The adversary talent on pg.132 says
Upgrade the difficulty of any combat check targeting this character once per rank of adversary.
So was looking at the Defel assassin(nemesis) on pc.392 he has adversary 3
Dose that mean you add 3 purple dice to the combat check or do you upgrade the purple to 3 red challenge dice?
Upgrading is a very specific term. What it means is that any purple dice you have, up to the number to be upgraded, is then turned into a challenge die. Then, if you've got upgrades left and no difficulty dice, you add a difficulty die. Then if you still have upgrades, you turn the difficulty die into a challenge die.
So, if you've got an Adversary 3 and you're trying to melee attack them... you would have the player roll 2 Challenge and 1 Difficulty.
If you were trying to shoot an Adversary 3 in Short range, you would have the player roll 2 Challenge dice (1 base difficulty, one challenge from upgrade, a second difficulty, then upgrade that again to a second Challenge die)
Edited by SinosaurOk I see now thanks
I now feel absolute pity for a lightsaber-wielding noob who finds one of the Emperor's rare Forsaken Jedi. Even someone skilled with the lightsaber might find this difficult, but combine Adversary 3 with the augmentative stuff in Sense, and you might NEVER be able to hit him/her. Mara Jade would be a beast, as an Emperor's Hand with Sense and a lightsaber, when she wants one.
SHIVER!!!
(As she should be
)
I now feel absolute pity for a lightsaber-wielding noob who finds one of the Emperor's rare Forsaken Jedi. Even someone skilled with the lightsaber might find this difficult, but combine Adversary 3 with the augmentative stuff in Sense, and you might NEVER be able to hit him/her. Mara Jade would be a beast, as an Emperor's Hand with Sense and a lightsaber, when she wants one. SHIVER!!! (As she should be
A point I've made on several other occasions. Including the fact that said forsaken Jedi is rolling YYYG with his Lightsaber attacks.... icky.
Adversary talent is a really interesting option. When you add this to a NPC it becomes harder to take down. In my opinon this is the usual archienemy that appears at the begining of a really LOOONG campaign that advances with the PC's. That one that you as a GM don't want that be killed by "lucky shoots". Adversary only upgrades difficult to hit, not combat skills from NPC so, it will not harm the PC's, just give you enought time to build an awesome battle.
I suggest to consider the possibility to downgrade the Advesary talent on campaign. Here how I will use Adversary talent.
Act 1.
PC (low-skilled) vs NPC (Adversary 3): The PC must run from the encounter or use a very clever strategy to survive.
Act 2.
PC (mid-skilled) + Other friendly PC's or NPC's (same or above skill level) vs NPC (with a few skill improves) and probably with Adversary 2: NPC will probably still win or will be forced to retire due to the heroes teamfight.
Act 3. The Final Battle (Entering Duel of Fates OST XD)
PC (high-skilled) and maybe other friendly PC's/NPC's vs NPC (with fully upgraded skills) and maybe with Adversary 1 or even 0. This Act probably will be the final act that kills the NPC or even let it join the group after the redemption.
Post-act. New adversaries will appear following the same rules and adapting the game challenge. Also the old NPC enemy will become a friendly redeemed NPC without Adversary talent.
Cold be cool
I suggest to consider the possibility to downgrade the Advesary talent on campaign. Here how I will use Adversary talent.
Act 1.
PC (low-skilled) vs NPC (Adversary 3): The PC must run from the encounter or use a very clever strategy to survive.
Act 2.
PC (mid-skilled) + Other friendly PC's or NPC's (same or above skill level) vs NPC (with a few skill improves) and probably with Adversary 2: NPC will probably still win or will be forced to retire due to the heroes teamfight.
Act 3. The Final Battle (Entering Duel of Fates OST XD)
PC (high-skilled) and maybe other friendly PC's/NPC's vs NPC (with fully upgraded skills) and maybe with Adversary 1 or even 0. This Act probably will be the final act that kills the NPC or even let it join the group after the redemption.
No I wouldn't recommend decreasing Adversary. Not when dealing with player groups. It is there to account for a variety of defensive measures. And many times such opponents will be dealing with more than one player character. They do need their edges in order to present a formidable opposition.
I had a party of 3 people who were breaking out of prison (had little to no equipment) and had 200 EXP plus starting fight a "forsaken Jedi" that was actually just a regular Jedi (in the Old Republic Era). They killed him and only took 1 damage (mostly because the Macho Man Randy Savage Herglic scored two triumphs and smashed his lightsaber, but still.)
Don't overestimate this talent. It is strong, but not invincible.
(mostly because the Macho Man Randy Savage Herglic scored two triumphs and smashed his lightsaber, but still.)
Great story!
Curious - how did you deal with the fact that lightsabers "Can't be sundered"?
Because his fists don't have the Sunder quality; he used the break an item trigger that two triumphs allows, per the combat uses of triumphs table.
I mean, when a Herglik uppercuts you so hard that you drop your saber and he smashes it underfoot, well, there's not much you can do.
Plus, sabers are immune to sunder because of their blade, so breaking it there makes little sense. A double-triumph I think could be spent to instead destroy it at the hilt, where its true weak point is. I mean, Obi-Wan did it to Darth Maul, so I think it would be fitting to allow that to happen given this rather rare statistic.
