But why are they making this now when we're just about to go to Rohan in the near future with the Saga Expansions? I'd think it would be a little difficult when they're overlapping like this.

Overlap is practically unavoidable so I think they trying to emphasize the different styles and themes for the quests that coincide with the saga expansions. Like this new deluxe says wizards and isengard all over it with quests commissioned by saruman whereas in the saga expansion he will be the primary adversary. I trust their thematic decisions they've been excellent at them thus far.

Plus the releases may be a bit further apart that they appear. Voice of Isengard is slated for Xmas 2013. With black riders not being officially released until September it's likely we won't see the 2nd fellowship box till Q1 2014 which if they follow consistent timing will put the 1st two towers box in summer if 2014; so we'll likely be right in the middle of the "ring maker" cycle at that point. Not so bad IMO

There's a really good chance that this was in the pipe when they got the license for LOTR proper.

It's also almost good thing for Saga and Delux expansions to overlap in location / trait.

That way we can focus on one trait significantly rather than having 2 traits developed a little at the same time and still end up with Dwarves as the obviously best trait available.

Something tells me it won't happen, but Saruman as hero or ally card would be very, very cool.

Although objective ally sounds more like it as it would be awkward to be able to play Saruman during Saga Expansions.

By reading the back of the box, my best guess at Delux Expansion Quests will be something along the lines of defending Ford of Isen against the Dunlanding invaders then chasing a strange of breed of Orcs to the edge of Fangorn forest.

As for the rest of the Cycle, I know uncovering treason of Saruman and meeting with Treebeard prematurely will cause thematic problems, but they had no problem with revealing Balrog in Moria during Khazad-Dum Cycle.

I'm thinking heroes will either get the wrong impression of Ents (ents are evil) and fail to discover the 'real truth' of Uruks, but maybe the herores do discover the truth and just never gets the chance to report it back to anyone.... afterall it is strongly hinted that atleast one group of heroes that confronted Balrog died to the snowstorms after escaping the mines.

Wow I haven't yet recovered from my excitement about black riders! This is AWESOME. I think I secretly prefer rohan to gondor. Eomer is definitely the hero I want to see most. Sure I was thrilled to find faramir showing his face at long last but boromir and eomer are two of my fav dudes in lotr

Ironic that we wait soooooo long for Faramir aaaaaannnnnddddd.... We can't use him. At least for now. Sigh.

But why are they making this now when we're just about to go to Rohan in the near future with the Saga Expansions? I'd think it would be a little difficult when they're overlapping like this.

Overlap is practically unavoidable so I think they trying to emphasize the different styles and themes for the quests that coincide with the saga expansions. Like this new deluxe says wizards and isengard all over it with quests commissioned by saruman whereas in the saga expansion he will be the primary adversary. I trust their thematic decisions they've been excellent at them thus far.

Plus the releases may be a bit further apart that they appear. Voice of Isengard is slated for Xmas 2013. With black riders not being officially released until September it's likely we won't see the 2nd fellowship box till Q1 2014 which if they follow consistent timing will put the 1st two towers box in summer if 2014; so we'll likely be right in the middle of the "ring maker" cycle at that point. Not so bad IMO

They would be much better off in every way from more saga expansions. Saga expansions make money - they let them develop linked quests. Obviously we don't want them to make too many (specifically, we don't want them to make them when they've run out of ideas for quests).

Depending on how much they're allowed to deviate from the core plot (exploring for instance, the battles that occurred throughout the world that are only mentioned in passing) - they could easily get many expansions out of the lord of the rings.

Even with just the focus on the core members of the fellowship I don't think 6 saga boxes will cover it.

You're assuming they're making the mistake of having only 6 sagas total for Lord of the Rings. I think (much like the films) they can't do it justice in so short a space.

But why are they making this now when we're just about to go to Rohan in the near future with the Saga Expansions? I'd think it would be a little difficult when they're overlapping like this.

Overlap is practically unavoidable so I think they trying to emphasize the different styles and themes for the quests that coincide with the saga expansions. Like this new deluxe says wizards and isengard all over it with quests commissioned by saruman whereas in the saga expansion he will be the primary adversary. I trust their thematic decisions they've been excellent at them thus far.

