Captain Yorr's ability:

" When another friendly ship at Range 1-2 would receive a stress token, if you have 2 or fewer stress tokens, you may receive that token instead."

Opportunist (from upcoming Imperial Aces expansion)

" When attacking, if the defender does not have any focus or evade tokens, you may receive 1 stress token to roll 1 additional attack die.

You cannot use this ability if you have any stress tokens."

So say I have a Black Squadron Pilot with Opportunist within range 2 of an unstressed Captain Yorr, attacking a target at range 2 with no focus or evade tokens. Can I add 4 attack dice to my roll for a total of 6 dice (putting 3 stress on Yorr and 1 on the BSP)? I realise that there is very limited scope for this interaction to be this effective, but that seems to be pretty nice payoff. If it was a Saber Squadron Pilot at range 1 I would need to borrow some more red dice!

The BSP has a normal Primary Weapon Value = 2 at Range 2 so using Yorr once would grant you 1 extra dice and you would get another from Opportunist for a total of 4 dices, but I certainly would say that that would be the end.

I guess you were "planning" or rather asking if you could do the "Yorr procedure" 3 times, but that would be a definitive NO in my book.

Why would it be a no? Opportunist does not say that it can be used once per turn. The only check that stops you using Opportunist is if you have a stress token. If Yorr keeps taking the stress token then you can keep adding dice...

Possibly so, and of cours Yorr would only be able to do it once in the next round, but still it doesn't feel/sound "kosher" to me

There are no abilities that can be used multiple times in a single pass. From the rulebook re:range, at range 1 you are supposed to add one attack die. Does that mean you can keep performing that procedure until you have 100 dice? No. Soontir Fel gains a focus when he gets a stress token. Does that mean he can use that ability multiple times every time he gets a stress token? No. Opportunist says you may gain an attack die when attacking. Does that mean you can get multiple dice per attack? No.

KO has it. When an ability has a conditional trigger, that ability can be used once for each occurrence of the trigger. If you were to put Opportunist on a ship with a Gunner, Yorr could pull the stress to let you use it on both attacks... but you still could only use it once per attack, because that's your conditional: "When attacking if the defender has no focus or evade tokens."

There are no abilities that can be used multiple times in a single pass.

KO is right,

X-Wing is filled with rules and ablities that are one per turn. In fact there's bascialy nothing in this game that lets you preform the same action twice. The closest is Gunner/Luke which lets you preform a 2nd attack, but that's clearly spelled out on the card.

Between the wording of the card "1 Stress to gain 1 die" not "Gain 1 die per stress" and the can't preform the same action twice rule, I'd say you can't really do what you were thinking.

X-Wing is filled with rules and ablities that are one per turn. In fact there's bascialy nothing in this game that lets you preform the same action twice. The closest is Gunner/Luke which lets you preform a 2nd attack, but that's clearly spelled out on the card.

And Cluster Missiles... let's not forget Cluster Missiles...

We're never allowed to forget Cluster Missiles.

<curls up in a corner and whimpers>

Yeah!!! I was keeping out of this one because I didn't want to upset the apple cart with my opinions. But I am glad we agree on this one.

There are no abilities that can be used multiple times in a single pass.

KO is right,

X-Wing is filled with rules and ablities that are one per turn. In fact there's bascialy nothing in this game that lets you preform the same action twice. The closest is Gunner/Luke which lets you preform a 2nd attack, but that's clearly spelled out on the card.

Between the wording of the card "1 Stress to gain 1 die" not "Gain 1 die per stress" and the can't preform the same action twice rule, I'd say you can't really do what you were thinking.

I disagree. There is a ton of precedent for the use of abilities multiple times in that they are very carefully worded to not be used more than once. Abilities give stress, or can only be used when using a green manuever, or when revealing a dial. This one is different. Push The Limit says once per round, clearly implying it is not once per round unless explicitly stated otherwise. So I would say yes, you can use this effect twice if you avoid the stress from the first, in much the same way the rules allow for(despite the fact there is not current way to do so) using multiple evade tokens on a single attack.

Remember that this card is not an action. Actions are on the action bar and also explicitly stated to be once per round.

This one actually reminds me of a more convoluted version of Jan Ors.

I'm surprised so many people are thrown by this - or I guess maybe it's more that, to borrow Buhalin's turn of phrase, it's RAF (Rules as Fantasized), where people try to take a clear ability and twist it to the illogical extreme.

I think the thing a lot of people don't get, or don't want to get is that the phrase "receive 1 stress token to roll 1 additional attack die" or "receive 1 stress token to allow that ship to roll 1 additional attack die," those aren't just handy suggestions - those are also hard and fast limits. There are a hundred ways they could have phrased those to allow for them being used over and over and over again on a single turn.