Because his fists don't have the Sunder quality; he used the break an item trigger that two triumphs allows, per the combat uses of triumphs table.
Aha!! (Which is exactly how it
should
be played.)
Well played, sir. Good GMing in effect!
Because his fists don't have the Sunder quality; he used the break an item trigger that two triumphs allows, per the combat uses of triumphs table.
Aha!! (Which is exactly how it should be played.)
Thanks! Yeah, don't worry. I had an internal debate with myself when he suggested it, and I was like "****, am I allowed to do this?"
Then I reminded myself that I was the GM and I could do whatever the hell I want, so that lightsaber done got smashed. XD
Adversary talent is a really interesting option. When you add this to a NPC it becomes harder to take down. In my opinon this is the usual archienemy that appears at the begining of a really LOOONG campaign that advances with the PC's. That one that you as a GM don't want that be killed by "lucky shoots". Adversary only upgrades difficult to hit, not combat skills from NPC so, it will not harm the PC's, just give you enought time to build an awesome battle.
I suggest to consider the possibility to downgrade the Advesary talent on campaign. Here how I will use Adversary talent.
Act 1.
PC (low-skilled) vs NPC (Adversary 3): The PC must run from the encounter or use a very clever strategy to survive.
Act 2.
PC (mid-skilled) + Other friendly PC's or NPC's (same or above skill level) vs NPC (with a few skill improves) and probably with Adversary 2: NPC will probably still win or will be forced to retire due to the heroes teamfight.
Act 3. The Final Battle (Entering Duel of Fates OST XD)
PC (high-skilled) and maybe other friendly PC's/NPC's vs NPC (with fully upgraded skills) and maybe with Adversary 1 or even 0. This Act probably will be the final act that kills the NPC or even let it join the group after the redemption.
Post-act. New adversaries will appear following the same rules and adapting the game challenge. Also the old NPC enemy will become a friendly redeemed NPC without Adversary talent.
Cold be cool
This is not a good idea. The adversary talent is the only thing that will allow an NPC to survive. Combat is not opposed skill check they are set difficulty, reducing Adversary like you suggest would only create a punk death scene like Darth Maul.
If anything it should be the reverse. Act 1, 1 Adversary, Act 2 - 2 Adversary , etc this would show broth of the villain.
Hi again!
My idea was focused to recreate the Darth Maul scene. For example:
- In pre-episode I Maul will have Adversary 3 because he MUST NOT die, because has to survive due to plot.
- In Tatooine scene against Qui-Gon he still have 3 or even 2. Maul MUST NOT die there, but PC always can change the story (depending on GM).
- On the last Maul appearance its Adversary has dropped because in this scene Maul (spoilers XD) MUST die (or almost XD).
So its Adversary will be 2, 1 or even 0.
Thats my idea about reduce Adversary, because in some scenes characters may have "Plot almost-inmunity" but when the scene advances he "just" becomes a "hard target" to take down.
Edited by Josep MariaYou don't need to reduce Adversary to give the PCs a better chance: they have a better chance by virtue of GETTING BETTER as they advance.
Now, in the Darth Maul fight, I would argue that he DOES lose a level or two of Adversary -- but only AFTER Qui-Gon is down and it's just Kenobi vs Maul (which I think would be a fair GM ruling).
I think by the end of it Maul loses at least half of all his stats.
but if this was an opposed check you do not add the Adversary rank correct?
Adversary upgrades all Combat checks against the target. Per the rulebook,
QuoteA player makes a combat check when he uses a combat skill to attack a target. This is also referred to as an attack. The combat skills in [x] consist of the following: Brawl, Gunnery, Melee, Ranged (Light) and Ranged (Heavy).
So any opposed check that is also an Attack, but *only* opposed checks that are also Attacks.
This has some weird interactions with Force Move, because as per Force & Destiny a Rival/Nemesis can oppose Force Move with a skill, the example given being a Resilience check. Just Force Moving someone around isn't an Attack, so they don't get the upgrades. However, Force Move also says the rules for using it to throw objects at someone means it counts as an Attack (i.e. Combat check) where the difficulty is based on the thrown object and uses ' all the rules for ranged attacks, including defence '.
So by my reading:
I thought this was going to be straightforward but it's actually really convoluted and I'd be interested to hear what other people's interpretations of the rules are.
(N.B. I do mean 'interpretation of the rules' not 'what would you do in this situation'; Obviously a reasonable GM would probably apply Adversary in situation 3 and the higher of the two Adversary ratings in situation 2. They'd almost certainly apply it in situation 1 to avoid losing a Nemesis in one action to a straight difficulty 2 check)
PLEASE VERIFY.. the Adversary talent is only added to combat checks NOT opposed checks
1 hour ago, LordEnforcer said:PLEASE VERIFY.. the Adversary talent is only added to combat checks NOT opposed checks
QuoteUpgrade the difficulty of any combat check targeting this character once per rank of Adversary. AoR p. 142
1 hour ago, LordEnforcer said:PLEASE VERIFY.. the Adversary talent is only added to combat checks NOT opposed checks
Verified. The Adversary talent is only added to combat checks, not to opposed checks.