My group uses a ton of house rules. Its gotten to the point that we've started building our own rulebook, as its too confusing to glance at the 2nd ed Beta 1, the 2nd ed Beta 2, the original, and the houserules. At this point its a blend of Eclipse Phase, Only War, Dark Heresy 2nd ed Beta 1 & 2, and some minor house-rule tweaks.

I am trying to participate in the beta process, and when it is over I will turn to house ruling. :-)

My group uses a ton of house rules. Its gotten to the point that we've started building our own rulebook, as its too confusing to glance at the 2nd ed Beta 1, the 2nd ed Beta 2, the original, and the houserules. At this point its a blend of Eclipse Phase, Only War, Dark Heresy 2nd ed Beta 1 & 2, and some minor house-rule tweaks.

This is basically what I'm doing too. Houserules documents get cumbersome when you're referencing about five different books.

Since this is the beta for Dark Heresy 2.0, shouldn't we use as few house rules as possible? The goal of the process is to find problems with and suggest changes to the new rules system, and I feel the use of house rules makes that much more difficult.

If your group has a particular house rule that they like, try sending the FFG dev team an email detailing the rule and your reasons for implementing it. They might just include it in a future update. Until then, try testing with just the beta rules and weapons.

Since this is the beta for Dark Heresy 2.0, shouldn't we use as few house rules as possible? The goal of the process is to find problems with and suggest changes to the new rules system, and I feel the use of house rules makes that much more difficult.

If your group has a particular house rule that they like, try sending the FFG dev team an email detailing the rule and your reasons for implementing it. They might just include it in a future update. Until then, try testing with just the beta rules and weapons.

I am trying to participate in the beta process, and when it is over I will turn to house ruling. :-)

These. If you're houseruling during the beta you're doing it wrong unless you can provide FFG a comprehensive explanation of why the system you change doesn't work and how your system does it better.

Been there, done that. It's where our house rules come from. However, the fixes weren't implemented so now we are just building the system we most enjoy playing. Only War is ok, nothing against it, but we like the changes we made to the first beta better.

These. If you're houseruling during the beta you're doing it wrong unless you can provide FFG a comprehensive explanation of why the system you change doesn't work and how your system does it better.

Fair point. I'm only doing what I'm doing because I'm more than confident FFG will not make a system I want to play from here on out. I have no idea why I'm even still posting here other than out of habit.

Fair point. I'm only doing what I'm doing because I'm more than confident FFG will not make a system I want to play from here on out. I have no idea why I'm even still posting here other than out of habit.

For what it's worth, Tom, I find much of your input very interesting, and I feel the forums would lose a valuable contributor of ideas were you to quit them.

Yes please don't go.

I have no intention of leaving, really. I mean, even if I don't use the system when it releases, at least my feedback might make it more useful for people who actually do. And anyway, this place is pretty **** great for hashing out potential house rule options, there's a lot of good ideas floating around.

Yeah - and somehow its like a big family here.

Including old grumpy uncle Gaunt

I have no intention of leaving, really. I mean, even if I don't use the system when it releases, at least my feedback might make it more useful for people who actually do. And anyway, this place is pretty **** great for hashing out potential house rule options, there's a lot of good ideas floating around.

Glad to hear it. We've already adopted your Homeworlds for Living 2.3 (with the minor modification that we've made Fate Threshold independent of Homeworlds), and our group is eagerly awaiting more stuff of yours we can steal

On the original topic: we're using a lot of houserules. It kind of started as an attempt to turn the obnoxious injury system of Living 2.3 into something fast and evocative that doesn't involve hit points or toughness soak. But then it kind of grew a little bit out of control.

Our Injury System is adapted from Inquisitor, and starting to work really well.

We've embraced Action Points, but increased the human baseline AP value to 5 and "unlocked" the value, so to speak.

We've brought back the Single-, Semi-, Full-Attack actions as a solution to the fairly thorny RoA issue in Living 2.3

We've introduced a damage modifier from Attack DoS in place of the "full damage per hit" mechanic that has been making all versions of the system screwy since day one.

We've drastically revised the Psychic Power rules into an even more Skill-like system, brought back minor powers (and turned Living 2.3's Psyniscience Skill into 3 Minors) and incorporated Sorcery, True Faith and Ritual magic.

We've revised the Untouchable Elite Advance, bringing it back in line with the DH1e version.

We've added a Personal History step to Character Creation.

We've revised Movement Rates for gridless miniature friendliness.

We've introduced a Weapon Range system that is simpler than 2.5b, but sacrifices very little diversity and, most importantly, works great with miniatures.

We've revised the Characteristics starting values and Advances and limits.

... And probably a bunch more things that escape me just now.

Obviously the entirety of this is very much WIP. Most has been minimally playtested, and exists only as a mechanical framework with a handful of statted up examples used for testing.