Thanks for the info.

Isn't there already a control upgrade for the Sense power that let's a FSE "keep up" an ability to upgrade the difficulty of an attack that comes his way? Reflavor it as "deflection" if the FSE's got one of them laser swords. Reflection: Despair + failure = shooter takes base damage from his own weapon. No house rules required.

That's true, but again you come up with the Despair + Failure result being something that is entirely out of the player's control. It could also result in cases where the GM (or the players if facing someone like the Forsaken Jedi) suddenly have a string of bad luck and roll a slew of Despair results, winding up in the targets having more holes in them than a block of swiss cheese, or that entire sessions go by without a single Despair being rolled, all of itl based upon the vagaries of the dice.

To the general concern of "adding extra rolls = bad," I honestly think when it comes to Jedi and Force-users, extra rolls and thus an extra degree of complexity are going to be required. During the Beta, it was painfully clear that a Force-user with the Move power, the "attack with an object" Control Upgrade, and a few Strength Upgrades could every easily one-shot any foe with a Silhouette 2 object, needing only a single Force Point and with the target having no means of defense. Obviously this got changed between the printing of the Beta rulebook and the core rulebook, and with good reason. However, the solution to fix this problem required added complexity in the form of needing additional Force Points to activate the non-Control Upgrades and a Discipline check (opposed for Influence's "affect minds" Control Upgrade, based upon object's Silhouette for Move's "hurl objects" Control Upgrade). Prior to those changes, Force Powers were incredibly simple... and incredibly broken.

In execution (and I've playtested the various versions of my Deflect Blasters talent as much as possible), the competitive check really doesn't add that much extra complexity to the game. The player is pretty much going to know what their base Lightsaber dice pool is, and really only needs to know the base difficulty of the attack roll. I discuss the talent in more depth here on my blog:

http://jedimorningfire.blogspot.com/2013/05/blaster-deflection-101-for-edge-of.html

Personally, I allow people to trigger certain things with Triumph even on failures. Like disarming people or, with two triumphs on a still failed check, destroying an item on them. Their weapon doesn't actually hit the player they are going for, so he takes no damage; but their attack did knock their weapon down, or the dodging he had to do caused him to drop his weapon (possibly down a really really long shaft, with two triumphs).

Those I don't really mind as much, giving someone a status effect with some Triumph doesn't bother me and are probably the sort of thing that Triumph should be used for on a failure. And a Despair on a success should mean that while they do hurt their intended target (or the GM could bend it to at least hit one of the enemies nearby), something bad happens. Might hit an ally or damage something important or their weapon breaks. Or, hell, blast knocks you and your allies on your asses.

Personally, I allow people to trigger certain things with Triumph even on failures. Like disarming people or, with two triumphs on a still failed check, destroying an item on them. Their weapon doesn't actually hit the player they are going for, so he takes no damage; but their attack did knock their weapon down, or the dodging he had to do caused him to drop his weapon (possibly down a really really long shaft, with two triumphs).

Difference here is that the rules already account for that. Disarming a foe already doesn't require a successful attack roll, just the three Advantage or 1 Triumph to pull it off. Same with Disorient, Sunder and Knockdown; neither of those weapon qualities say they require you to hit the target, only that you have enough Advantage or a Triumph to activate the effect. So by allowing a Triumph to do those things, you're still playing within the rules.

There's no precedence for Despair to = "person rolling takes damage," and frankly that's with good reason as being forced to take Wound Damage just because of a die roll is pretty harsh. At best, you can inflict Strain via Threat or Despair, but that's also because Strain is a lot easier to recover (can be done at the end of every combat with a Simple Cool or Discipline check), so Strain Damage isn't as big a deal as Wound Damage would be.

Personally, I allow people to trigger certain things with Triumph even on failures. Like disarming people or, with two triumphs on a still failed check, destroying an item on them. Their weapon doesn't actually hit the player they are going for, so he takes no damage; but their attack did knock their weapon down, or the dodging he had to do caused him to drop his weapon (possibly down a really really long shaft, with two triumphs).

Difference here is that the rules already account for that. Disarming a foe already doesn't require a successful attack roll, just the three Advantage or 1 Triumph to pull it off. Same with Disorient, Sunder and Knockdown; neither of those weapon qualities say they require you to hit the target, only that you have enough Advantage or a Triumph to activate the effect. So by allowing a Triumph to do those things, you're still playing within the rules.

There's no precedence for Despair to = "person rolling takes damage," and frankly that's with good reason as being forced to take Wound Damage just because of a die roll is pretty harsh. At best, you can inflict Strain via Threat or Despair, but that's also because Strain is a lot easier to recover (can be done at the end of every combat with a Simple Cool or Discipline check), so Strain Damage isn't as big a deal as Wound Damage would be.

But there is a precedent, which I already brought up once. The Thermal Detonator. Despair makes it blow up in your hand, and it makes no mention of whether or not it has to be rolled on a success or a failed check.

But there is a precedent, which I already brought up once. The Thermal Detonator. Despair makes it blow up in your hand, and it makes no mention of whether or not it has to be rolled on a success or a failed check.

For a very specific item that's noted to be notoriously unstable and just as dangerous to the user as to the possible targets. It'd be akin to arguing that 3 Threat can be spent to instantly have a character's blaster pistol run out of ammo because the precedent (under your logic) has been set with heavy blaster pistols running dry on the expenditure of 3 Threat.

