Hello fellow X-wingers, Y-Wingers, B-wingers and most importantly A-Wingers

I am new to the forum but have been playing since the game came out.

I have been working on an all A Wing list, constantly tweaking, so much so I dont think I have touched an X or Y wing since the A's came out!

Here is my current list:

Rebel Faction 99 points

Arvil

Cluster Missiles

Veteran Instincts

Tycho

Cluster Missiles

Push the Limit

Prototype Pilot

Cluster Missiles

Prototype Pilot

No Upgrades

The following list last night wiped in 2 games both opponents with only 1 prototype pilot lost. I played against a Tie Fighter swarm, Slaver, Bombers and Interceptors and came out pretty darn good overall.

Been trying to perfect this list and constantly tweaking it (not twerking, please god no twerking comments!). I have gone with Swarm tactics, assualt missiles etc....and so far the clusters have been working the best.

Any comments would be greatly helpful

One small problem is Arvel has no Elite Pilot Slot.

Also, in this instance, I find Concussion Missiles the way to go, if you had the points Homing on Tycho.

Yeah Arvel isn't an Elite pilot, so it's hard to justify the points. You'd be better off taking another Green with PTL - you'd still come out a point ahead.

May I ask your views on those 2 missiles?

I have tried them, wasnt terribly impressed at first glance

In theory dropping Arvel and putting in a green could get missiles on all 4 ships then, if im number crunching and remembering off top of my head correctly

Englishpete beat me to it.

So without Veteran Instincts, you're at 98 points. That can make Tycho's missile a Homing Missile, and if you want to go all the way to 100 you can make the Prototype Pilot's missile a Homing Missile, too. I find that there just isn't a lot you can do to modify A-wings.

Maybe drop Arvel (CrookedWookie beat me to it) and get some Green Squadron Pilots in there. Maybe. I think Arvel has a place. He's a little awkward, but his pilot ability can sure come in handy. I might drop the missile on him, though since he'll be taking 3 Atk shots. You can use those 4 points to boost a Prototype to Green Squadron Pilot.

Tycho Celchu (Push the Limit, Homing Missiles) [34]

Arvel Crynyd [23]

Green Squadron Pilot (Push the Limit, Concussion Missiles) [26]

Prototype Pilot [17]

Green Rabid Monkey is right: you could get a missile on all 4 ships if you drop Arvel to Green and had no PtL on Green, but I like the idea of having two Push the Limit A-wings rather than 4 missiles.

And as you can probably tell, people here generally aren't fans of Cluster Missiles. But if you have success with them, then keep at it. I think Concussion Missiles are my favorite.

Here's the big problem(s) with Arvel.

As mentioned, no access to elite skills. That's bad for a 23pt, ps6 pilot, and it's not even his biggest sin.

His biggest sin is that his pilot skill is too high for his ability. If you crash him into somebody he can shoot, but not take an action - no focus, no target lock (that activation), etc. So ideally you want someone to crash into HIM, but with low PS ships being so popular right now you face a LOT of ps1-4 who have already moved, forcing him to ram into them, rather than getting in their way and making them hit him.

He can GO after higher PS targets, but they're more dangerous, fewer, farther between, and will get to shoot at him first. If he he was a low enough PS to block and prey on things like Academy Pilots he'd be money. If he had access to elite skills to bolster him, he might be worth the cost. As it is he's just slightly...awkward. It's really hard to make the most of his ability since you can't focus and target lock and park yourself where you know someone is likely to hit you.

You're basically just always better off taking a GSP with PTL and saving a point to bank elsewhere. And believe me, I really want to like Arvel, but he's just a bad investment. Maybe a future Aces expansion for the A-Wings will roll out some goodies to make him more useful but right now not so much.

Homing missiles are popular because they're aces against things like TIEs and Interceptors. They can't evade, and you don't spend the TL on the shot which means you can use it to reroll as needed. So with PTL (and we're right back to GSP over Arvel) you can focus, TL, shoot a homing missile, and focus AND reroll it to your little hearts' content. Explodey goodness.

Concussion missiles are popular because they guarantee you at least one hit (pre defense). You have to spend the TL, but again, with PTL you can focus, target lock, fire the missile, you've got 1 hit in 4 possible already locked down, and can convert any eyeballs. If you have any other means of rerolling (like Jonus, if you're Imperial), you don't need the TL as much anyway.

Cluster missiles are...just kind of there. Part of the problem is they have complicated interactions with things like Luke or Gunner. People are turned off by the poor wording of and explanation for the whole "make this attack twice" text, so I think that doesn't help them, either.

The big sin is while you get two attacks it's only range 1-2, for 4 dice. You have to spend a TL to use it, so no reroll there, and if you use a focus on the first attack, you're SOL if you roll a bunch of eyeballs on the SECOND attack. So between the fact that it's short ranged (the single biggest advantage of secondary weapons as a rule is they can hit you at range 3 and still deny you that extra defense die) and hard to boost, the damage is a lot less reliable than it is on any of the other missile types.

It sounds really nice, you might have luck with it, but it's all about playing the odds, and Cluster missiles are not a sound investment for the points. No guaranteed hit like Concussion. No saving your TL like Homing. No converting an eyeball to a crit free like a torpedo. They're a lot more meh in practice than they are on paper.

Really good A-Wing squad:

Greep Squadron pilot

Vet Instincts

Homing Missile

BAM!

