vs.

If you had to choose between the two for an investigator with currently no magical weapons or combat spells, which of the two would you choose? A good game-lasting protection, or a one-time significant effect? I would personally pick Sword of Glory. An Elder Sign won't do me much good if I'll encounter a physically resistant/immune monster in the other world. What about you? Also, don't say "depends on the game status", I'm talking about the start of the game.

Links for all the previous Great Debates can be found here .

Start of game, then I would take the Sword of Glory. Worth more over the course of the game then an Elder Sign.

dkw said:

Agreed. The Sword of Glory is the best possession in the game imo.

Yep, no choice really. Having a +6 Magic weapon that doesn't exhaust or cost anything is a major benefit, considering spells are much more limited. If someone has the Sword of Glory all game long, the group will have an easy time of most any monster situation.

I've had this choice often. I almost always take the elder sign. To get a major gate sealed right away will usually reap two bounces before the game is over, not to mention one less doom token. The goal of the game is to seal gates, not kill monsters.

I usually play games with4 or three players, so there's always someone else who wants to fight monsters.

Elder Sign for me. It's good to go directly to a gate and not have to worry about collecting clues.

Against certain AOs, this is a lifesaver, especially now that Epic Combat is so difficult and all the Sword would do is make you look good while you got devoured.

Now, if you pit Elder Sign against Healing Stone, I would have to think a bit more. HS is one of the best, hands-down.

I'd go with the sword. There is nothing I hate more than having a character all ready to go close and seal a gate, but unable to get past a particularly nasty monster. I ran into that with Luke the Dreamer last weekend. He had about 15 clues, but couldn't get to the open gates because there were critters he couldn't beat and cound't evade all over the place.

The other investigators tried to help but it seemed like everytime they cleared a path, a new monster would move into the way.

Couldn't get a single weapon or combat spell of any type. Highly frustrating. I had about 6 spells, but none were for combat. We ended up going into final combat with Y'Gonac and all got devoured.

With much sighing and moaning - usually of the person who would rather go and hunt some monsters - we always, always take the Sign (outside of league games). Both taking the Sign and the moaning are compulsory house rules.

I'd always take the Elder Sign. Only 4-5 of those in the deck, and there are better bonuses out there than the sword of Glory. Elder sign is cheaper too, if you're shopping. OP said it was starting equipment, but then you probably wouldn't have much of a choice unless you were Monterey Jack, in which case, just ditch the third item and keep both the elder sign and the sword =). Unless he meant what would I rather start with, in which case... yeah, I'd rather start with an Elder Sign.

Other thing about the Elder Sign is that if you have no combat ability, no problem. Just give the Elder Sign to another player who does. Let them do your dirty work for you, you can stay in Arkham and shop =).

I'm absolutely flabbergasted at the number of people who would pick the Sword of Glory over an Elder Sign. To my mind, it's not even a question: ALWAYS take the Elder Sign at the start of the game! Unless you plan from the beginning to fight the AO at the end, Arkham at its heart is basically a race to get six gates sealed before the AO awakens. An Elder Sign gives you a tremendous boost in that race, not to mention slowing the other side down (i.e. removing a doom token from the doom track). It is therefore far more valuable overall than a Sword of Glory.

As for being afraid to use the Elder Sign because you lack weapons, awp832 has already addressed that problem. If you feel you can't safely use the Elder Sign, give it to another player who can! Arkham is a cooperative, team game, after all.

I'd go with the Elder Sign for many of the same reasons others have already posted. I'd also add that while the Sword of Glory is awesome, my memory tells me that I've at times not used it in favor of a spell in one hand and a magical (or not) weapon in the other for better benefit. The elder sign is rare, moves one closer to victory and removes a doom token. Plus it's quite satisfying to drop on the table when you really need it.

The key is that it was a choice at the beginning of the game. If it was later on I'd get the Elder Sign in most cases. Sealing gates makes the game so much easier, that is true. But frankly, having someone who is a great monster killer is a huge plus. Everyone else can concentrate on clues and Elder Signs if that one guy takes the sword, because you certainly have a few guns out there as well. Nothing left to do but seal gates without ever worrying about combat.

Elder sign and remorse. But there's always more weapons (stronger ones too— I prefer enchanted blade for one thing). Whereas I take as many Elder Signs and KiYs as I can get.

kroen said:

Errrr, I can do alot more with a Dragon's Eye. Even a Healing Stone or a Necronomicon.

For me it's no question: Elder Sign!

Elder Signs are the sole reason I'm going shopping at the Curiositie Shoppe. If I happen to draw a couple of other nice items, that's fine.

I rarely have enough money on a single investigator to buy a Sword of Glory, anyway. Typically, I distribute the money so all investigators have the same amount. If I don't draw an Elder Sign I tend to buy the cheapest item to save enough money for another try next turn.

Only if one of the drawn items is a perfect fit for an investigator will I buy an expensive one.

Elder sign. Without batting an eyelash. I'd curse the elder gods if the choice were between Healing Stone and the Sign, and I'd still take the Sign, but no weapon is even worth the consideration (not even Gladius of Carcosa, which I consider superior to the Sword) unless we were going straight for the Final Combat (or an unusual strategy due to AO and/or initial Investigator/Item combinations).

The faster you seal gates the less you have to worry about monsters.That elder sign can potentially deal with more monsters indirectly than any weapon can directly during the course of the game.