They don't. You are allowed to receive 1, only 1, and exactly 1, stress token to roll (or grant, in Jan's case) 1, only 1, and no more than 1, additional attack die. They didn't slip that 1 in there by mistake - that's the hard limit to how those abilities can be used, unless something clearly and directly overrides that.

If I tell you "sure, go ahead and have a slice" of my pizza, I am going to punch you if you try and use the logic "he said I could have a slice. There are sixteen slices. I am not walking off with his pizza, I am simply taking ONE slice, SIXTEEN times." No - A. One. Uno. Single.

There are no abilities that can be used multiple times in a single pass.

KO is right,

X-Wing is filled with rules and ablities that are one per turn. In fact there's bascialy nothing in this game that lets you preform the same action twice. The closest is Gunner/Luke which lets you preform a 2nd attack, but that's clearly spelled out on the card.

Between the wording of the card "1 Stress to gain 1 die" not "Gain 1 die per stress" and the can't preform the same action twice rule, I'd say you can't really do what you were thinking.

I disagree. There is a ton of precedent for the use of abilities multiple times in that they are very carefully worded to not be used more than once. Abilities give stress, or can only be used when using a green manuever, or when revealing a dial. This one is different. Push The Limit says once per round, clearly implying it is not once per round unless explicitly stated otherwise. So I would say yes, you can use this effect twice if you avoid the stress from the first, in much the same way the rules allow for(despite the fact there is not current way to do so) using multiple evade tokens on a single attack.

Remember that this card is not an action. Actions are on the action bar and also explicitly stated to be once per round.

No, strongly disagree. It doesn't say you can take 2 stress to receive 2 dice, or more, or imply some infinite number.

Now, can Yorr take that stress token off of him, and let him use Opportunist and come out of it UNstressed? Yes, absolutely. Is there anything at all, implying that you can take as many stress as you can hand off, piling on multiple attack dice? No, quite the opposite. You can take 1 stress to add 1 die. Period. If you can hand off that stress, great. But there is still nothing to imply you can take MORE than 1 stress or add MORE than 1 die.

This one is different. Push The Limit says once per round, clearly implying it is not once per round unless explicitly stated otherwise. So I would say yes, you can use this effect twice if you avoid the stress from the first, in much the same way the rules allow for(despite the fact there is not current way to do so) using multiple evade tokens on a single attack.

Remember that this card is not an action. Actions are on the action bar and also explicitly stated to be once per round.

Push the Limit says "once per round" because otherwise it would chain into itself as long as you could avoid stress. PtL came with the A-wing, and who's everyone's favorite A-wing pilot? Tycho! "I'll evade, then push the limit to focus. My focus was an action, so I'll push the limit to boost. My boost was an action, so I'll push the limit to target lock."

Consider Backstabber - "When attacking from outside the defender's firing arc, roll 1 additional attack die." How many times can I use that per attack? If there's no limit, I'll roll infinite dice, thank you very much.

There is nothing in the rules that says you cannot do this. Nowhere in the rules states you cannot use a card more than once per round, turn, attack, etc. It all hinges on the wording of the card. This particular card has the following conditions.

Attacking

Before Dice are rolled.(because adding a dice later does nothing)

Opponent has no Focus/Evade

No stress token.

If Yor nabs the stress token there is no stress token. Thus the action can be performed again. There is no wording on the card that says once per attack. There are on other cards.

I'll pull up a few more examples of this that are different.

Darth Vader-Operative words-After you perform an attack. There is only one time after you are performing an attack to use this.

Gunner-After performing an attack that does not hit. -You cannot attack again this round.

This card is clearly worded to stop another use should the second attack miss-implying cards are not once per turn.

I know the card says 1. But nothing says the card cannot be used again anywhere, and the step it can be used at is much broader. It doesn't say after the start of the attack phase. It doesn't say when determining how many dice to roll. Only "when attacking" A lot happens when attacking.

There is a clear difference between Backstabbers ability and this. This has a cost. Backstabber is a conditional. As long as the cost can be paid the card can be used. If Backstabber somehow were attacking two ships I guarantee he'd get two dice, but he can't do that.

There is a clear difference between Backstabbers ability and this. This has a cost. Backstabber is a conditional. As long as the cost can be paid the card can be used. If Backstabber somehow were attacking two ships I guarantee he'd get two dice, but he can't do that.

No, it does not have a cost. There is no concept of cost in X-wing, there is only what the text tell you to do.

In this case, it tells you to take a stress, and it includes a prerequisite that you not have a stress in order to do so. That doesn't make it inherently different from any other ability with a trigger condition.