One other point, is that lightsaber deflection/reflection has always been noted as a skill that has be developed and honed, not something that any Force-sensitive with a ligthsaber in hand can pull off. That's part of why I set this up as a talent for my Jedi Initiate; it's something they have to learn how to do, as well as putting when the effect triggers in the hands of the player character rather than the randomness of a dice roll.

But there is a precedent, which I already brought up once. The Thermal Detonator. Despair makes it blow up in your hand, and it makes no mention of whether or not it has to be rolled on a success or a failed check.

For a very specific item that's noted to be notoriously unstable and just as dangerous to the user as to the possible targets. It'd be akin to arguing that 3 Threat can be spent to instantly have a character's blaster pistol run out of ammo because the precedent (under your logic) has been set with heavy blaster pistols running dry on the expenditure of 3 Threat.

One other point, is that lightsaber deflection/reflection has always been noted as a skill that has be developed and honed, not something that any Force-sensitive with a ligthsaber in hand can pull off. That's part of why I set this up as a talent for my Jedi Initiate; it's something they have to learn how to do, as well as putting when the effect triggers in the hands of the player character rather than the randomness of a dice roll.

Well, any weapon that is notorious for having a small clip capacity should be able to use those rules, with three threats emptying the clip. Take Disruptor weapons, which in all sources have been hailed for their strength, but have always had low energy reserves as an issue for them. It makes sense, so I'd say go with it. In this particular case, I'd say that someone Despairing while shooting a Jedi or Sith with Sense would make perfect sense.

And it is a skill that has been developed and honed. That development and honing is exactly what the EXP costs for the Defensive Ongoing Power upgrade for Sense are for. Remember, in my interpretation, I wouldn't let people reflect it back unless they were actively upgrading their check with that power. Using the force to sense the attack coming and redirect it back towards the source while using the Sense upgrade seems perfectly logical to me, which is why I consider just including it on that.

I don't hate the talent that you have in your Ways of the Force supplement. It is just that I don't think that should be the only way to obtain it, and I don't think that it needs to be in a talent tree. I don't feel like only martial heavy Jedi Guardian-like people should be able to reflect blaster bolts, since it is a force-heavy talent that most Lightsaber-toting force users can develop before too long. I mean, look at Luke. One of the first things he learned was to deflect blaster fire from his remote trainer.

I don't hate the talent that you have in your Ways of the Force supplement. It is just that I don't think that should be the only way to obtain it, and I don't think that it needs to be in a talent tree. I don't feel like only martial heavy Jedi Guardian-like people should be able to reflect blaster bolts, since it is a force-heavy talent that most Lightsaber-toting force users can develop before too long. I mean, look at Luke. One of the first things he learned was to deflect blaster fire from his remote trainer.

The only thing Luke did in that seen was defend himself, something that's easily covered by the Sense power's Control Upgrade to increase the difficulty of incoming attacks, and can be obtained by a starting PC without much problem (so long as they're willing to pay the XP cost). Mechanically speaking, any attack that fails to hit a character that's wielding a lightsaber could be described as being harmlessly deflected away.

The thing is, the only people we see routinely reflecting blaster fire back at the enemy are the Jedi, with the combat-heavy Jedi types being especially good at it. Luke wasn't doing that until Return of the Jedi, when he was a Jedi Knight in all but name. So if you want to use Luke as an example, then your logic for allowing just anyone to pull of redirecting a blaster attack falls completely flat as it took him a lot of training in order to pull off that trick. The kind of training that a talent would reflect.

Even going outside the movies, the two categories of people that we see consistently redirecting blaster fire (which is the main thing the OP was curious about in case you forgot) were Jedi and the Sith, the latter of whom only because they'd incorporated Jedi fighting arts into their teachings. Asajj Ventress had both Jedi and Sith training, explaining why she could do it without being a Jedi proper.

Just allowing any Force-sensitive prat to pick up a lightsaber after having never seen it before and start redirecting a blaster shot into their foes is well outside the established Star Wars lore. Like I said earlier, simply deflecting them is already covered via narrative descriptions of a failed attack roll.

I think Mr. Morningfire has a valid point here not every Jedi is redirecting a bunch of bolts back at their targets, but I do like the simplicity of Endrik's solution as well.

I think it should probably be pointed out that I don't think Endrik's (or my for that matter) intent was to let just anyone who was force sensitive and happened to have a light saber reflect a bolt back at an attacker. I know my thought was this would require lightsaber skill to actually use. The RAW, of course, doesn't include this skill. If a GM is allowing it I assume they are requiring the player to go to some lengths to obtain it. They are probably getting trained by a Jedi, who else could teach them?

So lets assume that no-one is saying every FSE can automatically reflect blaster bolts simply with the sense power.

That being said, I think it is reasonable to have some talent required to reflect (not deflect) blaster bolts. I wouldn't think it would need to be super expensive if you used the despair mechanic as presented. Say 5-10 points.

And a large reason that we have only seen Jedi or Sith reflect blaster bolts is because most important Force Users have been Jedi or Sith, and Lightsabers are the weapon of the Jedi and Sith specifically. Other people can use them, but most of the time, it is the Jedi and Sith.

I completely see where you are coming from with all of your points, and they are entirely valid. But having the invested experience into that Sense power gives a 1/12th chance of getting a despair, so it is hardly a simple thing to do. But, I feel like the experience investment to make it a truly effective thing to do is high enough where I'll probably just do it that way, to make it simpler on me and on my group than making an extra competitive check once per round. But I completely condone the way that you are doing it because I feel like it would be rewarding in an entirely different way than mine.

Nonetheless, I'm eager to see how they handle this inevitably when they reach F&D.