Plus the releases may be a bit further apart that they appear. Voice of Isengard is slated for Xmas 2013. With black riders not being officially released until September it's likely we won't see the 2nd fellowship box till Q1 2014 which if they follow consistent timing will put the 1st two towers box in summer if 2014; so we'll likely be right in the middle of the "ring maker" cycle at that point. Not so bad IMO

They would be much better off in every way from more saga expansions. Saga expansions make money - they let them develop linked quests. Obviously we don't want them to make too many (specifically, we don't want them to make them when they've run out of ideas for quests).

Depending on how much they're allowed to deviate from the core plot (exploring for instance, the battles that occurred throughout the world that are only mentioned in passing) - they could easily get many expansions out of the lord of the rings.

Even with just the focus on the core members of the fellowship I don't think 6 saga boxes will cover it.

You're assuming they're making the mistake of having only 6 sagas total for Lord of the Rings. I think (much like the films) they can't do it justice in so short a space.

Well i'm not necessarily assuming, trying to make an educated guess based on the information they've already given us. Such as:

1) They turned the hobbit into two boxes (2 per book). This is the weakest piece of evidence as the hobbit is also the smallest of the stories and smaller in scope as well.

2) Black Riders takes us literally through the first half (or technically book 1) of the fellowship of the ring. The final chapter of the first "book" is flight to the ford which is uncoincidentally the last quest in black riders. I understand past behavior is not a gurantee of future events...but it is a pretty good predictor. One can make the point that the future books have a lot more "questing" material in them which is absolutely true, which brings me to the last and perhaps strongest piece of evidence

3) The campaign log. What seems like FFG's proudest feature for the saga expansions is the concept of linking them together to form a campaign. In july they had a whole article about it and talked about a log book they would be including with the following picture:

-While it still looks somewhat conceptual, it also looks quite finished. On the second page where it has the "scenarios completed" chart, there are 18 lines to write in quest. Once again, uncoincidentally if there are 6 total boxes (two per fellowship, towers, king...or 1 per "book") It would fill up the entire graph right to the "campaign total" where u can put your final score.

So while I obviously cannot gurantee that there will be 6 total boxes, i think theres a stronger argument for it than against it. I would love for them to derive every nook and cranny out of the lord of the rings with these things but also since these are still targeted towards the casual crowd i think they have to limit themselves too. Sure they are going to sell well, but casual players arent going to want to buy 8-12 boxes to finish the story. Maybe only 6 will/would be a mistake, maybe not; i think thats more of an "assumption" that will only be confirmed after all is released

sounds logical...

18 quests in a row...how much time you could play at this campaign???

...I can´t wait 2 years to get them all.

The two points (one about the three quests covering book 1, and the other about the quest log) together make it almost a certainty, there will be six saga boxes, unless something extreme and serious happens.

But what do you all think of the release plan? We get the first one in Q3 '13, my guess for the rest would be the following: Q1 '14, Q3 '14, Q1 '15, Q3 '15, Q4 '15. In this fashion, the end of 2015 could well mark the end of the active production of the game (sadly, but all things must end - in a way at least). We also seem to be getting a cycle per year, which would leave only one more cycle after the Ring-maker's one. This x-mas we get a deluxe, the next one again, the x-mas of 2015 we get the final saga. That is my prediction.

Hm, isn't there 7 books in lotr total? Or is it just that the fellowship, two towers and return of the king has each been split into two books and then one for appendix? I have a Harperversion on my iPad and thus only have one single "book" so I'm not sure. Just seemed that, unless its just the seven combined to three books, there could be more boxes. All from 6-12 boxes? And I don't think I matters too much to the casual players. They'd either get them all or go for just the core and the hobbit boxes. If you buy more than that you are hardly a casual player IMO

Just to measure the scope of the (perhaps naive) prediction, when the first saga is released, there will be 46 hero cards in the game; after that if we get five more saga boxes and two full cycles including the deluxe, and all the current trends remain, there will be 36 more hero cards. That is not few considering the vast majority of the main characters have already been released.

Just to measure the scope of the (perhaps naive) prediction, when the first saga is released, there will be 46 hero cards in the game; after that if we get five more saga boxes and two full cycles including the deluxe, and all the current trends remain, there will be 36 more hero cards. That is not few considering the vast majority of the main characters have already been released.

I think they'll have to back off on the pace of heros or we're going to be seeing a lot more like Caldara.