So, hopefully before this gets out of hand I'll say this: the majority opinion here is also the same as the majority opinion on the BGG boards and is contrary to mine. The argument in opposition to my view is logical and I'm certainly unsure enough about my position to put in a rules question to FFG to see what the actual situation is.

To expand on my position I feel that the difference in the wording of both Elusiveness and Opportunist is that they have a cost to pay for an effect. For me they stand apart from all other cards that just have a trigger (and no cost). I feel that once the card has been triggered, you have that opportunity to pay that cost more than once if there is another effect in play that makes this possible. It's not an issue that's addressed directly in the rules or FAQ and we all know that the devs tend to rule with the intent of their design rather than being bound by literal interpretation.

Once I have the official word (either way) I'll post the answer here. See you in a couple of months!

There is nothing in the rules that says you cannot do this. Nowhere in the rules states you cannot use a card more than once per round, turn, attack, etc. It all hinges on the wording of the card. This particular card has the following conditions.

Attacking

Before Dice are rolled.(because adding a dice later does nothing)

Opponent has no Focus/Evade

No stress token.

If Yor nabs the stress token there is no stress token. Thus the action can be performed again. There is no wording on the card that says once per attack. There are on other cards.

I'll pull up a few more examples of this that are different.

Darth Vader-Operative words-After you perform an attack. There is only one time after you are performing an attack to use this.

Gunner-After performing an attack that does not hit. -You cannot attack again this round.

This card is clearly worded to stop another use should the second attack miss-implying cards are not once per turn.

I know the card says 1. But nothing says the card cannot be used again anywhere, and the step it can be used at is much broader. It doesn't say after the start of the attack phase. It doesn't say when determining how many dice to roll. Only "when attacking" A lot happens when attacking.

No, just no. Once you open up the "there's nothing specifically saying I can't do it" can of worms there is no end to it.

Hey, range bonuses - straight from the rules "Also, if he is targeting a ship at Range 1 with his primary weapon, he rolls 1 additional attack die." What's to stop me from rolling FOUR additional attack dice? It doesn't say I can't? Just because it says I can roll 1 that doesn't MEAN only 1, right? It doesn't say 1 and only 1, or no more than 1...

In fact jump back a page: "Depending on the range between the ships, the attacker or defender may roll additional dice during this attack."

Hey - it says DICE, plural, not 1 die. That just further supports my argument that there's nothing stopping me from rolling as many additional attack dice at range 1 as I want, right? Right?

No - it says you get 1 additional attack die, you get 1 additional attack die. If it says you can take 1 stress and receive 1 attack die, you can take ONE stress and receive ONE attack die. There's no difference. There's no "cost." Fun fact: I did a text search through the entire rules with updated FAQ and cost is only used about six times - and EVERY time, in reference to the point cost of a ship or upgrade. There is no 'ability cost' - that's a made up term. A fallacy.

As Buhalin said - it's just instructions. It tells you to take 1 stress to roll 1 extra attack die. That's not a cost you can pay over and over. Read the rules: there is no ability cost . It is just telling you what to do, and how to do it. ONE stress token. ONE extra die.

To expand on my position I feel that the difference in the wording of both Elusiveness and Opportunist is that they have a cost to pay for an effect. For me they stand apart from all other cards that just have a trigger (and no cost). I feel that once the card has been triggered, you have that opportunity to pay that cost more than once if there is another effect in play that makes this possible.

To elaborate a bit on my response to Aminar on this point...

We lack a lot of common core definitions in X-wing, and the concept of "cost" is one of them. The fact that the ability makes you take a stress is not actually a "cost" - it's just something else you do to complete the ability. The difference between Push the Limit and Opportunist/Elusiveness is illustrative here. O/E say you can't use them if you have a stress. Push the Limit has no similar limitation. So even if we try and impose the concept of "cost", I think we'd have a very hard time coming up with a consistent definition for it.

So as long as we don't have any unique strictures around the idea of gaining a stress as part of an ability, all that we're left with is the trigger condition, which really isn't any different from any other trigger condition for attack abilities.

Now I will freely grant that we don't have a strict "One event, one response" rule in X-wing. But it's basically a foundational requirement for how things are written because otherwise we end up with Backstabber insta-killing anything he tails because he rolls infinite dice.

What's to stop me from rolling FOUR additional attack dice?

Pfft. You think too small!

Not....FIVE attack dice???

So, in other words, for the OP, 1=4.

Big Brother is pleased.

Orwellian? We don't serve your kind here!

So, in other words, for the OP, 1=4.

Big Brother is pleased.

Ignorance is strength. Big Brother is watching you.

If it is an ABILITY, then you can only use it once.
If it is a Conditional Bonus (like Elusiveness), so long as the conditions are met, you're good to go.