Howlrunner.

Not too bad.

To be honest, I don't think Squad Leader on Howlrunner would be that bad of an option. Yes, she is likely to get shot. But every shot sent her way is a shot that could have been aimed at one of your even higher cost Interceptors. For 20 points, she will have the best defense to points value in your list, so you WANT her to be target number 1. Since her ability requires Range 1, she is already going to be in position to hand out Squad Leader. And finally, all of your Interceptors have a high enough PS that they can complete their shooting before your opponent fires off his generics and finishes off Howlrunner.

Not too bad.

Yes, but when she uses the Squad Leader action, she drops her defensive capability to do so.

Yes, that is what I meant. All of your ships are going to be using their actions offensively, the only reason Howlrunner would be a better target is if her defense is lower than the others due to using her action. In the end, you would have an 18 point Howlrunner with no actions vs. Carnor Jax with a single evade token, Soontir Fel with an evade and a Focus, Turr Phennir with an Evade token, or a tokenless Kir Kanos. If my choice is Howlrunner or Kir Kanos, both with 3 agility and neither with a token, I will shoot Kir Kanos every time. Howlrunner needs to be the most attractive target, since she is the lowest priority ship. This is a different situation than when Howlrunner is surrounded by 12 point TIEs. In that situation she needs to have the highest defenses because she is the highest priority target.