Well, 4 of them. BAM

I much prefer PTL over Vet Instincts on the Greens, generally. VI has a very narrow range of ships it's going to give you PS advantage over - basically the PS4 ships it lets you leapfrog. And A-wings get a LOT of mileage out of being able to either TL and Focus or Evade and Focus in a pinch. Or Boost and whatever. They're one of the only ships with more green than any other color on their dial, so nobody is better at shaking stress than they are.

Well, 4 of them. BAM

Well swap VI for PTL and you can either put Stealth on all 4 of them, or put Concussion missiles on 3 of them for a nice Alpha strike - and then they've got much better utility and survival after that first missile strike thanks to PTL letting them double up on actions.

You're basically just always better off taking a GSP with PTL and saving a point to bank elsewhere. And believe me, I really want to like Arvel, but he's just a bad investment. Maybe a future Aces expansion for the A-Wings will roll out some goodies to make him more useful but right now not so much.

I feel the same way. i really want to like Arvel as well, but i find that once i launch the missile, running into people doesn't work out like i had intended it to. In the few games that i have been playing where i try to use him and a Y with an ION to keep getting people to run into him, i find that i'm the one running into them. Losing that action sucks, especially when the idea is to get them to crash into you first.

I also agree that not having an Elite Pilot Skill definitely hurts his cred even more. Here's hoping the Rebel Aces pack gives him some love.

If you could give an A-wing advanced Sensors (and hey - Aces will let ships take Target Lock, so there's nothing to say there won't be a card saying "Retrofit: This ship can now add one System Upgrade card" or something down the road) it would be awesome. Arvel could do a focus, or an evade (to avoid retaliatory fire from his target's wingmen), a target lock, THEN crash into whoever he wanted. But right now, he's sacrificing those.

He's the only pilot I've ever seen who would benefit if he had a card that DROPPED his pilot skill as he stands. Dude could prey on TIEs and things and be a blast while he lasted, but not having AdvS, not having elite pilot options, and having a higher PS than all of the stuff he would actually want to attack all just make for a really uneasy combination.

Which is entirely besides the fact that generally point blank range is the last place that an A-Wing wants to be (and again, losing an action by crashing, he has no way to try and mitigate that with Evade or Focus tokens).

Well, 4 of them. BAM

Well swap VI for PTL and you can either put Stealth on all 4 of them, or put Concussion missiles on 3 of them for a nice Alpha strike - and then they've got much better utility and survival after that first missile strike thanks to PTL letting them double up on actions.

I've tried it both ways. The intiial alpha from 4 homing missiles out weighs the reduction in performance of PTL from 4 A's with concussion missiles. Try it and see. The only thing I don't like about the PTL A-Wings are the restrictions on green maneuvers almost every turn, and if you aren't using PTL, the vet instincts is better anyways.

I can't count the number of times that I wanted to do a 1 turn with an A-Wing, but because of stress would have left me without actions. Just because PTL does really well on the A-Wings doesn't mean it is necessary.

I have used Aevel alot and usually its because i get tired of a Slaver eating my A Wings for lunch!

So basically i set him up to run into the slaver or get the slaver to run into me and blast the slaver while he cant be shot....if that makes any sense

Just because it's not necessary doesn't mean it's not generally better, either.

Obviously there's some personal preference there. I find that while missiles are nice they're also a bit (sorry) hit or miss. It may be a 4 point investment that does nothing. PTL is a 3 point investment that can and will get used multiple times a game.

Do you need to plan your maneuvers a bit more carefully? Sure - but in an A-wing you won't last long if you're not doing that to begin with. Without PTL, if you want to get the most out of even a homing missile you're going to need to get to range 3, target lock, get to range 2, focus and fire (unless you're somehow still at range 3 to the guy you target locked, in which case, bonus).

Now if you can do that, consistently, without overshooting or coming up short, awesome. But if you wind up at range 1 the missile is no good, and if you don't manage to squeeze in a focus because you have to take an evade or boost or something, you're leaving hits off the table. That's just a LOT of variables for a big point investment that may or may not land.

If you want to turtle an A-Wing up reliably (not counting Stealth) and get the most mileage out of it, NOTHING will beat simultaneously taking a Focus and an Evade. And if you do take Stealth over missiles with a GSP squad, nothing will help Stealth stay active longer than having a focus and an evade backing it up.

And I'm not knocking missiles - missiles are great - but there is one and only one way to stack the odds of survival in favor of the A-wing staying on the table long enough to justify its point cost: focus + evade every time you think you're going to get hit, target lock + focus every time you think you've got a clean shot.

I have used Aevel alot and usually its because i get tired of a Slaver eating my A Wings for lunch!

So basically i set him up to run into the slaver or get the slaver to run into me and blast the slaver while he cant be shot....if that makes any sense

I've seen this first hand...sort of. I was up against an opponent who kept ramming my Bounty Hunter with his Tycho because he kept forgetting it wasn't Arvel. If it had been Arvel that would have been 3 shots at 3 Atk that I would have had to dodge with my 2 Agi.

It's a valid strategy, but it's not one most people are comfortable with because of the loss of actions. However, it's so much easier hitting those big bases. Lambda's got an HLC? Close the gap as fast as you can and you're safe from fire. in that way it's almost better than Push the Limit Focus + Evade.

DIsclaimer, this is just theory work, and I'm not that good at this game, but it's something I've wanted to try a little more. Of course, I'm also the guy who like "Fel's Wrath" so maybe I just run a little different from the crowd.