So I don't know how many people have noticed that the Evicerator takes 4AP to attack with, making it your entire turn. Since there is no charge attack that means moving into base to base then waiting to attack. This might not seem like an issue until you realise that no one is going to wait to get hit by that thing so anyone sane here will make 1 attack with a sword or something and then use 3 AP to disengage. Now you have to move again taking at least 1AP so now you are in melee again but can't attack, so what do you do? Well all you can really do is kick them at that point.

This means that you can kick them 3 times before they can disengage and they can't wait in combat or risk an Eviscerator attack. So you get 3 kicks to every stab or 2 and a saved AP for evading.

And thus the Eviscerator was invented to help kick boxers feel useful in 41st millennium war zones.

Another example of the screwy ROA mechanics in this game.

[sarcasm]But, but, look at that penetration ! And that damage! Surely it would be overpowered otherwise! The psychological impact on the enemy is undeniable, just look how they flee before you![/sarcasm]

On the topic of the Eviscerator, anybody else notice it does more damage per hit than a melta gun? And that, for a 15kg, 6 ft long chainsaw (good luck wielding that, try just 5 kg for a few minutes), you still don't get the strength bonus? There seems to be absolutely no logic to what gets or doesn't get S to damage...

We can expect some glitches, given it's a Beta. This sounds like just the sort of thing to report so it can be given a rethink. I'm certain the weapons will be overhauled and tidied up in the release version.

But isn't he reporting it? That's what the forum is for right?

Well, if you're not playing with weight restrictions go with an evicerator and a big gun, if anyone charges you quick draw and dice him!

On a more serious note: That weapon should have a strenght requirement.

[sarcasm]But, but, look at that penetration ! And that damage! Surely it would be overpowered otherwise! The psychological impact on the enemy is undeniable, just look how they flee before you![/sarcasm]

On the topic of the Eviscerator, anybody else notice it does more damage per hit than a melta gun? And that, for a 15kg, 6 ft long chainsaw (good luck wielding that, try just 5 kg for a few minutes), you still don't get the strength bonus? There seems to be absolutely no logic to what gets or doesn't get S to damage...

As for the strength bonus, it could be argued that your strength isn't really a factor with something so huge, because you're primarily using the weight of the weapon to drive strikes into your enemy. Think of a splitting axe, but it's a giant, fifteen kilo chainsaw instead.

I see where you're coming from with the Strength Bonus query, but if you're wielding a beast of a weapon like this with greater strength (and thus, arguably, control) it makes sense to me that you'll do more damage than someone weaker, who'll probably find it more difficult to put the thing where it needs to go.

I wouldn't count on FFG looking in this Forum for suggested rule amendments. Some important feedback might get lost amongst other comments (especially negative ones – if I were designing a game, I wouldn't want to wade through lots of complaining to look for constructive criticism). Collecting them in an email seems the surest way to get them to the right person.

Talking issues through with other players here first, though, is a really good idea for everyone. It gives us outside perspective as folk bring things up that we wouldn't have considered.

Can't use an eviscerator on a charge!

Best glitch so far...

Still, it is an absolute monster in terms of damage...

Round 1 - wander into melee; evade like crazy

Round 2 - splat!

From a tactics perspective, I would assume that the Eviscerator isn't a weapon you use against foes that can run away. Instead, you box them (/suppress them) in so they've got nowhere to safely disengage to, then wade in for the kill.

[sarcasm]But, but, look at that penetration ! And that damage! Surely it would be overpowered otherwise! The psychological impact on the enemy is undeniable, just look how they flee before you![/sarcasm]

On the topic of the Eviscerator, anybody else notice it does more damage per hit than a melta gun? And that, for a 15kg, 6 ft long chainsaw (good luck wielding that, try just 5 kg for a few minutes), you still don't get the strength bonus? There seems to be absolutely no logic to what gets or doesn't get S to damage...

As for the strength bonus, it could be argued that your strength isn't really a factor with something so huge, because you're primarily using the weight of the weapon to drive strikes into your enemy. Think of a splitting axe, but it's a giant, fifteen kilo chainsaw instead.

This is not true! The ability to handle a large weapon relies heavily on physical strength to control it in combat. From the Attack where you position your body weight to 'drive' it home to recovering from the attack so that you can at least defend yourself even if you couldn't necessarily parry. The weight of the weapon is also ridiculous! IRL a Scottish Claymore weighs in at about 5-10 lbs. Once it gets moving you will need everything you have to control it! 15kg? That's like trying to swing a M240g GPMG at someone! (And we all "know" you can't use heavy weapons in melee!). Of course this is not the first time weapon weights have been off.

15kg.

Try swinging this about

I would like to point out that you get +2 Ap if not surprised, you only get 4 Ap if you are surprised which makes sense since an eviscerator is a heavy weapon and difficult to bring to bear quickly.

Aren't those only usable for reactions, though?

Aren't those only usable for reactions, though?

all I saw in the beta was that they get +2 if not surprised, Maybe I missed something but nowhere did I see that they could only be used for reactions.

Couldn't this whole issue be solved by increasing the AP cost for charge and having it include a single attack?

How would that interact with weapons that have a lower AP cost to use, though? It'd create some odd issues, for sure.

You could do it a couple of ways I guess. You could adjust the cost of attacking with melee weapons such that it is always possible to charge and attack. You could roll in a single, powerful swing with the charge action at an increased AP cost.

Reading the Charge action, it's clear they intend it to be a 'move+attack' option, but pulled out just the movement part of it to give you the tactical option to attack one target and then charge another, as charging is a move action. That doesn't solve the problem with the eviscerator though - you'd still never be able to do that given the AP costs involved.

How would that interact with weapons that have a lower AP cost to use, though? It'd create some odd issues, for sure.

Not that much really.

p.199

"On his next melee attack made this turn, the character’s rate of attack cannot exceed 1 , and the character adds the number of metres moved with this use of the charge action to the damage total of the attack."

Rate of attack. In other words, it will only ever get one hit. So there already is a limitation in place that lowers the effectiveness of a high RoF weapon on a charge as opposed to a low RoF weapon. That said, a high RoF weapon still takes fewer AP to attack with on a charge as opposed to a low RoF one.

I'm not sure what I think of the matter. Charge itself doesn't include a far enough movement to be "useful," beyond the extra damage it deals. The extra damage is quite nice though, as it helps guarantee a final damage score that is just better than what would have been scored in the first place.

If you are having trouble bringing your Eviserator to bear, you might want to invest in a good back-up weapon, like a Sniper Rifle.

Oh. Wait...