So while I obviously cannot gurantee that there will be 6 total boxes, i think theres a stronger argument for it than against it. I would love for them to derive every nook and cranny out of the lord of the rings with these things but also since these are still targeted towards the casual crowd i think they have to limit themselves too. Sure they are going to sell well, but casual players arent going to want to buy 8-12 boxes to finish the story. Maybe only 6 will/would be a mistake, maybe not; i think thats more of an "assumption" that will only be confirmed after all is released

I'd like to propose an alternative: They intend to cover the main elements of the quest as you say: they then (if sales are still good) will either need to get a new licence for a new book, or else take advantage of what they have to go back and flesh out missing parts of the sagas.

I also don't think you should look too much into missing out the barrow downs and the old forest as evidence for future intentions. Those two parts of the first book are widely regarded as more reminiscent of the hobbit (an adventure a chapter) and rather tangential to the overall all saga. The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

It's really at the two towers and onward after the fellowship is broken that we'll have the potential for more sagas. One's that follow Frodo and ones that's follow other parts of the fellowship. I think 3 would cover the fellowship (and I see why the barrow downs and old forest aren't included, though I hope to get them eventually, so why 2 would do). However I think that the other two books can't be done in only 2 sagas each.

As for 18 quests on a page - I really hope the formatting of their quest log isn't going to lead to them limiting their expansions for this game. That would be awful design.

The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

and an act of terrible proportions it is too........i think those parts are the foundations upon which the lord of the rings is built...and in fact reading tolkiens notes and writing process, this is true as they were wrote before he had any clear idea of where he was going with it. it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings than epic battles

it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings that epic battles

Definitely!

Looks like we will get now one deluxe box each 2 months until next cycle start. Wow I love it! And sure all this stuff is amazing!

Just to measure the scope of the (perhaps naive) prediction, when the first saga is released, there will be 46 hero cards in the game; after that if we get five more saga boxes and two full cycles including the deluxe, and all the current trends remain, there will be 36 more hero cards. That is not few considering the vast majority of the main characters have already been released.

I think they'll have to back off on the pace of heros or we're going to be seeing a lot more like Caldara.

It may well be they reduce it to two from the next box on, who knows. However, I actually think heroes are most needed to have the more possibilities for deck-building. I would certainly not like the trend to change, even if it means more "multiple" or "made-up" heroes.

The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

and an act of terrible proportions it is too........i think those parts are the foundations upon which the lord of the rings is built...and in fact reading tolkiens notes and writing process, this is true as they were wrote before he had any clear idea of where he was going with it. it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings that epic battles

Very true, and quite sad.

The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

and an act of terrible proportions it is too........i think those parts are the foundations upon which the lord of the rings is built...and in fact reading tolkiens notes and writing process, this is true as they were wrote before he had any clear idea of where he was going with it. it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings than epic battles

The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

and an act of terrible proportions it is too........i think those parts are the foundations upon which the lord of the rings is built...and in fact reading tolkiens notes and writing process, this is true as they were wrote before he had any clear idea of where he was going with it. it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings than epic battles

"Often missed out in adaptatioms". Does that mean that there are versions of the book that omits it?? Or just regarding all other medias? I ask as I have just begun reading the books and haven't come that far yet. But I wanna be sure I ain't missing out on anything

just other media

there are various versions of story that tolkien adapted, but these are usually minor changes to change errors in map/text agreement

also interestingly, most of bilbo/gollum encounter in the hobbit was rewritten to keep with the lord of the rings. initially bilbo wasnt very nice at all to gollum

rich

The old forest in particular is often missed out in adaptations.

and an act of terrible proportions it is too........i think those parts are the foundations upon which the lord of the rings is built...and in fact reading tolkiens notes and writing process, this is true as they were wrote before he had any clear idea of where he was going with it. it is such a shame adaptations do not take this into account as there is more to the lord of the rings than epic battles

"Often missed out in adaptatioms". Does that mean that there are versions of the book that omits it?? Or just regarding all other medias? I ask as I have just begun reading the books and haven't come that far yet. But I wanna be sure I ain't missing out on anything

just other media

there are various versions of story that tolkien adapted, but these are usually minor changes to change errors in map/text agreement

also interestingly, most of bilbo/gollum encounter in the hobbit was rewritten to keep with the lord of the rings. initially bilbo wasnt very nice at all to gollum

rich

So, Saruman will be an Istari ally or an enemy?

May I also predict: a good non-generic Palantir of Orthanc card?